Sequioa local network authorization doesn't stick

Hi Folks,

After making a full clone of the disks ...

I just installed 15.3.2 on a test Mac Mini M1 and after the reboot, I rebooted in safe mode, and then rebooted again.

the good news is I was able to fire up Firefox and acceess a local web srver. Yay!

the less good news is Firefox prompted to be upgraded to 136.0.1.

I clicked on "update", quit firefox, and on opening it again got a prompt that firefox wanted to install a background helper. OK, I entered my admin password and ... firefox didn't open.

Tried it again, same behaviour. Third time's the charm, so I tried to open Firefox again, got the "... wants to install" prompt again, but this time, I moved the prompt window.

Sure enough, there was a window *directly behind it* asking if I wanted to allow Firefox to complete installing a helper that would have local network access. Clicked on that and entered admin password, *then* the "allow extension installation" prompt that I'd moved, and it finished successfully.

Fired up firefox again, and it can access a local webserver.

A side effect is I now have the amusment that System Settings/Local Network access says I have 5 applications granted access right, but on opening, it only shows the 4 apps I had originally granted. I assume the firefox helper counts as one of the 5 but isn't shown in the details list.

The moral of this story is that the Sequoia UI has found new ways to exceed Windows -- the pop-up for network access right hides behind the "install extension" window, but must be authorised first or it will silently fail.

=> move the pop-up window just in case some joker has hidden another pop up behind it.

Back to Sonoma for me. I'm too old for this ....

all the best, Lawrence

Hi There,

Thanks for that -- I avoided installing Sequoia until 15.2; from experience, I don't install any new MacOS until at least .2 has arrived because most of the bugs will have been squashed by then. In this case, however ...

The problem seems to be with this new Sequoia local network access security feature, and is only with third party clients (e.g. Firefox, VLC, ...). See the link letrikpuke gave for more discussion on this bug.

His solution works -- toggle the local network access off & on for the affected app in System Settings security/privacy and it'll work again. My solution is to downgrade away from Sequoia -- it's now January 2025 and this problem is still there, so unless you need inbuilt iPhone mirroring and yet another layout of controls in System Settings, just stick with Sonoma.

all the best, L

Hi there,

[I solved the original problem by downgrading away from Sequoia, and adding a profile to ignore the update for the maximum 90 days. A system disk backup using SuperDuper or Carbon Copy Clonermade before any upgrade is absolutely needed nowadays -- boot from the Sonoma clone system, erase the Sequoia system, go into recovery mode & it offers to reinstall Sonoma, then restore from the clone. Yay!]

You have a different problem. I kinda wonder if the mac that's sharing its 2nd (internal, I assume) disk is set to share only using Apple Sharing protocol, rather than SMB as well, which is all apple uses now. So ... try unsharing it, then sharing the disc again, but ensuring that it uses all sharing protocols. That bit me once, a long time ago. Apart from that, no idea. Good Luck.

Hi There,

Yeah -- you have to follow the genius's suggestions. Does it prove anything? Well ... it hints that apple treats tunneled traffic differently from local network traffic.

AIUI: You have a password app on the Mac, and the same app on your iPhone.

This third party app on your Mac fails to connect to the iPhone using your router's WiFi, as this local network access feature blocks it, and that feature doesn't "stick" over a reboot or power cycle. Note that they're both on the same local IP network.

IMHO: I strongly suspect that using the iPhone as a hot spot passes all data to the iPhone directly. It's a tunnel rather than a "naked" IP connection, so there is no real local [IP] network access involved.

For intelectual curiosity it'd would be interesting to bomb your Mac back to the stone age and re-install everything bit by bit (i.e., no just re-installing from a Time Machine backup), so there is no entry for that app in the "Local Network" permission list. If the app still works WITHOUT asking you to grant local network access to this app the first time when connecting to the iPhone as hot spot, that confirms that Apple's devs treat the hot spot tunnel differently from normal local network traffic. In reality, if he/she does suggest that, I'd suggest you wish them big fun and travel.

So ... you have a kludge for your sync, but still leaves the Sequoia bug -- you just bypassed it.

It's ugly that you need to faff about switching to iphone hot spot to sync, and then back again to normal WiFi for everything else.

If it keeps the genius happy, save your router settings, reset it, and confirm that it doesn't work [and it won't], then reload those settings back into the router.

I wish you good Luck & much patience.

Lawrence

Hi there,

to amplify this, Photos will silently "upgrade" your local Photos library and that upgrade will make it unreadable to Sonoma's version of Photos. If you don't share all your photos to iCloud (in a format that can be scanned as legally required by random Authorities) you could find this a real PITA.

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Just copying the Sequoia version of the local Photos Library won't work. There seems no way to "downgrade" the local Photos library to make it readable on Sonoma. There are many harsh words that ran through my head when I found that one out. Fortunately I had loads of disc space available, otherwise I'd have quite miffed.

The local photo library on your backup/Sonoma clone won't have any photos you've added since you installed Sequoia. SO ... While still running Sequoia, you'll have to Export all the newer photos to disc. Once you've bombed the system back to Sonoma, you'll need to Import the missing photos back into the "Sonoma" local photo library.

Don't forget that you'll also need to import any "new" local music files (that you added since installing Sequoia) back into Music when you've bombed the system back to Sonoma.

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all the best,

Lawrence

ASIDE: Re. Firefox: The extra problem I mentioned was only with the firefox app update that tried to install a backgound helper, and the Sequoia security UI that made that app update fail.

I strongly suspect the same comedic Sequoia UI would have messed up upgrades to other Mozilla forks (or with other Browsers) that also tried to install helpers. The comment to report this to Mozilla is a bit puzzling -- given that this shambles was a pair of Sequoia security UIs, it's unlikely to be anything the Mozilla folk could fix.

The app upgrade triggered the security UI when it tried to install a background helper. That's expected and should should be fine, (the security prompts had better be handled exclusively by MacOS), but that Sequoia UI tripped up over its own feet by hiding one security prompt window (permit local network access) behind another one it popped up in the install process.