11 Replies Latest reply: Aug 8, 2010 10:50 PM by K Shaffer
momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
Hopefully this is the right section to post question.
I can't seem to get Expose to work - I've downloaded and installed the Microsoft Intellitype software - but I can't get the function keys set up the way I want when I go into System Preferences - Keyboard. I've tried enabling and disabling intellitype and various combinations and permutions but can't get the Expose functions - all windows, show desktop, etc to work. The mute and volume buttons work but within Intellitype I can't set up the My Favorites buttons either. Any links to good instructions - I haven't been able to find any good help via a Google search.
I am wondering if I perhaps need to delete a plist file somewhere to enable me to re-set things - but I can't find where this might be located. Thanks.

2009 iMac 2.66 Ghz, 4MB RAM, Mac OS X (10.5.8)
  • K Shaffer Level 6 Level 6 (11,540 points)
    In some third-party installed software to support hardware or add extra
    features to the system, another System Preference panel is installed in
    the section in there, under Other. Is there a chance a second keyboard
    control panel or other access for that Microsoft Keyboard is elsewhere?

    I would doubt the Microsoft keyboard software would overwrite the OS X
    main System Preference files; and I would sincerely hope it can't. If the
    MS software you installed has an Uninstall feature, perhaps you need to
    do that, and then try to re-install it. Then repair disk permissions and a
    restart of the computer, may help. Or, a magic chant with lit incense?

    Maybe there is a support forum at Microsoft to help Mac users who like
    and use their products. While some don't need them, others either have
    to use them, or like some features MS has offered to a degree of success.

    Good luck & happy computing!
  • momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Yes there is a second keyboard control panel under "Other" for the Microsoft Keyboard. It does seem to be able to override the System Pref keyboard settings - but I"m not sure how it works. I uninstalled and reinstalled the MS keyboard software - haven't repaired permissions yet. Maybe I'll try that.

    By the way, Apple does't make an ergonomic keyboard - you are stuck with the piece of crap keyboards that Apple issues which have limited functionality and are hard on the wrists. That is why I'm using the Microsoft Ergonomic 4000, the biggest selling ergonomic keyboard in the Mac community. My older Adesso ergonomic keyboard died recently and I had to replace it with this one.

    Again, does anybody have specific experience with this situation? Generalized suggestions are fine and I appreciate that but I'm hoping to find someone who has used the MS Intellitype software. I might add that I tried disabling the MS keyboard software and still can't get the Mac keyboard Expose to work - so I don't know what is going on. Many mac users more knowledgeable than I have purchased this keyboard and gotten it to work .. I hope!
  • Kurt Lang Level 8 Level 8 (35,465 points)
    I use the MS 4000 keyboard, too. I can't stand any type of straight keyboard, no matter who makes it. While I normally have Exposé disabled, I checked it just now and it works fine with this keyboard.

    Check the Microsoft Keyboard tool in the System Preferences. By default, F1 through F15 should all be mark "Handled by Mac OS". If those are correct, check the Keyboard preferences. Click on the Keyboard Shortcuts tab. Click on Exposé & Spaces in the left column. In the resulting right column, turn on the check box by "Exposé" to activate the three default F key designations.

    If you've done all this and it's still not working, then you may have another application set to use those same keys, and so are conflicting with the OS. Also, make sure the FLock key (to the right of the F12 key) is OFF. Otherwise they keyboard is trying to do a Send, Spell or Save instead of sending the key codes for F9, 10 or 11.
  • momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Kurt - THANK YOU! I'm closer to getting this resolved. You know, for some reason, the FLock key - when the light is ON - that is when the default F9,F10, and F11 keys for expose work! I had been keeping it unlit -which I thought was OFF. Anyway, then FLock indicator on the bottom of the keyboard is lit, the expose default buttons do work! Yeah - that is progress! I'll test some of the other keys to see if I can customize them. WOW - I though there was a major corruption and that as you said that some other app was overriding the settings here. I'll report back soon on customizing the other buttons. - Derek
    PS - sorry you are stuck with only 14 gigs of ram!
  • Kurt Lang Level 8 Level 8 (35,465 points)
    You know, for some reason, the FLock key - when the light is ON - that is when the default F9,F10, and F11 keys for expose work!


    That's weird, since that's backwards. Not quite sure what you'd do to reverse it. Also apologies, I was giving instructions based on Snow Leopard's System Preferences. I know they aren't laid out the same in Leopard. But it sounds like you figured your way through them.

    PS - sorry you are stuck with only 14 gigs of ram!


    Heh, heh! Well, I use Photoshop 8 hours a day for my in home job working on large files. So with CS5 being 64 bit, I assigned 9 GB just to it, which greatly speeds up filters and everything else. That still leaves plenty of room for other large apps (Quark, InDesign, Illustrator) to run without having to page out to disk. I see you have yours marked 4 MB, but that has to be 4 GB.
  • momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Kurt - Confirming that I tested the "My Favorites" and customizing of the other function keys and everything is working great now! And most importantly, Expose works - I can't work without the Expose! And the light for the FLOCK does seem to work in reverse. The CAP LOCKS are indeed on when lighted - so the FLOCK seems to be the only one that is BACKWARDS. To be honest I don't know what the other two indicator lights are for on the Erg 4000 keyboard so I couldn't quickly test them - if you have a quick insight it would be appreciated. I really like the feel of this keyboard - much better than the Adesso - more comfortable and feels more solid. I don't know who people use the junk stock Apple keyboards - or any of the high end flat ones for that matter. Their wrists will suffer for it someday.

    So all is well. Thanks again for the helpful tip. Thanks for answering my question specifically. You know I made another post a week or so ago (re Yahoo domains- admittedly an indirect non specific Apple question - having to do with using iWeb and Mobile Me) and THAT TIME ALSO a couple of people chimed in with GENERIC RESPONSES THAT DIDN'T ANSWER THE QUESTION. I appreciate all the great people helping people out on this forum - it is a great community. But is there a trend going on in this regard on this forum? Because people should only answer if they have specific experience with that particular issue - expecially if is referring to outside hardware or software. Do you know what I mean?
    (Yes 4GB stock RAM configuration - did not notice until that I had mislabeled it. Have not upgraded to Snow Leopard - I don't feel the need to do it yet.) Best regards- Derek
  • Kurt Lang Level 8 Level 8 (35,465 points)
    To be honest I don't know what the other two indicator lights are for on the Erg 4000 keyboard so I couldn't quickly test them - if you have a quick insight it would be appreciated.


    From top to bottom (they also have matching symbols on the keys they're for):

    Num Lock
    Caps Lock
    Scroll Lock
    F Lock

    Num Lock and Scroll Lock both do nothing in the Mac OS. There are no such keys on an Apple keyboard, so there is no association to those keys in the OS itself.

    I don't know who people use the junk stock Apple keyboards - or any of the high end flat ones for that matter. Their wrists will suffer for it someday.


    For those who have never used an ergo keyboard before, they feel very odd at first. You get so used to pulling your elbows in to your side to get your hands and wrists straight to the keyboard that you don't consciously realize how much you're straining 100% of the time to hold that position. The ergo keyboard lets you just move your hands to the keys, and they fall right under your fingers. What feels odd to new users coming from straight boards is having to remember NOT to pull in their elbows. Let them relax and your hands fall into place.

    But is there a trend going on in this regard on this forum? Because people should only answer if they have specific experience with that particular issue - expecially if is referring to outside hardware or software. Do you know what I mean?


    Mmm, yes. But at least the attempts are will intentioned. The obvious suggestions are to check the keyboard settings in the System Preferences and Exposé. While they may not have the keyboard, a person who does may not have thought to look there, rather than only the Microsoft Keyboard panel. There are times when I have somewhat blindly made suggestions that got the person who started the post to rethink how they were approaching the problem. While my suggestion was a bit generic, it turned on a light in their thought process and they looked where they hadn't thought to before, and fixed the problem. So sometimes even a somewhat vague response is better than none. But yes, it is always best if the person who answers can actually look at the same hardware/software.
  • momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Kurt - no, your suggestion was super specific - from someone who has used the MS Ergonomic Keyboard and who has used the Intellitype software before. My Adesso keyboard did not have an FLOCK function and I didn't have experience in this area - there were no instructions anywhere I saw about how to set the FLOCK - plus mine is reversed to boot.

    Sure the other responses was well intentioned and appreciated (though the other one was a little snarky and dismissive of everything Microsoft - which I can sympathize with but didn't answer my question) - but your response was ++very helpful++ because you have experience with the specific problem I am asking about. A response of "uninstall and reinstall the software" and "repair permissions" is of course accurate but does not address the issue at hand. Sorry to quibble - I love the forum and the great people contributing - but sometimes I have noticed that people chime in when they really don't have any experience with the problem- and that is new to me - I haven't seen this kind of behavior before.
  • Kurt Lang Level 8 Level 8 (35,465 points)
    Kurt - no, your suggestion was super specific - from someone who has used the MS Ergonomic Keyboard and who has used the Intellitype software before.


    From me, yes, since I can directly test the same thing. I just meant others who want to try and be helpful as best they can.

    The main problem of any tech forums such as this is logistics. Let's say there are 100,000 users of MS 4000 keyboards with their Macs. I would bet less than 50% of them are even aware of these forums. Cut that number by a large part again of users who know these forums exist, but never come here. Then you're down to those who may see your post. Then they might read it. After that, they might have an inclination to answer.

    But now we're just chatting. Glad to hear your issue is resolved.
  • momomentous Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    yeah - some help is better than no help - take care - over and out
  • K Shaffer Level 6 Level 6 (11,540 points)
    Good to hear your post did get a fair degree of accurate attention,
    and hoped my snarky response won't deter people with MS issues
    from posting in a Discussions forum about non-Mac hardware!

    From having dealt a little with third-party software and hardware
    support, I know about the Other section of System Preferences.
    And, once something gets installed in there, often one of the few
    paths to remove that item, involve an Uninstaller, too.

    And I am glad that Kurt found your post and was able to do so
    before it became a second or third page in the cue; since once
    that happens, few people have time to look back that far.

    Some years ago, I used to have fancy third-party multi-button
    scroll wheel mice and keyboards that did more than I really
    needed; but when one of these original keyboards fail, they
    are easy to replace if one is looking in craigslist ahead of time.

    The older hefty Apple keyboards were quite well made; and I
    have a few of them in the work shed with a PowerMac 7600.

    Hopefully you've gotten the MSE Keyboard 4000 dialed in now;
    and the settings for it should in no way affect how an original kb
    would work, if one suddenly appeared & demanded admittance.

    Good luck & happy computing!