How does location services work on a Mac from a landline?

Whickwithy wrote:

I am wondering

1) where the information regarding location comes from and

On a Mac, it is triangulated from known WiFi access point locations.

An iPhone or cellular capable iPad gets location from both WiFi and cellular tower triangulation. iPhone and iPad location is used to update the WiFi access point database.

2) how it operates. When I say how it operates, I mean, when location services is on, is it stored in each packet? Or, is it a special request that has to be made to the Mac to supply the information?

For when you allow location, it is a special request, hence the ability to control the location data sent. There is nothing in the TCP/IP protocol that transmits location information.

3) When location services are off, what happens? Is the information stripped from any communications? I noticed that they can still tell the state, but I'm uncertain what happens to the rest of the information?

When you don't pass location data, websites use your reported IP address to determine location. They lookup your IP in the IP registration database. Depending on your ISP, that location could be hundreds or thousands of miles away.

With IP Private Relay, you can set the scope of what IP address Apple reports. It can be regional or just within the country and time zone.

Whickwithy wrote:

Here's the problem with the wi-fi location. It came from my landline modem and I am not in a wi-fi service area like might be suspected in the middle of a big city. If anyone out here has wi-fi, it is through there landline modem.

The location did not arise from the landline.

A landline has a location within the databases of the carriers, though that landline and that cellular location data is not openly served remotely. (Likely not without either payments made to the carrier as various landline and cellular carriers will collect and sell customer location data, or not without a warrant for governmental data inquiries, or not without a carrier data security breach.)

An ISP does provide a location for an IP address, though I'm aware of no ISP that provides a precise location for an IP address, due to the added cost of serving a precise location, and due to the risk of misuse of that location data. Arguably, IP geolocation is "accurate" if it's in the same country.

The location for the Wi-Fi network (behind a DSL modem, or behind a dial-up modem, or behind a ONI, or whatever) is what is typically acquired from a GPS-equipped or cellular-equipped device. This device connecting to and reporting the location of the Wi-Fi network to Apple or Google or other vendors, though Wi-Fi networks locations are also acquired through a process known as "wardriving". (Wardialing was how folks found dial-up modems, but dial-up modems have become less common in recent decades.)

As an example, Google Street View was wardriving a while back, and was also collecting open network traffic; unencrypted network data.

This "wardriving" works the other way, too. Various fixed-location local networks will also routinely detect and log drive-by Wi-Fi networks located in vehicles. It's feasible to detect scheduling patterns in this data, too.

Geolocating Wi-Fi devices is a requirement in certain areas, as different channels and power outputs can be legally required in specific areas. Details here vary by country, and vary over time.

There are various private and public lists of Wi-Fi network locations, as well. Very few folks use the _nomap naming, too.

TL;DR: Usual means for geolocation used by a Mac is indirect; via a connected Wi-Fi, and after that Wi-Fi network has been located via a connected iPhone or iPad. Mac lacks explicit GPS or other positioning hardware, and thus infers its location.

You’re seemingly conflating an analog telephone network and a digital network. That doesn’t happen with a landline until and unless you have VoIP service from your carrier, or ilk. That’s moved it all over to digital; to IP.

And once you’re over to IP, the IP geolocation is provided via the carrier.

The Wi-Fi network geolocation is via means discussed above; via connected devices with geolocation and reporting capabilities, or drive-by, etc.

Wi-Fi geolocation does not necessarily give you IP geolocation over an arbitrary time, nor does IP give you Wi-Fi, as most US residential ISP services will vary the public IP address over time; what’s called dynamic or DHCP addressing. US static addressing services are generally more expensive, and tend to be used by businesses and organizations and by relatively fewer individuals.

This use of dynamic IP addresses is also the basis for the longstanding practice of rebooting your router to try to get around certain types of transient network blocks, and routing issues. Residential routers can get a different public IP address from the ISP DHCP server, and the reboot can also clean up whatever mess is lurking in the current router routing tables.

Wi-Fi networks either move around a lot (vehicle-based networks, mostly) or rarely; these networks don’t move around until and unless the network owner moves (residential, business).

Whickwithy wrote:

I am wondering

1) where the information regarding location comes from and

2) how it operates. When I say how it operates, I mean, when location services is on, is it stored in each packet? Or, is it a special request that has to be made to the Mac to supply the information?

3) When location services are off, what happens? Is the information stripped from any communications? I noticed that they can still tell the state, but I'm uncertain what happens to the rest of the information?

landline...(?)

Allow apps to detect the location of your Mac - Apple Support

Control the location information you share on iPhone

Whickwithy wrote:

Wow! Don't I love a thorough answer.

To what? I don't understand what you are asking. Considering the below responses, you seem to suffering from some serious misunderstandings.

I guess my own conclusion is this (I'd love to try Apple Maps with my location turned on to confirm but, no thank you. That would be kinda like closing the barn door after, well, you get the picture).

Apple location services is perfectly safe. The only person it tells your location to is you. If you keep it turned off, you are the person being denied a location. If you want more details and enjoy reading long blocks of text, you can read more here: Legal - Location Services & Privacy - Apple

Google could have picked up on my address in some unknown manner that was so long ago I could never pinpoint it.

It is comforting to know that there is nothing going over the lines that reveals my location.

That is something completely different than location services. Any interactions you have with Apple and Apple products is governed by Apple's privacy policies. Those polices ensure that your information is protected and not distributed in a way that can be used to personally identify you.

Any non-Apple products you might use like Google, or anything else, is completely separate and has nothing to do with Apple Location Services. Those companies probably do have your address. They track your location, and all of your intimate details quite closely.

As far as I can tell here, you have it completely backwards. Turn on Location Services so you can get the full benefit of Apple Maps. Do a lot more research on how your personal information is being used, sold, shared, and otherwise distributed by other, non-Apple companies.

Asked and answered in extensive detail:

How does Safari zero in on the location on the location of a landline - Apple Community

A landline telephone is not related to your Mac in any way. Its location is known to the telephone service provider, and it can be correlated by to your location through any number of non-Apple services you may wish to use. Lacking your voluntary consent to those services, your Mac and Location Services alone are useless in determining its location.

Usual means used by a Mac is indirect; via a connected Wi-Fi, and after that Wi-Fi network has been located via a connected iPhone or iPad.

FWIW, location services would work even if you had no landline phone. As already stated, landline phones have nothing to do with location services.

Whickwithy wrote:

Location services have no value with a landline. !

Location serves will work if you have a land line or not. It's depending on the WiFi you use. I had a land line in our old house and could locate our house exactly.

We have no land line in our new house and it's location is determined exactly also.

It's useful to have Location services turned on so Apple's Maps or Google Maps can easily determine driving routes between you and any destination you choose.