Smart Mailboxes Don't Save (Disappear)!!

I love using Smart Mailboxes and have been using them for years. But as of the last several months, any Smart Mailbox I create disappears (or is automatically deleted) the moment I close the Mail program. It's like whatever mechanism is supposed to store that information isn't working, so when I close the Mail program and open it again, it doesn't retrieve the new Smart Mailboxes that I create.


I do use iCloud Drive and I am syncing my mail stuff with it. I'm using Mac OS Ventura 13.4.1. Don't recall exactly when the problem started, but it's possible it started when I upgraded to Ventura shortly after it was released.


Someone please HELP!!! I have a bunch of new clients and need to be able to create (and store) Smart Mailboxes for each of them. Thanks in advance to anyone who's had this issue and has been able to fix it.

Mac Studio

Posted on Jul 13, 2023 10:07 AM

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Question marked as Helpful

Jul 13, 2023 1:39 PM in response to Bernardo314

First, there is no reason to ever install or run any 3rd party "cleaning", "optimizing", "speed-up", anti-virus, VPN or security apps on your Mac.  This documents describe what you need to know and do in order to protect your Mac: Effective defenses against malware and other threats - Apple Community and Recognize and avoid phishing messages, phony support calls, and other scams - Apple Support.  


There are no known viruses, i.e. self propagating, for Macs.  There are, however, adware and malware which require the user to install although unwittingly most of the time thru sneaky links, etc.   


Anti Virus developers try to group all types as viruses into their ad campaigns of fear.  They do a poor job of the detecting and isolating the adware and malware.  Since there are no viruses these apps use up a lot of system resources searching for what is non-existent and adversely affect system and app performance.


There is one app, Malwarebytes, which was developed by a long time contributor to these forums and a highly respected member of the computer security community, that is designed solely to seek out adware and known malware and remove it.  The free version is more than adequate for most users.  


As you've already been informed CMM is considered to be akin to malware by most of the long time contributors to these forums. Uninstall it according to the developer's instructions. You can check to see if you've removed all of the supporting files by downloading and running the shareware app Find Any File to search for any files with the application's or the developer's name in the file name.  For the CMM software you'd do the following search(es): 


1 - Name contains cleanmymac

2 - Name contains macpaw


Any files that are found can be dragged from the search results window to the Desktop or Trash bin in the Dock for deletion.


FAF can search areas that Spotlight can't like invisible folders, system folders and packages.  


If you get warnings that the file can't be deleted because it is in use or used by another app boot into Safe Mode according to How to use safe mode on your Mac and delete from there.


Note:  if you have a wireless keyboard with rechargeable batteries connect it with its charging cable before booting into Safe Mode.  This makes it act as a wired keyboard as will assure a successful boot into Safe Mode.


21 replies

Jul 13, 2023 10:30 AM in response to Bernardo314

Give this a try: boot into Safe Mode according to How to use safe mode on your Mac and test to see if the problem persists. Reboot normally and test again.


NOTE 1: Safe Mode boot can take up to 3 - 5 minutes as it's doing the following; 

• Verifies your startup disk and attempts to repair directory issues, if needed

• Loads only required kernel extensions (prevents 3rd party kernel/extensions from loading)

• Prevents Startup Items and Login Items from opening automatically

• Disables user-installed fonts 

• Deletes font caches, kernel cache, and other system cache files


NOTE 2: if you have a wireless keyboard with rechargeable batteries connect it with its charging cable before booting into Safe Mode. This makes it act as a wired keyboard as will insure a successful boot into Safe Mode.


Jul 13, 2023 11:33 AM in response to Old Toad

Hi there and thanks for the reply!


I just tried that and, unfortunately, the issue is not resolved. Even within Safe Mode, I created a Smart Mailbox, it worked perfectly, but the moment I closed the Mail program and reopened it, the Smart Mailbox was gone.


My personal opinion is that it has something to do with the iCloud syncing. This is because I was able to create the Smart Mailbox that I need on another Mac, but it wasn't transferred over to this one (as it should if iCloud syncing was working correctly). On the other Mac I'm able to open and close the Mail program and the Smart Mailbox remains (as it should). But it does not sync with this one.


It almost feels like whatever file it has to write to in order to save the configuration - either locally or in iCloud - is not accessible (either because it's not there or because of permissions problems).

Question marked as Helpful

Jul 13, 2023 1:39 PM in response to Bernardo314

First, there is no reason to ever install or run any 3rd party "cleaning", "optimizing", "speed-up", anti-virus, VPN or security apps on your Mac.  This documents describe what you need to know and do in order to protect your Mac: Effective defenses against malware and other threats - Apple Community and Recognize and avoid phishing messages, phony support calls, and other scams - Apple Support.  


There are no known viruses, i.e. self propagating, for Macs.  There are, however, adware and malware which require the user to install although unwittingly most of the time thru sneaky links, etc.   


Anti Virus developers try to group all types as viruses into their ad campaigns of fear.  They do a poor job of the detecting and isolating the adware and malware.  Since there are no viruses these apps use up a lot of system resources searching for what is non-existent and adversely affect system and app performance.


There is one app, Malwarebytes, which was developed by a long time contributor to these forums and a highly respected member of the computer security community, that is designed solely to seek out adware and known malware and remove it.  The free version is more than adequate for most users.  


As you've already been informed CMM is considered to be akin to malware by most of the long time contributors to these forums. Uninstall it according to the developer's instructions. You can check to see if you've removed all of the supporting files by downloading and running the shareware app Find Any File to search for any files with the application's or the developer's name in the file name.  For the CMM software you'd do the following search(es): 


1 - Name contains cleanmymac

2 - Name contains macpaw


Any files that are found can be dragged from the search results window to the Desktop or Trash bin in the Dock for deletion.


FAF can search areas that Spotlight can't like invisible folders, system folders and packages.  


If you get warnings that the file can't be deleted because it is in use or used by another app boot into Safe Mode according to How to use safe mode on your Mac and delete from there.


Note:  if you have a wireless keyboard with rechargeable batteries connect it with its charging cable before booting into Safe Mode.  This makes it act as a wired keyboard as will assure a successful boot into Safe Mode.


Jul 13, 2023 1:39 PM in response to Bernardo314

Here's some food for thought: unless you're using a true VPN tunnel, such as between you and your employer's, school's or bank's servers, they provide false security from a privacy standpoint.  Read these two articles: Public VPN's are anything but private and Former Malware Distributor Kape Technologies Now Owns ExpressVPN, CyberGhost, Private Internet Access, Zenmate, and a Collection of VPN “Review” Websites



Jul 13, 2023 1:39 PM in response to Old Toad

I completely removed CleanMyMac and any trace of any VPN using the FindAnyFile program you suggested. I also booted into Safe Mode, tried setting up a Smart Mailbox there, and it still got erased, so at least so far, the fix hasn't worked.


I'm guessing that there's something with the iCloud sync that isn't working. Since I have iCloud sync on for Mail, my guess is that somewhere along the way that process that syncs was damaged.


Is there a way to reset or erase any files that are involved in the sync process with iCloud so that it can get fixed?

Jul 14, 2023 1:49 AM in response to Bernardo314

iCloud syncing problems can sometimes be fixed by logging out from iCloud and logging in again.

In this case, I am not sure if this will help, because, as far as I can tell, the smart folders do not appear in iCloud Mail. I am not convinced that iCloud is involved in the present problem, but you can try disconnecting, adding a Smart Mailbox and seeing if there is any difference; then connect to iCloud again. Does that make Smart Mailboxes disappear?

Smart Mailboxes Don't Save (Disappear)!!

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