Q: Intermittent Wifi issues with iPad 2 and WiFi

So you're saying that a 3 yr old router shouldn't work with apple mobile devices despite the fact that it meets the requirements and is setup under the specifications and configurations suggested by apple themselves?  No I'm sorry.  That doesn't work.  Apple wasn't aware there was a problem and if they were they would be required to say "hey don't use this with pre-2008 routers."

Oh and PS my iPhone 4 refuses touse Panera's wifi despite saying "connected" under settings but still showing 3G jnthe status bar.  Is that because their router is old?  Should I tell them to get a new one?

This is a problem because I'm using data when I think I'm connected to wifi.

I am deeply frustrated and disappointed in the wifi performance of my iPAD 1 and iPAD 2.

Boht are on ios 4.3.5 now and the problems are no better.

Weak signal strength.  Intermittient drop outs. 

I have an Airport Extreme base station, plus an Airport Express trying to extend the network, and I have tried MANY configurations, moving the Express around my relatively small condo.

I've changed the router config (per reading this blog and others), rebooted all boxes many times,

My Macbooks work fine, even my little ROKU box works well on the wifi signal in the fartherst corner of my place.

My iPhones and my Kindle all receive the wifi signals just fine.

The problem seems to be with the iPADs.

This is a deep disappointment in the IPADs - I can't use them the way I wish to in my own home....

Looking for help...

I have spent many hours on this, and still can't read the NY Times on my iPAD in my living room.

Scott Gossett wrote:

 

So you're saying that a 3 yr old router shouldn't work with apple mobile devices despite the fact that it meets the requirements and is setup under the specifications and configurations suggested by apple themselves?  No I'm sorry.  That doesn't work.  Apple wasn't aware there was a problem and if they were they would be required to say "hey don't use this with pre-2008 routers."

Look, if you don't want to believe that your router has a problem then that's up to you. I haven't said your router shouldn't work with Apple Mobile Devices. It certainly should, but it doesn't, and this is probably due to a firmware bug in the router. I have worked in computer networking for over 20 years and I know that there are plenty of router firmware problems out there. A WiFi router is a computer and just like any computer it can have software or hardware problems.

By the way, your D-Link router is far older than three years - It's just the last firmware update that is more than three years old. D-Link has long abandoned support for this router - that should tell you something.

The problem with this thread is that, although it contains lots of posts from people who fixed their problem with a router firmware update or replacement, there are some who continue to believe that their router is faultless. They don't take any action to correct the problems they are experiencing. I'm not sure what they are waiting for - you can buy a new wireless-g router for ~$30-40.

On the other hand, there are also some in this thread who clearly seem to have WiFi hardware problems with their iPad but are still waiting for an iOS fix to their problem. This is certainly unwise since their warranty period may elapse.

With more than 30 million iPads out there (and more than 200 million iDevices) the small number of problems of unkown origin being reported here doesn't point toward Apple doing anything in iOS.

Scott Gossett wrote:

 

Oh and PS my iPhone 4 refuses to use Panera's wifi despite saying "connected" under settings but still showing 3G in the status bar.  Is that because their router is old?  Should I tell them to get a new one?

This is likely a result of that WiFi network not giving your iPhone a valid LAN IP address. In this case the iPhone assigns itself an IP address of the form 169.254.x.y assuming that this is an adhoc network with no DHCP server. In this condition you will not be able to get to the internet. The reason for this may be that the browser-based agreement-to-terms web page mechanism did not work correctly with the iPhone/Safari. Sometimes the Safari AutoFill mechanism can interfer with this. This isn't a WiFi problem per se.

My point, JimHdk, is that your advice is bad.  People don't have the luxury to go out and buy a new router every time they buy a new piece of hardware.  Don't you see the failure in that logic?  It's a never-ending cycle.  First of all, since my router is also a modem, it would cost twice the price you suggest to replace it.  That is a last resort, not the first option as you suggest.  I've read your previous posts and all you tell people to do is buy a new router or update firmware.  Yes, the model is older than 3 years but the actual hardware isn't and neither is the firmware.  If it's software, as you seem to suggest by telling me that routers are computers, then it's no more than 3 years old either.  And as I said, Apple supposedly supports it. 

I posted on here to troubleshoot a solution.  I've heard your solution, and frankly, it's just unhelpful.  My 90-day warranty has passed on both devices and instead of dropping more money to extend it, or dropping yet more money to buy a new router, I come to this site where people are there to help troubleshoot before I resort to your advice.  Your intentions are good, but misplaced.

As for the iPhone, it wouldn't even bring up the browser-based agreement.  It connected to "Panera" under system settings but kept using 3G so it would load webpages without going through the wifi.  So, yeah, you're right.  Probably not a wifi issue since it never even used it.  It's an OS issue telling me it's connected, then not connecting or using the connection.  Or maybe I'm wrong but being completely unrelated to the previous issue would be a huge conicidence.  But since you're convinced it's not Apple's fault, you're not going to be of any help.  Thanks for your time.

Apple doesn't support routers. It produces products which support and conform to WiFi standards. Routers are supposed to conform to these standards as well. In your case the standard is the wireless IEEE 802.11g standard. The common ground is this standard. If a router doesn't implement a portion of the standard correctly then it has a bug. Apple can't do anything about that.

For the life of me I don't understand what further troubleshooting you expect to get here. Your router/modem doesn't work with the iPad. It likely is a router firmware problem. The last firmware update from the manufacturer was over three years ago and I doubt that there will ever be another. Do you expect that Apple will be releasing a iOS update that will "code around" whatever problem this particular router has?

Earlier you stated, "I've read other threads that say it is an iOS problem". There is a lot of bad information out there. Don't take much of what you read as fact or allow it lead you to the conclusion that Apple has some iOS bug which when fixed will cure all WiFi problems. That just isn't true.

Overall you seem be taking offence at my advice. There is no need to do so; if you don't like then don't take it. If you can live with the stability of your router/modem then keep it. I'm not selling routers!

I went through three brand new (up-to-date) router models until I found one that worked consistently with my iPad1.  All of my six other WiFi devices worked fine with each of the routers.  That's an Apple problem not a router problem. 

If you read this thread with an open mind you have to conclude that there is something in the iPad hardware or software that prevents it from working with some routers, even though those routers can work with everything else.

Well I updated to the newest and still have had disconnection issues. It is a problem with the software for sure because i begun to download a song of iTunes and while it was downloading I went to look at some other songs only for the cnne tion to drop and a pop up saying I had been disconnected but the song was still downloading even though couldn't access the store.

billeeee wrote:

 

I went through three brand new (up-to-date) router models until I found one that worked consistently with my iPad1.  All of my six other WiFi devices worked fine with each of the routers.  That's an Apple problem not a router problem.

What make/model/version/firmware level routers did you test? Seems like this is valuable information. Would you care to share it?

However, if one router does work consistently with your iPad 1 and three don't wouldn't the obvious conclusion be that there was something wrong with the other three routers?

If you test three light bulbs in a socket and none of them work but a fourth one does work do you conclude that the socket is bad? or that your have three burnt-out light bulbs?

JimHdk wrote:

 

Apple doesn't support routers. It produces products which support and conform to WiFi standards. Routers are supposed to conform to these standards as well. In your case the standard is the wireless IEEE 802.11g standard. The common ground is this standard. If a router doesn't implement a portion of the standard correctly then it has a bug. Apple can't do anything about that.

JimHdk can you tell everybody just what portion of the standard that you think all these routers from D-Link, Cisco, Linksys, Belkin, Netgear, etc don't don't implement correctly that the iPad does that is causing this issue?

Can you please also let us know how you have confirmed what portion of the standard this is?

Perhaps you have done a data capture with a non working configuration and looked at the trace or some other similar diagnostics.

Can you also tell us what brand of router it was that you experienced the intermittent connectivity issue on and that you did your diagnostic testing with?

If you used any network diagnostic tools in your trouble shooting. What diagnostic tools did you use? AirMagnet, etc?

This would certainly be more helpful than just suggesting people keep purchasing different brands of of routers until they find one that works with their iPAD.

Many thanks for being part of the collective solution.

Sorry, Jim, but that analogy isn't necessarily accurate. We, honest to God, had an issue last year where some lightbulbs in our new recessed ceiling fixtures would burn out very quickly (some within weeks, some within hours) or would not work at all, whereas others would work just fine. Like this connection issue, it didn't make sense why some worked and some did not. Two electricians could not figure it out. So we called in a 3rd electrician and low and behold were told that our contractor had inadvertently oversprayed the ceiling texture and some had gotten inside the sockets. He said that if the bulbs weren't screwed in as tightly as possible, they either couldn't make a connection, or the bulb would burn out at a rapid pace as it attempted to pull electricity from the socket. He cleaned the sockets, screwed in bulbs that previously were thought to be dead and we have had absolutely no issues with our lights for the past year. So, you know what that tells me...

JimHdk wrote:

 

 

However, if one router does work consistently with your iPad 1 and three don't wouldn't the obvious conclusion be that there was something wrong with the other three routers?

 

If you test three light bulbs in a socket and none of them work but a fourth one does work do you conclude that the socket is bad? or that your have three burnt-out light bulbs?

Perhaps three of the sockets were Edison sockets and one was an old style bayonet fitting. Perhaps the light bulb you were testing also was an older bayonet type?

JimHdk as someone who claims 20 years experience as a network engineer you know this kind 'pop' logic is only useful for winning pub arguments - it doesn't solve engineering problems.

JimHdk wrote:

With more than 30 million iPads out there (and more than 200 million iDevices) the small number of problems of unkown origin being reported here doesn't point toward Apple doing anything in iOS.

 

Actually while the percentages of people who have reported the fault here seem a very small percentage of total owners. Any QA control manager will tell you that the numbers of people complaining about thie WiFiGate issue are statistically very significant.

What other product in history has statistics like these:

There are now 57 pages of posts in this forum thread alone.

This thread alone has been visited over 180,000 times. Only a very very small number of people waste their time browsing forums so most of the people who visited this thread had a reason for searching it out.

There are more than 10 threads in this forum where people are posting about the same issues.

There are many many times this number of threads on this same issue in other forums.

Only a small fraction of the people experiencing this problem will seek out a forum on this subject.

Only a small percentage of people who are experiencing this problem will post on a forum. Many are too nervous to for fear of being ridiculed, or told the problem is in their head, in their router etc.

Imagine the financial effect on Apple of doing a 'Mea Culpa' press release on this issue after their wireless connectivity issues and press releases with the iPhone 4 and the iPAD '1' they just can not afford to do a press release on a similar issue with the iPAD 2. Three in a row? Surely 3 strikes and they are out? How many millions of dollars would it cost their turnover? Would there be any effect on their share price? Would other vendors change their marketing strategies? - It's just not going to happen. Apple are understandably going to do everything to deflect WiFiGate...no thats the first time we have heard of this problem madam...It must be your router configuration?...it works fine in our store with out Apple routers (although we have seen this is not always the case!)...Have you tried updating your firmware....We can't resolve it at the moment, wait for a subsequent iOS release

...and then maybe the press release...The iPAD 3 features a number of enhancements, XXX screen, Blah and blah and faster and more stable wireless connectivity in xxx conditions

or

iOS 5 is now available for release and amongst other more significant feature announcements they bury the comment in the release notes "also features enhanced wireless connectivity in xxx conditions"

....wait for it.

This thread has turned into a mere execise in polemics with no solutions in sight.

Anyone posting a new problem in this thread is wasting their time.

My suggestion to those who have a WiFi problem is to start a new thread specific to their problem.

Shutting down my modem for 5 minutes worked for me. No more wifi issues. But I do have all N network. My Ipad2 has been shut down every night and turned on everyday and wifi keeps working.

Well I, for one, am trying to fix my situation while supplying information to others in a similar situation.  Troubleshooting sometimes involves trial and error.  Anyone with the cash to spare can go buy a new router...

As for me and my outdated one (thanks, JimHdk for pointing this out to me), I seem to be having success after having turned off the 54g protection.  This is an idea I came to after reading another thread I mentioned earlier (yes, the very one with "bad" information.  Thanks again, Jim, for the warning.) about the Wireless N issues and iOS.  I don't know why it works or if it's permanent, but it's working right now.  So, yes, my router is outdated but not broken.  It just needs some tweeking that it didn't need before my iOS issues.  Not making a statment, just stating a fact.

I'd suggest trying different versions of 802.11b/g/n as other people seem to have found success as well.  I, unfortunately, am not a router expert and frequently misuse terms (like "support") so that's about as much detail as I can give.  If only we had a router expert on hand to chime in with some "support"...