Close
Q: Xcode 4 - No Longer Free?
Previous
Page
2
of 3
last
Next
-
Mar 13, 2011 4:32 PMby etresoft,Jongware wrote:
So? Google is free, but if they change it to $0.001 Per Search I'm going to use another search engine.
Google isn't free. Advertisers pay big money to Google. Google doesn't charge you to do searches, but then you aren't Google's customer - you are Google's product -
Mar 13, 2011 6:04 PMby BlueCrab,red_menace wrote:
Some of the buzz going around is that the pricing is from some accounting issues due to the Sarbanes-Oxley Act (mostly from adding value to IOS) and that OS X 10.7/Lion will ship with a free version of XCode 4 (although we probably won't find out until it is released). The current version is a preview anyway.
Well, if that's indeed the case that its a stupid regulatory requirement, then why can't they say that? I'd bet that a lot of the people who are upset over the fact that it now costs money (myself included) wouldn't be upset if Apple were to just come out and say that it is to comply with some stupid regulatory requirements. Apple hasn't done that, and thus why many people are upset. -
Mar 13, 2011 6:06 PMby BlueCrab,etresoft wrote:
Having a free development environment is a new phenomena. Apple only did that because the original ProjectBuilder was based on GPL tools. Now that Xcode has been rebuilt using better tools with better licensing, Apple has more options.
Last I checked, even Xcode 4 includes GCC. The GPL has nothing to do with it. If Apple wanted, they could charge for their compiled version of GCC (they just have to offer source code at least on request). Nothing in the GPL requires that you not charge for GPLed software, otherwise there are many companies that would be out of business. -
Mar 13, 2011 6:29 PMby red_menace,It's been out and about in a few places for similar things (for example http://www.macgasm.net/2011/02/24/apple-charge-facetime/ ) - the act is a bit confusing and has since been changed, although it probably still applies for earlier IOS versions. Not sure how far back they needed to go with the accounting, and I think they got a bit lazy, but until Lion ships they are probably just covering themselves. -
Mar 13, 2011 6:35 PMby Drew_Meister,etresoft wrote:
People are complaining because a new version of a previously free product now costs less than a cappuccino and croissant. The Apple developer programs used to start at $500 a year. The student version was a great deal at only $200. Now, even a business account supporting multiple developers, complete with Apple Developer Support is only $99.
In other words - deal with it.
Thank you for your sage advice. I thought that I was "dealing with it" by engaging in rational and civilized discussion of my concerns. No doubt, if people would just do as you say, without question, the entire world would be set to rights in a trice.
My point regarding Xcode 4 is this: When Apple chose to give Xcode away, they, at least, appeared to be an open, generous, innovative and far thinking company. Now that they have chosen to charge for it, they appear to be small, mean and shortsighted. For a company recently voted "most admired", this seems to be a misstep. -
Mar 13, 2011 6:49 PMby Drew_Meister,etresoft wrote:
Jongware wrote:
So? Google is free, but if they change it to $0.001 Per Search I'm going to use another search engine.
Google isn't free. Advertisers pay big money to Google. Google doesn't charge you to do searches, but then you aren't Google's customer - you are Google's product
Once again, etresoft, you astound me with your sagacity. In fact, Google is free to the consumer--that's us. We are not its product. Google's product is advertising and marketing. Their information searches are what is known as a 'loss leader'.
Also, no one has elected you thread administrator so please refrain from telling people what they can and can't post:-) -
Mar 13, 2011 7:08 PMby etresoft,BlueCrab wrote:
Well, if that's indeed the case that its a stupid regulatory requirement, then why can't they say that? I'd bet that a lot of the people who are upset over the fact that it now costs money (myself included) wouldn't be upset if Apple were to just come out and say that it is to comply with some stupid regulatory requirements. Apple hasn't done that, and thus why many people are upset.
Speculation about Apple and its motives is not allowed in Apple Discussions according to the Terms of Use: http://discussions.apple.com/help.jspa
However, if previous speculation is correct, then Apple isn't taking this action to comply with some stupid regulatory requirements, they are trying to avoid the stupid parts. Had they given it away for free, there may be a whole lot more paperwork and accounting involved.
I am free to speculate on the thoughts of Apple customers. No one ever cuts Apple any slack. Had they explained their reasons, people would have just second guessed them and gotten angry anyway. Consider the iPad vs. Flash debacle. Apple explained their actions then and nobody would listen to a word they said.
Aside from a very few well-known instances, Apple tries hard to avoid pointing the finger at the government, their partners, or competitors. They just keep their mouth shut and sell products that people love. Aside from Steve Jobs, you will never see an Apple employee complain about some other company or a government regulation - even on the more private developer forums. That is an Apple trait. Adobe, for instance, is just the opposite.
Xcode4 is Apple's product. They can charge whatever they want for it. That is just business. If you are selling something, keep raising the price until revenue drop off. Notice I said revenue, not sales. If you take that too far, you can get into trouble but $5 is far from that. Maybe Apple will lose some Xcode customers if it isn't free, but maybe they will be able to provide better products and services to the paying customers. -
Mar 13, 2011 7:11 PMby Drew_Meister,red_menace wrote:
Some of the buzz going around is that the pricing is from some accounting issues due to the Sarbanes-Oxley Act (mostly from adding value to IOS) and that OS X 10.7/Lion will ship with a free version of XCode 4 (although we probably won't find out until it is released). The current version is a preview anyway.
It seems to me that most of the complaints are because Xcode used to be free - if it had been $x95 and Apple changed the price to $x99.99, no one would have noticed.
The SOX angle sounds like a red_herring. The Sarbanes-Oxley Act (SOX) of 2002 has to do with financial reporting standards of publicly traded companies, the auditing standards of the accounting firms that audit such companies and penalties for companies that fail to meet the assessment standards set by SOX 2002. Apple's decision to distribute Xcode for free doesn't seem to fall within SOX's purview. -
Mar 13, 2011 7:16 PMby osxlearner,On this topic I'm not accusing anyone of being a genius. I personally don't like their new policy nor do I like the way it was sprung or the way I found out about it. Nickel and diming away at us, by charging any amount, Apple is leaving her roots of non-professional computer scientists digging in and solving problems. -
Mar 13, 2011 7:39 PMby etresoft,Drew_Meister wrote:
Once again, etresoft, you astound me with your sagacity. In fact, Google is free to the consumer--that's us. We are not its product. Google's product is advertising and marketing.
Google's business is advertising. What they sell are the millions of people using it at any given time - i.e. you. They track your every click so they can charge more money for their ads. There isn't anything wrong with that, but it is helpful to know just what your place is in the whole transaction.Also, no one has elected you thread administrator so please refrain from telling people what they can and can't post:-)
People can post whatever they want - including me. I was trying to do you a favor by steering the discussion away from a direction where the entire thread could get locked or deleted by the Apple Discussion hosts.
In fact, I have been elected thread administrator in a sense. Once you reach Level 2 here in Apple Discussions (based on points awarded by your fellow posters), you can report a post that is in violation of Apple Discussions Terms of Use. I try to avoid that except in cases of egregious violations - which this thread hasn't yet breached in my opinion. Other people may take a more strict view - just so you know. -
Mar 13, 2011 8:08 PMby Drew_Meister,etresoft wrote:
Drew_Meister wrote:
Once again, etresoft, you astound me with your sagacity. In fact, Google is free to the consumer--that's us. We are not its product. Google's product is advertising and marketing.
Google's business is advertising. What they sell are the millions of people using it at any given time - i.e. you. They track your every click so they can charge more money for their ads. There isn't anything wrong with that, but it is helpful to know just what your place is in the whole transaction.Also, no one has elected you thread administrator so please refrain from telling people what they can and can't post:-)
People can post whatever they want - including me. I was trying to do you a favor by steering the discussion away from a direction where the entire thread could get locked or deleted by the Apple Discussion hosts.
In fact, I have been elected thread administrator in a sense. Once you reach Level 2 here in Apple Discussions (based on points awarded by your fellow posters), you can report a post that is in violation of Apple Discussions Terms of Use. I try to avoid that except in cases of egregious violations - which this thread hasn't yet breached in my opinion. Other people may take a more strict view - just so you know.
Thank you, etresoft, I now consider myself to be officially edified, and threatened. -
Mar 14, 2011 2:19 PMby Drew_Meister,etresoft wrote:
Drew_Meister wrote:
Thank you, etresoft, I now consider myself to be officially edified, and threatened.
I guess nothing pushes people to new heights of hyperbole more than a $5 optional upgrade to their $2000 computer.
Yeah, I guess. I guess, by today's standards, any conversation that exceeds the monosyllabic is automatically branded as hyperbole. I guess, in general, people are just such closed, or at least narrow, minded and inflexible martinets that they are unable to engage in a dialog on the merits, and, instead, rely on issuing decrees, threats and the odd ad hominem attack.
Well, my advice to you is: deal with it. Just so you know.
