Questions about APFS

I'm using Seagate Backup Plus Portable for time machine. I had to reformat to my to APFS. Under my disk utility it shows used and other volumes one I don't see the other volumes or any files on the external, is this normal? (print screen below)

Also, my other question should I allow APFS to be case sensitive or not. It looks when I reformatted it went automatically to case sensitive.

This is my first time using APFS so I'm not to familiar with it.


MacBook Pro 15″, macOS 11.1

Posted on Jan 23, 2021 2:56 AM

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Posted on Jan 23, 2021 5:11 AM

Haylie Wiggins wrote:

I'm using Seagate Backup Plus Portable for time machine. I had to reformat to my to APFS. Under my disk utility it shows used and other volumes one I don't see the other volumes or any files on the external, is this normal? (print screen below)
Also, my other question should I allow APFS to be case sensitive or not. It looks when I reformatted it went automatically to case sensitive.
This is my first time using APFS so I'm not to familiar with it.


https://discussions.apple.com/content/attachment/aeac0558-35e7-454b-b0f3-e4b87aecdbdc


That all looks normal.


I never choose case sensitive, just a personal preference. Unless you have some compelling reason I would suggest not case sensitive. Think about... if you are searching for an item, you would have to the case just right or miss it if searching, etc..


ex. APFS (Case-sensitive): Uses the APFS format and is case-sensitive to file and folder names. For example, folders named “Homework” and “HOMEWORK” are two different folders.


All volumes share space within the Container. You can add or delete Volumes in this shared space. 577.9MB is next to nothing, so 'administrative' formatting or some such...


You can get a better look from the Terminal.app a break down if you are curious about trying to see "Other Volumes" here


copy and paste:

diskutil list external



Add, delete, or erase APFS volumes in Disk Utility on Mac ...


Erase and reformat a storage device in Disk Utility on Mac ...

File system formats available in Disk Utility on Mac - Apple ...













8 replies
Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Jan 23, 2021 5:11 AM in response to Haylie Wiggins

Haylie Wiggins wrote:

I'm using Seagate Backup Plus Portable for time machine. I had to reformat to my to APFS. Under my disk utility it shows used and other volumes one I don't see the other volumes or any files on the external, is this normal? (print screen below)
Also, my other question should I allow APFS to be case sensitive or not. It looks when I reformatted it went automatically to case sensitive.
This is my first time using APFS so I'm not to familiar with it.


https://discussions.apple.com/content/attachment/aeac0558-35e7-454b-b0f3-e4b87aecdbdc


That all looks normal.


I never choose case sensitive, just a personal preference. Unless you have some compelling reason I would suggest not case sensitive. Think about... if you are searching for an item, you would have to the case just right or miss it if searching, etc..


ex. APFS (Case-sensitive): Uses the APFS format and is case-sensitive to file and folder names. For example, folders named “Homework” and “HOMEWORK” are two different folders.


All volumes share space within the Container. You can add or delete Volumes in this shared space. 577.9MB is next to nothing, so 'administrative' formatting or some such...


You can get a better look from the Terminal.app a break down if you are curious about trying to see "Other Volumes" here


copy and paste:

diskutil list external



Add, delete, or erase APFS volumes in Disk Utility on Mac ...


Erase and reformat a storage device in Disk Utility on Mac ...

File system formats available in Disk Utility on Mac - Apple ...













Jan 23, 2021 7:36 AM in response to Haylie Wiggins

A couple of things...


Time Machine does use a case sensitive format. This is because if you were trying to backup volumes that did happen to be case sensitive, you would need a case sensitive backup. Since case sensitive is always the safe option, that's what Time Machine uses. Case insensitive formats are only a convenience for users who frequently mis-type things. Sometimes they cause problems too.


Otherwise, everything looks like it is working properly. One thing you have to remember is that the fancy, windowed user interface on your Mac is not truthful. That's just being polite, it lies to you constantly. The macOS operating system is the most complicated operating system ever made and its gets more complex every year. It is no exaggeration to say that people sometimes lose touch of reality when they start digging into the internals. I have seen that happen here on the forums many times. So, the user interface tries to give you a simplified view. By default, it hides certain locations that the average user doesn't need to see or would likely just confuse them.


If you want to learn more about those internals, you would have to start using the Terminal. Some places are even hidden from the Terminal, although there are ways to reveal them. Even then, absolutely no part of the system is documented in any way. So if you did have questions, the best anyone could do for you is educated guesses.


And to pile on a bit, Big Sur has changed the behaviour of Time Machine. If you create a new Time Machine volume on Big Sur, as you have done, then it creates it using the APFS file system using new logic. But anyone who already had a Time Machine volume has one that runs under the old HFS+ file system. Therefore, most of the people who really know how Time Machine works through years of working with it are now unfamiliar with the new system. Chances are, they are like me and still have the old version. They have never even seen the new APFS Time Machine.


By all accounts, everything seem to be working on your computer. You can double check this by following leroydouglas's instructions to "Enter Time Machine". This will display the "star field" interface. (It actually hasn't been a "star field" for years, but what else to call it?) If you can navigate backwards in time and see changes in files, and restore old versions, then everything is working properly. You can restore an old version alongside the current version. It will automatically rename the old version and you can compare differences.

Jan 23, 2021 6:43 AM in response to Haylie Wiggins

Haylie Wiggins wrote:

I know, but I'm saying shouldn't the backup show on the external as well. Because when I double click the external on the desktop and enter time machine I don't see anything. But when I enter time machine from the hidden volume folder it shows me it.


ref: Connect a new backup disk to your Mac

https://support.apple.com/guide/mac-help/connect-a-new-backup-disk-mh11430/11.0/mac/11.0


If you hold the Option key while clicking TM icon in the upper right menu bar— you can see other ** disk if you are using them for TM



There should be no reason to click open the TM hard drive other than a cursory look see or the Finder.



Local snap shots are stored on your Macintosh HD until they are moved to the TM backup.

About Time Machine local snapshots - Apple Support


Jan 23, 2021 6:34 AM in response to Haylie Wiggins

Haylie Wiggins wrote:

Thank you for the reply. I do have another question, is when it was backing up on my seagate it wasn't showing the in progress like I'm used to. In fact I can't even see any time machine files is this normal? Where do I see the time machine folder on the external. Because it appears to be on my mac and not the external
https://discussions.apple.com/content/attachment/806a2374-ad32-4d24-86ea-b4620d10c2a5


The way to interact with TM is through the TM interface—from the icon in the upper right menubar



Not the Finder....which is a good way of corrupting the complex data base, if you start deleting files etc


Let TM manage it's own database—



The main advantage of TM is that it creates recursive backups—enabling you to restore a specific file or the entire drive— from a certain point in time. It a complex with a lot of magic sprinkled in, and micro-management is not advised.



Back up your Mac with Time Machine - Apple Support


Jan 24, 2021 2:49 AM in response to Haylie Wiggins

Thank you all for the replies.

I ended up reaching out to apple support.

I didn't know about this about APFS because unless I completely read of it didn't see it anywhere. But I had just be patient for it finish backing up to show on my external. I wasn't used to this since this was my first time dealing with APFS. Since I was on Mojave and all my externals were Mac OS Extended (Journaled).

I know now this now. I do love APFS since it backs up so much faster then Mac OS Extended (Journaled)

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