User profile for user: Ringmaster
Ringmaster Author
User level: Level 1
8 points

Rip as .wav, Backup .wav, restore .wav

I have tried to use another program reconstruct my Music Library, but it does not support all of the tagging features that is available in the iTunes program, for .wav files. I have deleted all previous .wav files, Albums & Artists files.

I used iTunes for quite some time under Windows "Vista", and I really liked the program. Even though I did back up my original Library, I did not have any reason to do a restoration, until I installed "Windows 7"; I was not aware of the process of deleting my iTunes Library, prior to installing "Windows 7". However, I tried restoring the backup that I had maintained under the "Vista" program, and I screwed up my Music Library because the restoration lost all of my .wav tagging layout.

I am using "Windows 7"; and I'm wondering:

I have uninstalled the previous iTunes program, and installed the latest version/revision of the iTunes program. I plan to start Ripping all of my Cd's over again, from "scratch", to a new iTunes Library, using the .wav format. Does anyone really know if I can Rip all of my files using the .wav tagging; backup/copy the new Library files to another external drive, retaining the .wav format with the tagging intact and Restore the .wav files with all of the associated tagging features that was in the same columnar layout that the original iTunes Library contained? In all of the reading I've done, something makes me feel that I will lose the columnar layout in the process, and I won't know how to repair the restored files, to bring them back to the originally ripped .wav columnar format.

If it is determined that I cannot do this, do you have any suggestions that would help me accomplish creating my Music Library, including the possibility that I may have to use another format that retains the PCM data? Storage is no problem for me, because I have two 1.5 Tb, and two 950 Gb drives, in addition to my separate computer "C" & "D" drives.

The reason I need to keep PCM files, is because I do Vinyl record restoration using the "Diamond Cut 8 Live" restoration program. that processes in the .wav format; and I will be transferring files between the two programs.

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Intel, Windows 7, Core 2 CPU @2.66GHz; 2.67GHz, 3.25 GB of RAM

Posted on Aug 17, 2010 4:53 AM

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27 replies
User profile for user: turingtest2
turingtest2
User level: Level 10
278,351 points

Aug 17, 2010 5:24 AM in response to Ringmaster

Didn't we cover all this over in your other thread?
http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=11991325

.wav files don't have tags. All the information you enter therefore only exists in the iTunes database. You can backup & restore the database & media although you'll need to throughly understand the process to do it properly and if something goes wrong with the database you lose all your hard work.

tt2
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User profile for user: Katrina S.
Katrina S.
User level: Level 7
24,152 points

Aug 17, 2010 6:11 AM in response to Ringmaster

It's true, the itunes info is stored in that database file:
iTunes Library.itl
If you don't copy that from one PC to another, you'll lose a lot of info.



The columns displayed are stored in another file (itunes preferences) but you don't really need to back it up from one PC to another. You just need to click itunes menu > view > view options and check off the columns you want displayed.




edit:
woops. In your other thread you stated
+I had columns for Song Title, Artist, Album, Orchestra, Conductor, Assisting Artist, etc.+
Except some of these columns don't exist in itunes! For example, Orchestra and Assisting Artist.
They exist in Windows Media Player, though....are you sure that isn't what you were using instead of itunes?

Message was edited by: Katrina S.
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User profile for user: Ringmaster
Ringmaster Author
User level: Level 1
8 points

Aug 17, 2010 12:19 PM in response to Katrina S.

Katrina,

Thanks for sticking with me; I've been trying to develop my Library again for several months, and I've gotten weary, and about ready to give up. However, to keep my mind active in an effort to keep dimentia "at bay", I feel that I have to stay involved with more complex stuff.

To be honest with you, I've been fighting "Windows Media" (bullheaded I guess), because I don't believe that I should have to be pressured by Microsoft to use their software; however, to get beyond my present state of confusion perhaps I will have to give in (against my will).

I had approximately 3400 tracks, in my +iTunes program+, set up under Vista, with all of the columnar information I needed, in the .wav format. On classical music, many people are interested in "what orchestra" performed that piece"; and "who was the Conductor". Well, I've never been one to remember data, other than the "Song Title", "Artist, "Band" and conductor (like Woody Herman,Al Hirt, Montavoni & etc.; however, I do like to have the other information available, such as different data mostly related to "Classical" genra for those that do. I really like all genre, except "Jazz" (if I cannot pull out a tune to whistle along with, I don't like it); also, "Rap" many times has a great beat, but if I can't determine the words, I am not interested.

When I downloaded "Windows 7" I did not know that my Library would be compromised; and, of course my backup files were also corrupted, when I tried to do a "Restoration". This made my friends crazy trying to help me figure out how I could manage to create such a mess; they just "shook their heads" and walked away.

Do you have the expertise to help me get started with the "Windows Media" format; and does that program has a Codec to keep me in the .wav domain; if not, the program should at least allow me process PCM files, that I (think) are recorded in the same lossless format as .wav. It seems like I should be able to use the PCM format for my "Diamond Cut" restoration; or, at least allow me to convert to .wav, and convert back to PCM when I transfer my final restoration back to my Library.

If you are familiar with "Windows Media", could you give me "step-by-step" instructions to accomplish what I am trying to do?

I don't feel comfortable using this "Topic" on the iTunes Forum. I would be glad to give you my Email address, if you would prefer to communicate off the Forum.

Thanks for your persistance and cooperation,

John Anderson
Abingdon, MD
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User profile for user: turingtest2
turingtest2
User level: Level 10
278,351 points

Aug 17, 2010 12:38 PM in response to Ringmaster

Hi John,

You have the same problem with Windows Media Player with regards to data being held in the database and not embedded in the tags, however the backup & recovery of the WMP database is even more obscure than that for iTunes.

I'd stongly recommend that you opt for any other lossless format than .wav, e.g. Apple Lossless or .AIF.

As long as you organise your files inside the main iTunes folder, backing up an iTunes library is simply a matter of copying everything in that folder to another location.

*Fast backup for iTunes library (Windows Only)*
Grab SyncToy 2.1, a free tool from MS. This can be used to copy your entire iTunes library (& other important data folders) onto another hard drive or network share. You can then use SyncToy periodically to synchronise or echo your library to the backup. A preview will show which files need to be updated giving you a chance to spot unexpected changes and during the run only the new or updated files will be copied saving lots of time. And if your media is all organised below the main iTunes folder then you should also be able to open the backup library on any system running the same version of iTunes.

tt2
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User profile for user: Katrina S.
Katrina S.
User level: Level 7
24,152 points

Aug 17, 2010 12:58 PM in response to Ringmaster

Sorry, John, I don't know WMP well enough. I know itunes a lot better and I'm positive you weren't seeing any column named "Band" or "Orchestra" in itunes.
You can look at the view columns choices yourself - "Orchestra" simply isn't there.



Since every Windows PC has WMP installed, I took a quick look at it. WMP does have two custom columns available, so I thought perhaps you'd changed them to Orchestra and Band and were using WMP instead of itunes - at least some of the time.



You can rip wav files with either program, but it is still the same issue when you move WAV files to another PC: You have to also move the database file for the program. WAV files don't hold all this info in the actual song file. The jukebox software holds this info in its database file.
For itunes, it's name is iTunes Library.itl
For WMP, it's name is CurrentDatabase_372.wmdb and the folder for it is user_name\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Media Player





My advice is to start small with just about few tracks in either program, creating a small library of WAV files. Perhaps a few songs from 3 or 4 albums to start. Test your restore plan to another PC and make sure you have it perfect before ripping all your 3000+ tracks again.



Good luck!
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User profile for user: ed2345
ed2345
User level: Level 9
63,632 points

Aug 17, 2010 5:27 PM in response to Ringmaster

Ringmaster wrote:
Does anyone really know if I can Rip all of my files using the .wav tagging


If you have a good and sufficient reason for needing WAV, find a better ripping program. iTunes is not a suitable program for ripping to WAV. As my colleagues noted, WAV files do not have any tags, so if you plan to use them in another program, it is essential to include the relevant information in the filename. iTunes does not have the ability; any file it rips can only be named as "track# title".

Use a ripping tool such as Windows Media Player that allows you to control the filename in a more informative format, such as "artist - album - title". When you move the file, the information will be intact without doing anything fancy.
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User profile for user: Ringmaster
Ringmaster Author
User level: Level 1
8 points

Aug 20, 2010 3:18 AM in response to Ringmaster

Katrina,

When I rip to my external 1.5 Tb drive "H" (which is the drive that I use for my iTunes Media (Database) Files. It burns as an ".wav" file; but, when I go to my "H" drive to verify that it did rip properly, I can only find it under "XML". I think you said earlier, that it should burn as an ".itl" file.

Should I be doing anything with "Automatically Add To iTunes"?

Is it possible for you to give me "step-by-step" instructions? It is ripping properly to my "H" drive (which is the drive that I want for my Audio/Music Library Database Files.

Sorry to be such a bother; but I really do appreciate your help. I've been trying to find a fix for my problem for two months, and I'm starting to get discouraged.

Also, do I want to "Organize my Library"; I think I read that I should NOT use this feature?

You may copy my question, and answer right under the copied question; it makes it a little easier for me to decipher.

Thanks again,

John
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User profile for user: Ringmaster
Ringmaster Author
User level: Level 1
8 points

Aug 20, 2010 3:41 AM in response to Ringmaster

Is there a way that I can send a "screenshot" of my window as it's burning the CD, and another one of the iTunes "Database" as it appears (I do have a column for "Composer"; but, you are right....I do not have the dropdown that will allow me to include the "Conductor".

The columns that show, when I am burning, are the 5 columns that I mentioned earlier; however, when I open my iTunes Library, there are additional columns for "Composer" (when I burn a classical CD, this column lists the "Composer"). It also shows the "Sample Rate", "Bit Rate" and "Kind" (Wave File). these are the colums that I have elected to appear in my Library "drop-down".
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User profile for user: turingtest2
turingtest2
User level: Level 10
278,351 points

Aug 20, 2010 4:18 AM in response to Ringmaster

Ringmaster wrote:
I have a problem: When I download and save SyncToy 2.1; I try to "Run" the program, and I get the notice "SyncToy is not a valid Win 32 application".

Use the link that reads SyncToySetupPackagev21x86.exe for the 32-bit download. If you still get an error, delete the donwloaded file that you have already, clear your internet browser cache and try downloading again.

tt2
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Rip as .wav, Backup .wav, restore .wav

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