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Here we go again....10.6.7 doesn't kill anything

14455 Views 81 Replies Latest reply: Aug 12, 2011 5:33 AM by Nicholas Roberts RSS
  • A A P L Level 7 Level 7 (21,730 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 9:35 AM (in response to a brody)
    Sorry, that is no substitution for testing on one's system.
    I realize after using and supporting Macs since 1985 that every update is claimed to ruin lives, kill pets, and break up marriages, but you can't claim there's no issues if YOU aren't using the update.
    If all Apple and others had to do is run a package on ONE Mac, nothing would work right.

    a brody wrote:
    Generally speaking, if you're not successfully running any change (update) on your system, you are not qualified to vouch for it's stability or lack thereof.


    I read the forums each update and see plenty of people who have no trouble whatsoever. The fact there are at least some who say this on the forums, says the error lies somewhere else, and not with the update. If any update had any real stability issues, it would appear for everyone. Since the update is not a common denominator, it can not logically be the cause people are searching for.
     MBP  Mac Pro  Touch  iPhone 4  iPad, Mac OS X (10.6.7),  AAA™ 
  • R C-R Level 6 Level 6 (13,835 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 9:46 AM (in response to a brody)
    Apple's descriptions of the revisions made by OS updates are generally accurate but far from complete. The only sure way of knowing if something still works as it did prior to an update is to test it with that update.
    2008 iMacs: 24"/3.06 GHz + 20"/2.66 GHz; White MacBook/2.4 GHz, Mac OS X (10.6.7), Kensington Trackball; Airport Extreme 802.11n; assorted iPods and older Macs
  • KJK555 Level 4 Level 4 (2,895 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 10:10 AM (in response to macjack)
    ?

    I am running on a 10.6.7 base install. I made an audio and DNS mod and of course I disabled
    the App Store. Other than that, its all 10.6.7. I don't run the last two Java updates because of
    some compatibility problems with existing java programs I use frequently. This is my everyday
    installation that runs daily. It may run for days without a reboot or being shutdown.

    The mods I made have undergone months of testing already. I have created my own packages
    for easy installation or reinstallation.

    Nuke The App Store project has been under constant development since the app store was
    introduced. It has now matured into an incredibly simple but powerful fix that takes away
    nothing from the 10.6.6/7 experience.

    I created the mDNSResponder package in response to DNS problems experienced by some
    users of 10.6.5, including myself.
    http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=12683257#12683257
    10.6.6 and later fixed most of the 10.6.5 DNS issues, but I just recently ran into a DNS issue
    that still exists in 10.6.6/7, when repeatedly logging in and out of ftp accounts on web hosting
    servers. It would lock me out after I logged in and out few times with a server not found error.
    flushing the DNS cache would fix it for a little while until it decided to do it again. Just for
    grins I installed the my old 10.6.5 patch and lo and behold, it worked great. As a bonus,
    some websites I frequently visit are now loading faster, especially when using Safari.

    I have multiple bootable installations for testing purposes. I have both 10.5 and 10.6 test
    installations in various flavors.

    The audio mods are the result of booting into early flavors of SL (10.6.0-10.6.2) and discovering
    how much better audio sounded on those versions. 10.6.2 and 10.6.4 audio kexts deliver the
    best sounding audio on my machine. Now whether this is specific, just to the era of audio hardware
    installed on my machine, I don't know. I just know it works for me. I have not publicly released any
    fixes for this issue.
    The kexts I substituted are the IOAudioFamily.kext and AudioAUUC.kext (from 10.6.2).

    Kj
    Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.7), nuke the app store,  "What!?, you didn't back it up?" 
  • macjack Level 9 Level 9 (50,445 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 10:20 AM (in response to KJK555)
    Sorry about that, my bad. I misread your post and thought you hadn't updated due to your audio settings.



    -mj
    iMac 24" 2.16 GHz 3GB RAM/22" external HP display, Mac OS X (10.6.7), iMac 2.16 GB /iPhone 3GS/ iMacG4 / LaCie d2s/UPS
  • Peter Bannon Level 6 Level 6 (10,080 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 10:55 AM (in response to a brody)
    a brody wrote:
    I have not heard of any significant changes that would make my answers flawed.


    I see what you mean. Your page you linked to on Kernel Panics includes text and graphics from the KB article updated to 2009. The only update to the original KB article (Old Article: 106227 "OS X 10.2 and later") was to say later OS were affected.

    There is a new KB article specifically for KP in OS X 10.6

    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?path=Mac/10.6/en/8965.html
    Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.6), OS X (10.4.11)
  • KJK555 Level 4 Level 4 (2,895 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 11:48 AM (in response to macjack)
    Most people say you shouldn't monkey around with OS updates, but nobody monkeys around
    with OS updates more than Apple. Take their video drivers for instance. Between 10.6.3 - 10.6.5
    updates, their updates broke video on quite a few various machines depending on what video
    card was installed.

    It would be quite foolish not to install every update that came along, if all Apple did was to improve
    on already existing OS components, but almost every time, especially lately, they are reinventing the
    wheel at almost every OS update. Since 10.6.0, they have totally overhauled Safari, iTunes, Open CL
    video, DNS support, Audio support and added the App Store, just to name a few.

    I make doubly sure now, that I have a good backup, before installing an SL OS update of any flavor.
    I sneak up on updates now, I don't let them sneak up on me.

    Kj
    Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.7), nuke the app store,  "What!?, you didn't back it up?" 
  • macjack Level 9 Level 9 (50,445 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 1:12 PM (in response to KJK555)
    KJK555 wrote:
    Most people say you shouldn't monkey around with OS updates, but nobody monkeys around
    with OS updates more than Apple.


    Not sure I'd call it monkeying around...

    Being one of the beta testers for new updates and upgrades I can tell you the OS is tested throughly on all sorts of hardware configurations. Apple doesn't take it lightly.

    I make doubly sure now, that I have a good backup, before installing an SL OS update of any flavor.


    NO ONE should be without 1, or 2



    -mj
    iMac 24" 2.16 GHz 3GB RAM/22" external HP display, Mac OS X (10.6.7), iMac 2.16 GB /iPhone 3GS/ iMacG4 / LaCie d2s/UPS
  • R C-R Level 6 Level 6 (13,835 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 2:37 PM (in response to KJK555)
    KJK555 wrote:
    I created the mDNSResponder package in response to DNS problems experienced by some
    users of 10.6.5, including myself.
    http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=12683257#12683257


    This is a good example of blaming an OS update for something it almost certainly didn't cause & "fixing" it by creating a hacked, unsupported OS that is likely to cause problems with subsequent OS updates. mDNSResponder has nothing to do with resolving domain names into IP addresses for browsers. As explained here, it implements the Bonjour "zero configuration" network discovery system service. It is not involved in normal DNS resolution.

    From what you say here & in the other thread, your DNS problems (which were not quite the same as the ones the OP of the other thread mentioned) are more likely caused by something you added to your system. My guess would be the AdSweep ad-blocking software, a "use at your own risk" javascript-based add-on that reportedly can cause the symptoms you mentioned with certain web pages.

    Likewise, if Apple's Java updates cause problems with certain Java-based apps, it is most likely due to problems in those apps that need to be resolved. Hacking the OS by mixing system files from different versions or avoiding certain updates altogether in effect creates a separate branch of the OS that Apple doesn't test or support. At best, it is a short term workaround for something that users can't otherwise figure out how to fix, but it is not a substitute for proper diagnostic procedures or something that users should rely on if they want a stable, secure, & sustainable OS.
    2008 iMacs: 24"/3.06 GHz + 20"/2.66 GHz; White MacBook/2.4 GHz, Mac OS X (10.6.7), Kensington Trackball; Airport Extreme 802.11n; assorted iPods and older Macs
  • WZZZ Level 6 Level 6 (11,880 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 3:40 PM (in response to R C-R)
    RC-R: mDNSResponder has nothing to do with resolving domain names into IP addresses for browsers....


    No. That information is way out of date; that's the way it used to work pre-10.6. In SL it is now responsible for DNS resolution. It used to be possible to disable mDNSResponder with no ill effects. Try that now and you won't be able to go anywhere on the net.

    That must be an old article you linked.

    Mac OS X v10.6 uses the mDNSResponder process for unicast DNS (Domain Name System) functions, as well as Bonjour functions. Disabling the mDNSResponder process will also disable unicast DNS resolution, and without unicast DNS resolution, Mac OS X v10.6 cannot resolve hostnames such as www.apple.com.


    http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3789
    iMac 21.5" 10.6.5, iMac G3/400 10.4.11
  • KJK555 Level 4 Level 4 (2,895 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 7:33 PM (in response to KJK555)
    Some of you guys sure are good at armchair engineering. .

    First of all, I don't give a fat Rat's rear about James Goslin's Java Garbage.
    What's it going to hurt if I don't run the latest version of that crap?
    Java is famous for previous version incompatibility. It was even worse in early
    versions. I usually run version 1.5 without problems for everything.

    Firefox runs its own version of java, and that's what I use for most internet browsing.

    If my SL installation is so hacked up, then how can it flawlessly run hundreds of apps
    including PPC apps and Java apps, both old and new? It takes everything I throw at
    and asks for more. It runs for days without kernel panics or needing a reboot doing
    real work like imitating web servers, running windows or linux virtual machines,
    graphic design, web design, audio and video file editing, and more.

    To imply my SL installation is riddled with deep dark disturbing problems is absolutely absurd.
    There may be something surfacing here, riddled with deep dark disturbing
    problems, but it is not my SL installation.

    Kj

    ☢ "Hail to the King, Baby!" ☢
    Duke Nukem Forever is ready for action..
    Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.7), nuke the app store,  "What!?, you didn't back it up?" 
  • KJK555 Level 4 Level 4 (2,895 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2011 10:46 PM (in response to macjack)
    +"Not sure I'd call it monkeying around..."+

    http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2790894&tstart=0

    I don't know exactly what to call it either, but, it appears,
    perhaps, the video wheel has been reinvented yet again.

    Kj
    Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.7), nuke the app store,  "What!?, you didn't back it up?" 
  • R C-R Level 6 Level 6 (13,835 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 24, 2011 2:18 AM (in response to WZZZ)
    WZZZ wrote:
    That must be an old article you linked.


    Apparently so. I stand corrected on that, but I still believe that there is nothing inherently wrong with mDNSResponder in Snow Leopard that would warrant replacing it with an older version.
    2008 iMacs: 24"/3.06 GHz + 20"/2.66 GHz; White MacBook/2.4 GHz, Mac OS X (10.6.7), Kensington Trackball; Airport Extreme 802.11n; assorted iPods and older Macs
  • woodmeister50 Level 4 Level 4 (3,690 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 24, 2011 4:01 AM (in response to KJK555)
    Video issues do seem to appear in each update. Seems that they fix one issue,
    then others come up. Mac Mini has seemed to get hit often. Somewhere
    around 10.6.5 update, it created video studdering issues and broke hardware acceleration.
    (Several threads throughout the net on this)
    And now, 10.6.7 has broken iTunes HDMI audio. Previous to update, iTunes purchased
    movies and imported movies with Dolby tracks played just fine. With 10.6.7, iTunes
    purchased Dolby tracks go silent and imported movies with Dolby tracks just plain freeze.

    I have experienced these issues, and my system is unhacked and well maintained. Always
    repair permissions, disk check/repair, and other maintenance on a regular basis. But, as
    way back in the beginning of this thread, I always have a backup plan and can always
    revert to a previous state.

    But, to continue with the breakage topic....

    Along with various other threads that you see about Apple branded applications, it almost
    seems that the people developing OSX don't talk to anyone else within Apple. One especially
    prominent issue is Macbook Air owners having crashing/freezing/other issues with iTunes
    just really stands out.
    2.4 GHz Macbook (early 2008), Mac OS X (10.6.6), iMac 24"(9.1),Mac Mini(2010),iPod touch(3G),Airport Extreme802.11N
  • cornelius Level 6 Level 6 (17,825 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 24, 2011 8:10 AM (in response to KJK555)
    I user Firefox, too, and have no issues with Firefox, Camino, or Safari, which are the browsers I use daily. O yes, I upgraded to 10.6.7 and have not seen a single issue so far.

    cornelius
    MBP 2.4 GHz 6 GB RAM, 500/7200 Seagate HDD; VMwFusion: XP Pro, Ubuntu, Mac OS X (10.6.5), PismoG4/550, 120/5400 Seagate HDD (10.4.11); Beige G3 OS 8.6
  • benwiggy Level 2 Level 2 (150 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 24, 2011 3:34 PM (in response to a brody)
    Yes, you are right. You should, in an ideal world, test every security patch and OS update in a sandboxed environment before applying it to a production machine. But most people don't have time for that, or aren't going to test every conceivable option in a test setup.
    Also, just because someone gets a problem after applying the update, doesn't mean the update caused it. Post hoc ergo propter hoc, and all that.

    However, the 10.6.7 has caused a range of people the exact same problem, in an area that was changed in the update. As a result, lots of people are having problems with fonts, printing and PDF creation, particularly with OpenType fonts. (MacUser UK are running a story that this is the case.)
    The fact that only some people experience the bug is not necessarily an indicator that the update is blameless. Plenty of bugs affect only some combinations of hardware and software.

    Personally, I only backup my data files because they are unique and valuable. If there's a problem with my OS, I'll reinstall from the DVD, rather than a backup of the system which may already contain the seeds of a problem. I've only ever once HAD to reinstall OS X in the last ten years, (and it took an hour over lunch to downgrade from 10.6.7 to 10.6.6).

    But let's try not to congratulate ourselves at being superior to teh noobs, just because some people don't have problems with 10.6.7, until all the facts are in.
    iMac 2006 2Ghz, Mac OS X (10.6.7), MacBook 2008

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