WDS vs. Extend a wireless network

Ok I fixed it. In the room with the ISP Router and the TC wired to it i got the following wireless performance from Macbook.

ISP network 38M

TC network 4M.

So in fact the performace from the AP via powerline was the same as from the TC itself. So something not correct between the ISP router and the TC.

I did do this yesterday when I configured this but I just rebooted the ISP router and now in the same room as the TC I get 27M and off the powerline AP virtually the same. SOmething had got messed up,

THanks for the support.

Looks like things are working OK now with the powerline products and wireless access points.

Does anyone know if it is even feasible to connect 24 Airport Extremes in one large building all on the same network? They are daisy-chained by Ethernet throughout the building.

If it is, what is the best configuraton to maximize bandwidth. Is there any significant reduction in bandwidth?

Is there a realistic maximum number of concurrent users to expect the wireless network to handle?

Thank you!

The real question here is whether a product designed for use in a simple home network should even be considered as a potential solution in a commercial installation. My opinion would be that it should not.

You have a demanding commercial installation that will require products designed specifically for that purpose.

Probably your best initial investment in this regard would be to hire a professional IT person who has a proven record in similar system designs and installations.

Thanks for the reply Bob!

I actually figured the same thing. I just stepped into the role of Tech Director for this School District and walked into major connection issues (internal/external) and felt this is probably the cause. I needed another expert's opinion since I am not familiar with the AP Extremes and thought there maybe a configuration that would at least minimize these bottlenecks as I reviewed managed wireless solutions.

Thanks again!

John

As Bob mentioned in his prior post on this thread, there is an approximately 15% penalty in speed for extending a network when using "N" devices.

Is this 15% either with each extender (Airport Express) or irrespective of how many are on the network? I plan on having the new 4th gen TC as my router and about 5 extenders (old TC, 3 Airport Expresses and a 2nd gen Airport Extreme).

Bob,

I'm going to be setting up just about the same as Jared, using a Powerline as an ethernet to connect to a remote Airport Express.

I'm a computer novice so in your last step of instruction, what do you exactly mean by restting the network after you make all of these changes?

I'm a computer novice so in your last step of instruction, what do you exactly mean by restting the network after you make all of these changes?

Turn everything off...order is not important

Turn everything back on....modem first, then other devcies one at a time

15% penalty in speed for extending a network when using "N" devices.

Is this 15% either with each extender (Airport Express) or irrespective of how many are on the network? I plan on having the new 4th gen TC as my router and about 5 extenders (old TC, 3 Airport Expresses and a 2nd gen Airport Extreme).

If you are extending by connecting devices using wirelesss only, plan on losing about 50-60% of the bandwidth on the entire network, or approximately 10-15% per device...on average.

Thanks Bob,

I think I will unplug some of those Airport Expresses.

I still want to use my old TC for storage and to back up only my laptop as opposed to my children's.

Do I set up the TC to join a network instead of extend a network to avoid the loss of speed penalty?

Do I set up the TC to join a network instead of extend a network to avoid the loss of speed penalty?

The bandwidth loss will be about the same for either "join" or "extend". I would go with "extend" to provide more wireless signal coverage.

Otherwise, if you are concerned about bandwidth loss on the network, you should connect the TC to your main wireless router using an Ethernet cable. That is the only way to maintain maximum bandwidth on the network.

Thank you very much Bob,

You are a very great help. I work during the day so cannot get to and stay on the phone with Apple for technical support, especially with new unforseen issues given my unfamiliarity with networks and computers in general requiring repeat calls.

If you could help me with a few more questions tonight, I would be very grateful.

1) I will take your advice and attach my old TC to my new TC via an ethernet cable. Would I just plug an end to either devices' ports? Do I turn off wireless on the old TC and would I need to turn off either first before plugging the two together? What other settings do I need to set up on the old TC and how would I access/see it from my computer?

2) In preserving bandwitdth, would using the Powerline method of attaching another base (Airport Express or Extreme) keep things faster? If I attach an Airport Express to a Powerline device and then enable extend a wireless network, is that going to slow things down?

3) finally, a basic question on the order of steps. In setting up the programming of the Air Port Express to use it with the Powerline device, do I program it before I attach it to the Powerline device (and then attach it) or do I attach it to the Powerline device and then program after the two are together?

Thanks again,

Lawrence

Do I set up the TC to join a network instead of extend a network to avoid the loss of speed penalty?

Connect an Ethernet cable from one of the LAN <-> ports on the new TC to the WAN port (circle of dots icon) on the old TC.

Configure the old TC as follows:

AirPort Utility - Manual Setup

Click the Wireless tab below the icons

Wireless Mode = Off

Click he Internet icon

Click the Internet Connection tab

Connect Using = Ethernet

Connection Sharing = Off (Bridge Mode)

Update to save setings and let the TC restart

Power cycle the entire network by powering everything off

Wait a minute

Start the modem first and let it run a minute or two

Start the next device connected to the modem the same way

Keep starting devices one at a time until everything is powered back up

In preserving bandwitdth, would using the Powerline method of attaching another base (Airport Express or Extreme) keep things faster

It is not possible to say. Bandwidth is lost as the distance increases between each power line adapter. The same thing happens when you connect using wireless only. Connecting AirPort devices using Ethernet cables is the only way to maintain maximum bandwidth on the network

finally, a basic question on the order of steps. In setting up the programming of the Air Port Express to use it with the Powerline device, do I program it before I attach it to the Powerline device (and then attach it) or do I attach it to the Powerline device and then program after the two are together?

It really makes no difference unless you suspect that you are having difficulty with the power line adapters. Then, I would program the Express close to the main router and move it to the desired location.

I will do that Bob. You saved me alot of time.

I was just thinking . . .

What if, after I connect the old TC to the new one, I used it as a second wireless source for a different wireless network for guests (kids that play games, download media etc.). Would that keep things faster on the wireless network of the new TC? If this is feasible, is it easy to do and how would you accomplish this?

Also since the Powerline gobbles up some speed as my house is about 5000 sq feet (I plan on having 5 remote PL plugged in), is it possible to connect the ethernet cable to the old TC in bridged mode and use that as the Powerline "source?" My goal is just to preserve bandwidth on the new TC.

Use Meraki for commercial installations.