I like using security keys as it keeps the "what you have" separate from the phone. However, if someone snatched my phone while I was using it, it would be unlocked, and they could remove the security keys, which would lock me out of my iCloud account since I have 2FA enabled.
Sounds like a good idea, but the best place to suggest something to Apple is here→Product Feedback - Apple
This is a user-to-user forum, with minimal Apple participation.
However, the LAST thing you want to do is remove the phone from your account, because that disables Activation Lock. What you should do is lock the phone and erase it.
However, you can protect both your trusted numbers and security keys in the scenario you describe. It is explained in the link that I provided→Secure your iPhone against passcode hijac… - Apple Community. By interesting coincidence, that tip was created today by LD150 in response to a similar vulnerability. In case you didn’t read it, do the following (copied from that link):
In order to limit what a thief can do inside your phone even with passcode you can utilise Screen Time to prevent access to account and passcode changes in the same way that you may restrict a child, and the key is to use a different passcode than that of your phone itself
Without that screen Time passcode nobody can see your Apple ID and cannot make any changes to password, or set a Recovery key which is the ultimate lock-out.
And I might add they also can’t get to your security key or trusted device settings.
Sounds like a good idea, but the best place to suggest something to Apple is here→Product Feedback - Apple
This is a user-to-user forum, with minimal Apple participation.
However, the LAST thing you want to do is remove the phone from your account, because that disables Activation Lock. What you should do is lock the phone and erase it.
However, you can protect both your trusted numbers and security keys in the scenario you describe. It is explained in the link that I provided→Secure your iPhone against passcode hijac… - Apple Community. By interesting coincidence, that tip was created today by LD150 in response to a similar vulnerability. In case you didn’t read it, do the following (copied from that link):
In order to limit what a thief can do inside your phone even with passcode you can utilise Screen Time to prevent access to account and passcode changes in the same way that you may restrict a child, and the key is to use a different passcode than that of your phone itself
Without that screen Time passcode nobody can see your Apple ID and cannot make any changes to password, or set a Recovery key which is the ultimate lock-out.
And I might add they also can’t get to your security key or trusted device settings.
jayohechen wrote:
I like using security keys as it keeps the "what you have" separate from the phone. However, if someone snatched my phone while I was using it, it would be unlocked, and they could remove the security keys, which would lock me out of my iCloud account since I have 2FA enabled.
They would need to enter your iPhone’s passcode to do so.
And, if you were prudent enough to add additional trusted devices or phone numbers in your security settings you would not be locked out.
There is a much greater risk, described here→Secure your iPhone against passcode hijac… - Apple Community
ADDENDUM: It just occurred to me, are you asking about security keys (physical devices that generate random codes) or PassKeys?
Re: “… it would be unlocked, and they could remove the security keys … “
This is not entirely accurate.
Under iOS 16.5, re-entry of the device passcode is required for Security Key removal.
They could. That's why I have backup keys. Apple won't let you add security keys unless you have at least one backup. Plus it's less likely since they're kept on a keychain in my pocket. It's not something people pull out to use all the time, so it's far less vulnerable to a snatch and grab. Plus thieves usually don't snatch keys. They're generally worthless to anyone else. Unlike a phone.
I suggest that you let Apple know your concerns directly by submitting them here: Product Feedback - Apple
If they are violent and stealing things, they could also take your security key.
Seems like a flaw in the security keys.
Better also contact the manufacturer of the keys and let them know that.
If they snatch my phone while I am using it, it will be unlocked. So they won't need to enter the 4 or 6 digit PIN. They can then remove my security keys. If I try to change your PIN, it asks for my current PIN. I'm wondering why Apple can't do the same here before removing your security keys.
I have a trusted phone number added. It's not a matter of being locked out permanently, but rather being able to quickly get back in. A trusted third party (like my wife), may not be able to respond immediately. Or may be in the same situation I am in because we're together. If I can get to a computer quickly, log into my iCloud account, remove the stolen phone from the account, it would give me a better chance at preserving my iCloud data and backups before the thief starts screwing with it. But if the thief removes my security keys from the phone, I can no longer use my security key to log back in quickly.
It's a simple fix. Ask for the iPhone PIN before allowing removal of the security keys. They already do it when changing the PIN.
By keys, I'm referring to physical tokens, e.g. a Yubikey. Typically keys that support the FIDO protocol, NOT the ones with the changing numbers (a.k.a. TOTP). On my iPhone, they're referred to as "Security Keys" in the "Password & Security" screen.
Is it just me, or are security keys a dead shot? I don’t know much about them, nor much of how they work, but I’ve seen other users talk negatively about them, and their posts then being removed… 🤷♀️
You may be right H1290. Hard to tell. I do see adoption but a glacial pace. Disappointing really. Especially with all the phishing and hacking going on. It's one of those things where people don't think much of it. Until it happens to them.
Honestly, I think Apple is one of the better companies when it comes to security, but there's room for improvement.
Re: “… but I’ve seen other users talk negatively about them …”
And even more users have spoken negatively about 2FA or even what they dismiss as the “non-need” to use a device passcode.
Security keys are simply one more extremely phishing-resistant tool in the security toolbox Apple has made available; that doesn’t mean that they are meant for - or needed by - EVERY user.
I see. Thanks for sharing!
I wish I could remember the reply by another user that was removed. They thought it was all a big “scam.” 🤷♀️
But I cannot believe people would say there no sense in a device passcode!?
<deleted> Not sure why my message keeps appearing in the wrong place.
Thanks for the link, Terrerax. I didn't realize this was an option. I have submitted my concerns.
One other thing: In the scenario described above, the thief could also remove your trusted phone number.
Thank you Lawrence Finch! That was super helpful. I have, as advised, submitted a feature request to Apple. And I'll try the Screen Time mechanism.
Why can security keys be removed without requiring a password?
