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Netflix Problems

436611 Views 793 Replies Latest reply: Sep 14, 2013 9:32 AM by larrylintz RSS
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 8:35 AM (in response to brian5678)
    brian5678 wrote:
    "I too was having the same issues with specific titles that would play for 2-5 seconds,
    then kick me back to the movie menu."
    Count me as having this problem.


    And we have had evidence posted this is a possible bandwidth starvation issue, which does not point to the ATV being the culprit. Have you done any testing of your bandwidth to verify or deny there is a bandwidth starvation issue?

    Point 1: This streaming client should be the best out there.


    What evidence do you have that it is not? Given the evidence at hand (not everyone having the problem, no media-manufactured 'scandal', et cetera), I am curious as to how you draw the conclusion that Apple has anything at all to do with the quality of the streaming. The AppleTV is, after all, only a conduit and Netflix is solely responsible for their stream; The AppleTV is merely an interface between your network and your TV. If the bandwidth you have available is provably insufficient to meet the minimums AppleTV requires for streaming any content, precisely and exactly explain how this is in any way proof that Apple has a sub-standard device or software.

    Point 2: The same movie at the same time day that has problems on my AppleTV
    plays back WITHOUT problems on my Wii.


    And as I have already pointed out, the Wii streams and displays at a different rate and resolution than does the AppleTV. All this proves is that your Wii meets the minimums necessary to meet your expectations and judgments of quality, not to mention possibly lower bandwidth availability. It does not prove your connection meets the minimums necessary for the AppleTV's higher quality, higher bandwidth requirements.

    In other words, the maximum the Wii will display is 480p, which requires a magnitude less bandwidth than the 720p of the Apple TV. So will someone - anyone! - having these issues PLEASE test their bandwidth while having Netflix 'problems' and report back so we may get to the bottom of these issues once and for all using real, verifiable proof.

    While waiting on that evidence, I have just completed another follow-up call with Netflix, and it appears there are problems to be addressed. They would share no hard and fast numbers with me, understandably, but they did say (by way of anecdotal information) relatively few AppleTV complaints are being called in. They are receiving a lower volume of calls than history has shown with other new Netflix streaming devices. To be blunt, Netflix cannot fix that which they are unaware of. If you are having ANY issues with Netflix streaming and AppleTV they encourage you to call it in. They sincerely want to know about any and all problems anyone has with Netflix and Apple TV.

    Please call it in!

    But it is also a huge piece of evidence that the vast majority of AppleTV's are - in fact - not problematic, which lends credence to my claim this is not inherently an Apple or AppleTV problem.

    I also report to you the Netflix rep related that nearly all the issues they have resolved with AppleTV are bandwidth starvation issues. Netflix was quite willing to share the fact if the internet connection dips below 1.5MB/second, even momentarily, you WILL have problems. In my professional opinion everyone should consider the Netflix 1.5MB/second requirement as a concrete floor representing the very minimum necessary to participate in Netflix streaming. And if you truly wish to stream 720p (from Netflix or any other source) you should either prepare for long buffering times and interruptions or increase your bandwidth to a minimum of 4MB/sec.

    *I cannot speak for Netflix and make no promises, warranties, or claims on their behalf*; that being said, it is my sole opinion in the near future anyone who calls Netflix with an AppleTV streaming issue may be required to conduct a bandwidth test as part of a sound troubleshooting procedure. This is not to say there have not been account problems; there have. Netflix wishes to have very active participation by customers in calling or contacting Netflix support so if there are issues of any sort with Netflix they may be addressed as rapidly as possible.

    So unless someone has additional issues to bring to the fore, with evidence to back them up, it would appear by weight of evidence the AppleTV / Netflix issues fall into one of two camps :

    1. Bandwidth starvation.
    2. Account issues.

    Based on the evidence and data collected Netflix is of the opinion - at the moment - that bandwidth issues are 99% of the AppleTV problem. If you can bring evidence and fact to the table it is otherwise, I encourage you to do so for the betterment of the entire community of AppleTV and Netflix users. If you cannot, I encourage you to refrain from muddying the waters more by slinging baseless, unprovable accusations as to exactly what the 'problem' is, or who is at 'fault'.

    *PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE* : go and test, return and report; else, stay silent.
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • Groovyguru Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 9:10 AM (in response to Buster Blocker)
    I hope you mean 1.5 megabits not MB/second. I have 35 years of hardware and software experience. Your defensiveness of apple does not help apple or the customers.

    As you note, just because people don't call in issues, does not mean they don't exist. Since apple specifically advertises the use of Netflix on atv2, apple is partially responsible for issues related to this topic. Telling people to follow your method or back off is offensive and counterproductive.
    iPad, iPod touch, nano, atv, iOS 4, Netbook
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 9:17 AM (in response to davepaisley)
    davepaisley wrote:
    Please brush up on your reading comprehension and read everything I wrote.


    Physician, heal thyself.

    I have carefully turned everything off, rebooted the cable, router and turned
    on only the ATV2 - same problem.


    Have you eliminated the settings of the router as being a problem? In other words, have you added the AppleTV to the DMZ where the router would not interfere in any way with the internet connection between the AppleTV and Netflix and tested the AppleTV to see if the problem continued?

    The odds that the exact same problem which appears to be affecting you exists in two different AppleTVs, picked at random and sent to you are infinitesimally small. They approach impossibility. The fact is that something at your residence is causing the problem, and I would be willing to bet you a steak dinner if you took that AppleTV anywhere else and hooked it up wirelessly there would be zero problems. That's also a troubleshooting technique, by the way.

    And yes I tested the bandwidth (12Mbps) and no, none of the other devices have a problem.


    None of your other devices have the bandwidth requirement of the AppleTV. Again, what good does it say to report that all Chevys are running fine while your Ford is broken down? It proves nothing about why your Ford is broken, or what the solution is. Adding your AppleTV to your router's DMZ would.

    Regardless of why, the fact is the ATV2 is the only wifi device that has any
    problems in my house and is more finicky than any other wireless device I
    own, and it seems to be quite a widespread problem.


    Netflix disagrees with you about the prominence of the problem, and if anyone would know one would think it would be they. Claiming everyone has a problem, or more people have a problem because you have a problem solves nothing.

    For a device that is supposed to be literally plug and play, that is a major failure.


    The only major failure here is on the part of people who refuse to use any logical testing procedure to eliminate all possible causes EXCEPT the AppleTV. People are making huge leaps of 'logic' bereft of any fact to back up their claims. If you add your AppleTV to your routers DMZ *WITHOUT CHANGING ANYTHING ELSE* and report back the results it would be a tremendous service and might actually draw us closer to a solution than the workout you are getting by jumping to conclusions.

    List of ports that may be in use by Apple TV :

    TCP port 53
    TCP port 80
    TCP port 123
    TCP port 443
    TCP port 3689
    UDP port 5353

    List of known ports used by Apple Products : http://support.apple.com/kb/TS1629

    Please set up the DMZ to the AppleTV according to the instructions of your router manufacturer, and report your findings back so we may move forward in finding a solution. Thanks for your help!
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • brian5678 Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 9:19 AM (in response to Buster Blocker)
    blah blah

    The quality of the picture really just does not matter if the AppleTV can not play the movie.

    Clearly "Buster Blocker" you are too connected to the project to see the real issue here, that the customers just want the device to work.
    AppleTV, iOS 4
  • davepaisley Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 9:30 AM (in response to Buster Blocker)
    Let's see -

    "I would be willing to bet you a steak dinner if you took that AppleTV anywhere else and hooked it up wirelessly there would be zero problems. That's also a troubleshooting technique, by the way."

    So you owe me a steak dinner, as it has the exact same issues at my friend's house.

    Otherwise, blah, blah, blah. I'm not going to enumerate the hours of testing and configuration I've tried, chats with Apple on the phone, etc.

    Once again:

    1) Marketed as plug and play, but it isn't.
    2) All other devices work fine with no fiddling/configuration or grief from asshats like you
    Mac Mini, ATV2, Dell XPS, Dell E1405, Asus EeePC, Mac OS X (10.6.4), iPhone 3GS, iPod Touch, iPad
  • Petermgr Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 9:56 AM (in response to davepaisley)
    Well from my simple experience, I know the ATV2 handles Netflix differently than my WII.

    I've had Netflix for 3 months using my WII (wireless connection). Good performance and acceptable picture quality. Once I had an audio drop out that lasted 3 seconds.

    Then bought the ATV2 and connected directly to the router via cable. Netflix performance is mixed. Often blocky quality on any videos. Numerous times the audio drops out and up to 20 seconds. On occasion the video freezes then jumps ahead a bit. This was noticed just after hooking up the ATV on the same day that I just finished Netflix on the WII without problems.

    I like the ATV2 for the ability to access my computers and radio stations. I also watch videos I've got stored on my computers (either PC or Mac). And I've not experienced poor image quality or sound drop outs like I do with Netflix (on ATV2). However, I did try a rental via ATV2, and finally stopped watching it. It kept freezing and dropping out. So I doubt I'll rent again for viewing on the ATV.

    So the question is, is it ATV2 not handling Netflix properly, or is it that Netflix is not be delivered in a suitable format to ATV2? I'm not a tech, but regardless, at the moment, if I want to see a "more stable Netflix", I will use my WII.

    BTW, experience with the ATV is the same before and after the recent update.
    Windows XP Pro
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 10:03 AM (in response to Groovyguru)
    Groovyguru wrote:
    I hope you mean 1.5 megabits not MB/second.


    Of course. I am sorry I didn't catch that error, and I thank you for doing so.

    I have 35 years of hardware and software experience.
    Your defensiveness of apple does not help apple or the customers.


    But people committing random acts and posting them as 'fixes' does? Leaping to conclusions without evidence does? You have a very warped concept of help.

    As you note, just because people don't call in issues, does not
    mean they don't exist. Since apple specifically advertises the use
    of Netflix on atv2, apple is partially responsible for issues related
    to this topic.


    I will ask again : specifically, how?

    It has been demonstrated and proven this is not a wide-spread issue universally affecting all AppleTVs. In my own instance the solution was communicating with Netflix then simply doing nothing. Exactly and precisely how is a Netflix account problem or bandwidth starvation issue Apple's problem, fault, or responsibility? It is, however, completely illogical and irresponsible to point fingers at anyone or anything without the proof to back it up.

    I have already allowed there may very well be people with AppleTV hardware issues, but there have been far too many random 'fixes' posted to be able to tell how widespread the issue is or is not. Unless and until we eliminate ALL the exterior causes, we will never know for sure if Apple or AppleTV has any share of the blame to accept, or to what degree. If you find that concept offensive, I really can't comprehend how you can repair anything.

    Telling people to follow your method or back off is
    offensive and counterproductive.


    So it is offensive and counterproductive to ask people to quit being random and make logical, documented steps eliminating one cause at a time until we have a cause and solution?

    Wow.

    Just wow.
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 10:18 AM (in response to davepaisley)
    davepaisley wrote:
    So you owe me a steak dinner, as it has the exact same issues at my friend's house.


    And does your friend use the exact same routing equipment and exact same ISP as you?

    I should have added more clarity to that declaration, so I am sorry that was not as clear as it could have been. I am looking for a completely unblocked, un-firewalled connection to the internet. That is what setting up a DMZ pointing at the AppleTV would accomplish. My gut is still telling me there is something specifically about your internet connection that is either not routing the traffic correctly to the AppleTV or not supplying it with the bandwidth it needs.

    Have you tried using one of your computers to ping the IP address of the Apple TV, and if so what were the results?

    There is one thing for certain : adding connection testing to the iOS of the AppleTV would be a big help to tracking down any connection issues. I will suggest this to Apple and see what happens.

    1) Marketed as plug and play, but it isn't.


    There is no evidence backing this statement up. I am really, truly sorry you have had a bad experience, but the evidence is, for the vast majority of AppleTV users, AppleTV is plug and play exactly as Apple has claimed.

    2) All other devices work fine with no fiddling/configuration or grief from asshats like you


    And now that you have started calling names, the problem magically corrected itself, right? Look, I don't care what you or anyone else thinks of me. I care that we all take steps to find the cause of the problems which will ultimately offer up the solution, no matter what that solution is. If you don't want to be a part of that effort, then why go after those who are?
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • Eckdale Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 10:39 AM (in response to CalebG)
    Same issue. Ussue began after IOS 4.1 update. Apple TV is connected to network via Ethernet (ie not WiFi). I can connect to Netfix, browse movies, etc but an attempt to play a movie either results in perpetual "loading..." or being dropped back to previous screen. My xbox 360, connected to same switch via Ethernet, (Apple airport extreme) has no issues streaming Netflix.
    Apple TV (2nd gen), iOS 4
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 10:46 AM (in response to Eckdale)
    Eckdale wrote:
    Same issue. Ussue began after IOS 4.1 update. Apple TV is connected
    to network via Ethernet (ie not WiFi).


    By any chance at all, does the router have MAC address filtering turned on? Have you tried pinging the AppleTV's IP address?
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • Eckdale Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 10:59 AM (in response to Buster Blocker)
    MAC address filtering is not enabled.
    Apple TV replies to ping. IE basic network connectivity is not the issue. Apple TV screen saver is successfully pulling images from Flickr etc.

    I should note: Internet connection is 6Mb DSL.

    Message was edited by: Eckdale
    iOS 4
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 12:45 PM (in response to Eckdale)
    Eckdale wrote:
    Apple TV replies to ping.


    Nazzo fast, Guido. How does it reply to the ping? Is there any packet loss reported? What are the response times?

    Have you opened a DMZ to the Apple TV? Are any of the ports the AppleTV uses blocked in any way on the router?

    Thanks again for checking !
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 1:08 PM (in response to Petermgr)
    PeterinBC wrote:
    So the question is, is it ATV2 not handling Netflix properly,
    or is it that Netflix is not be delivered in a suitable format
    to ATV2? I'm not a tech, but regardless, at the moment,
    if I want to see a "more stable Netflix", I will use my WII.


    If the ATV is playing local network video correctly, but not accepting streaming video from the internet, it points to a possible misconfiguration in the router. Have you tried connecting your AppleTV data cable directly to your cable modem or DSL router? It would be interesting to see what would happen if you were to connect the AppleTV data cable directly to the modem/router and rebooting both and observing the results.

    Would you mind doing this and reporting back?
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
  • davepaisley Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 1:46 PM (in response to Buster Blocker)
    If the ATV is playing local network video correctly, but not accepting streaming video from the internet, it points to a possible misconfiguration in the router. Have you tried connecting your AppleTV data cable directly to your cable modem or DSL router? It would be interesting to see what would happen if you were to connect the AppleTV data cable directly to the modem/router and rebooting both and observing the results.

    Would you mind doing this and reporting back


    Here's more data on mine

    Wired:
    ATV2 works fine (apple store, Netflix, etc.) when plugged into router directly with ethernet cable.

    Wireless:
    Local network wireless works fine (streams from iTunes libraries on computers, etc.)
    Apple store, Youtube, Netflix show menus (slowly) but have insufficient bandwidth to stream content.
    Example: a 30 second TV show preview in the store takes 2+ mins to download enough to start playing the clip.
    DMZ to ATV2 makes no difference.
    Throwing all the ports open makes no difference.

    Friends router was same (Linksys WRT160N - 2 of them we tried, as he had a spare one for his in-laws) but cabel provider is different as he's 40 miles away.

    I seriously doubt it's the router, as there must be millions out there and other people with this problem are using a variety of routers - including Airports.

    Again, no other device has a problem, and the ATV2 isn't "a bit" slower - it's several orders of magnitude slower.
    Mac Mini, ATV2, Dell XPS, Dell E1405, Asus EeePC, Mac OS X (10.6.5), iPhone 3GS, iPod Touch, iPad
  • Buster Blocker Level 1 Level 1 (15 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2010 2:01 PM (in response to davepaisley)
    davepaisley wrote:
    Here's more data on mine


    Dave, I am done helping you. You are a liar, and you are wasting everyone's time "troubleshooting" an AppleTV that - by your own admission - works perfectly if connected to a router that isn't yours, just like I said. I don't know if you have some psychotic need for attention, or if you are a narcissist and to be frank at this point : I don't care.

    I will not be lied to or have my time wasted. Go solve your own problems.
    iMac Intel 20", Mac OS X (10.6.4), ACTC, ACSP, APP
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