Podcast does not refresh after a feed url change

Question

Level 1

4 points

Podcast does not refresh after a feed url change

I just changed my podcast feed url. I am able to subscribe to it using the new url, but my existing subscriptions don't connect.
I tried subscribing using the old url and I get the same 8006 I get when I try to update the podcast: "please check that the url is correct". Somehow iTunes cannot reach the old url even though it looks from the information below that it should.

I moved the feed from
http://nycskeptics.org/feeds/rs.xml
to:
http://nycskeptics.org/storage/feeds/rs.xml
Using a 301 redirect.
I also added the line
<itunes:new-feed-url> http://nycskeptics.org/storage/feeds/rs.xml</itunes:new-feed-url>

A wget http://nycskeptics.org/feeds/rs.xml
returns:
+HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 301 Moved Permanently+
+Location: /storage/feeds/rs.xml [following]+

And the xml feed looks ok so I know the url is reachable.
feedvalidator looks ok too.

Any ideas?
Thanks

Posted on Jul 22, 2010 6:40 PM

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Answer 1

Jul 22, 2010 11:40 PM in response to BennyPollak

The 'itunes:new-feed-url' tag has done its job properly, and iTunes is as you say now using the new feed and subscribes to it as it should.

The 301 redirect works for browers, entering the old feed URL bounces you on to the new one. However, as you say, attempting to subscribe manually using the old feed URL produces an error.

According to the Apple Tech note which you have obviously studied, the 301 redirect should be working for iTunes: but evidently it isn't. Have you removed the old feed? - obviously with the redirect in place I can't look at it. If you have and you replaced it, iTunes might subscribe to that, but then I don't know how you can move subscribers to the new feed other than putting an announcement in the old feed.

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Answer 2

BennyPollak Author

Level 1

4 points

Jul 23, 2010 6:10 AM in response to Roger Wilmut1

Hi Roger,
Thanks for your reply.
Shouldn't iTunes go to the new feed and find it using the old feed since the 301 is there? It seems that it cannot get to it.
Does this mean that all our current subscribers will have to resubscribe? This is pretty catastrophic. From the documentation it seems that they should be able to.

I can't put an announcement in the old feed since I am redirecting it to the new one.

Thanks

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Answer 3

Jul 23, 2010 8:20 AM in response to BennyPollak

The Apple Tech Note I referred to is ambiguous about the 301 redirect. Firstly it says

You should use the <itunes:new-feed-url> tag described in the iTunes RSS Tags section below. The tag will cause the iTunes Store to be updated with the new feed URL, as well as all iTunes client versions that support podcasting.

That's clear enough. Then it says:

You should set your web server to return an HTTP 301 response and redirect when receiving a request for the old feed. Doing so will cause both the iTunes Store and the most (but not all) iTunes clients that have subscribed to your podcast to pick up the new feed URL.

which implies that the iTunes Store recognizes the 301 redirect. Then it says:

The <itunes:new-feed-url> tag will work for iTS and all versions of the iTunes client that support podcasting. *The 301 redirect will work for most of your subscribers who do not use the iTunes client.* We recommend that you use both methods to update the greatest possible number of subscribers with your new feed URL.

(my emphasis) - which implies that iTunes doesn't recognize the 301 redirect. Note however that it also says:

Be sure to maintain the <itunes:new-feed-url< tag and the 301 redirect for at least two weeks to ensure that most subscribers have attempted to download your most recent episode and have thereby received the new URL.</div>

So we're now entering the realms of guesswork. My guess is that iTunes doesn't in fact recognize the 301 redirect, and that that is meant for other clients such as Atom: and of course it works for browsers.

The Store itself has picked up the tag and is working off the new feed, including if you use the 'subscribe' button. However if you try to subscribe manually, you get an error, from which I would assume that a) the redirect isn't being recognized, and b) you've removed the original feed.

My assumption is therefore that people who have already subscribed in iTunes will be directed to the new feed from the old feed's 'itunes:new-feed-url' tag (but not from the 301 redirect), but of course only when they next check the feed. If the old feed isn't there they won't be able to redirect. This is why the Tech Note tells you to leave the old feed in place for two weeks.

So you need to restore the old feed, complete with the redirect tag, and give it all time.

Incidentally the new feed also contains the 'itunes:new-feed-url', containing its own URL - this isn't doing any harm, but it's obviously redundant and could do with being removed.

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Answer 4

BennyPollak Author

Level 1

4 points

Jul 23, 2010 9:21 AM in response to Roger Wilmut1

The odd part is that having the old feed AND the 301 are inconsistent. Once you put the 301 you no longer have access to the old one.
It's pretty clear that the Itunes client cannot handle the 301. Hopefully it will "learn" what the new one is from the new-feed-url. They should say in the documentation that you should put the tag in, wait 2 weeks, and only then put the 301, and then only for the benefit of other clients.

What we'll have to do is revert the old feed (which for us is a nightmare because we'll have to put back our old website with an old ISP!) and put there both feeds, with the new-feed-url tag. Then we'll wait a couple of refresh cycles to make sure. Then, hopefully the clients will be updated.

Thanks

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Answer 5

Jul 23, 2010 10:13 AM in response to BennyPollak

What we'll have to do is revert the old feed (which for us is a nightmare because we'll have to put back our old website with an old ISP!) and put there both feeds, with the new-feed-url tag. Then we'll wait a couple of refresh cycles to make sure. Then, hopefully the clients will be updated.

Not quite sure what you mean here, but you need to leave the new feed well alone (remember the iTunes Store is using it quite happily) but place the old feed where it was, including the redirect tag. Probably that's what you meant.

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Answer 6

BennyPollak Author

Level 1

4 points

Jul 24, 2010 9:38 AM in response to Roger Wilmut1

I think I now figured it all out. The iTunes client does not understand the 301 redirect.
The process should be (and I don't think it's well documented).
1. Put the tag pointing to the new url in the feed.xml.
2. Put the feed.xml in the old and the new url
3. Wait a couple of weeks (if you can!), until all the iTunes clients have refreshed ones. At this point all subscriptions will be pointing to the new url.
4. The most important part is, you cannot remove the old feed until the ITS clients have had a chance to read the feed that contains the redirect.
5. Apparently, from my experience, ITS cannot get to a feed via a 301 redirect. So, once you think most subscribed have ad a chance to read the redirect, then, move to the new url.
6. Put the 301 redirect, but not for already subscribed clients. You've lost them at this point.

The odd thing is that the iTunes store DOES know how to read 301 redirected urls. Why doesn't iTunes?

One more thing that may be useful anybody out there that runs into this:
To test whether the redirect is correct, do this:
1. Before uploading the feed with the new-url, go to the podcast entry in your iTunes podcast page. Right-click on it and "Copy podcast URL." It should be the old url.
2. Upload the feed with the new-url tag.
3. Refresh the podcasts in iTunes.
4. Copy podcast URL." It should now point to the new url.

Thanks for your help Roger.

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Answer 7

Jul 24, 2010 10:13 AM in response to BennyPollak

Your deductions sound about correct, though I'm not sure how quickly the Store page will react to the new-feed-url - since it can take 1-2 days for new episodes to show it might well take that long. It's obviously not something I can test. But in any case, as you say, you have to maintain the old feed for long enough for subscribers to update.

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Answer 8

Sep 15, 2010 7:58 PM in response to BennyPollak

PLS where do I redirect or change my podcast feed url. I can not find the page where I'm suppose to do it. is it in the itunes store or on the web or.....!!??

PLS help!!! thx

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Answer 9

Sep 16, 2010 12:57 AM in response to techno skandal

The process is described here:
http://www.apple.com/itunes/podcasts/specs.html#changing

Note that you will need access to the existing feed in order to add the redirection tag to it, and that you should leave the old feed in place for around 2 weeks to give everyone a chance to catch up.

The page also suggests a '301' redirect: this isn't relevant to iTunes, only to other feed readers, so you may feel able to ignore it.

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