eMac freezes randomly, open window turns into broken up jibber

Hey, folks:

VERY interesting. I also have an eMac, purchased August 2004, and about two weeks ago it started periodically freezing - absolute, lockup, old-school-style freezing, with no kernel panic message or anything. The only thing it responds to is the powe switch when that happens. I've been beating my head against this, and now it looks like I may have found the root cause. Thanks.

I'll take it up with Apple, and suggest anyone else with this problem do the same. They're usually pretty good about addressing defects, but first they have to realize it's a defect. Hundreds of calls from people with the same problem should do that.

Hey, folks:

I just got off the phone with several Apple folks in a row, and here's the eMac screen-freezing situation as of 2 March. Apparently there haven't been enough reports of this defect yet to prompt Apple to issue an exception or recall on it, but the tech support staff exhausted all of the options troubleshooting it and agreed that it's probably a hardware problem. Likely culprits include the logic board and (oddly) the power supply. According to Customer Relations, that means that if the machine is out of warranty, you're on the hook for a repair that will likely run more than the machine is worth. However, if they later determine that it's worthy of a recall, they'll make that retroactive and reimburse people who paid for the repair (assuming those people call back and ask for that reimbursement). So place your bets.

One thing that will help is if everyone with these screen freezes and crashes can call Apple (800.275.2273) and work their way through the process until they're told their eMac needs hardware repair. That will add more of these to the database and increase the likelihood of a recall.

Hey, folks:

VERY interesting. I also have an eMac, purchased
August 2004, and about two weeks ago it started
periodically freezing - absolute, lockup,
old-school-style freezing, with no kernel panic
message or anything.

Well, that sounds familiar...

The only thing it responds to
is the powe switch when that happens. I've been
beating my head against this, and now it looks like I
may have found the root cause. Thanks.

I'll take it up with Apple, and suggest anyone else
with this problem do the same. They're usually
pretty good about addressing defects, but first they
have to realize it's a defect. Hundreds of calls
from people with the same problem should do that.

I got my eMac back from the Apple Store yesterday. It has the problem, no doubt. The Apple Store said that it'd cost about $720 to fix it, between the parts and labor. When I bought it, it cost $1k. There ain't no way I'm paying 72% of the purchase price to fix a factory defect... especially as I'd have had AppleCare on it, and the fix would be Apple's problem, except that AppleCare was unavaliable in Florida until December 2005, three months after my warrenty expired, and AppleCare must be purchased before the warranty dies.

The eMac still works, sorta. Well, it's frozen twice since I got it back, but it mostly works. I may get one of the floor-model iMac G5s which they're prepping for sale... if the price is right. I had been planning on getting a MacBook Pro. That's out of the question for the foreseeable future.

I hate this kind of thing.

I've already screamed to Apple Customer Relations. They were unmovable.

Greetings:

Well, I shall definitely be calling that 800 number off the hook as well as Apple Stores in Roosevelt Field and Soho. I'd recommend everyone to e-mail the Mac magazines for help and support as well; I'd like to see MacAddict stand up for us non-power user little guys for once. No, really, if Apple asks for a $700 repair tag and no compromise I'll say h.e.l.l. no and hi Dell laptop! I've been a Mac user since my co-Amiga days back 1985, so I'm not quitting lightly!

Apple really has to act on this lemon because their repute's on the line in some circles; what's their response going to be when eMacs at schools start dropping like flies?

Good luck all!!

James Greenidge

1.25 gig eMac and Performa 6320


1.25 gig eMac and Performa 6320

Curiously, I have just in the last several weeks seen exactly this same problem with a couple of my eMac's (out of about 200 (very reliable, for the most part) ranging from 700MHz to 1.42GHz), but they are 800MHz version from almost 3 years ago. I have done all hdwe tests I can, with no result, have replaced all software, with no result. There are no obvious hdwe failures(capacitors, etc). When I startup from any test CD, the symptoms do not occur. The only way to make them appear is to do something with complex graphics, which test disks don't seem to use.

My previous conclusion was a video hardware issue, which only shows up when the video is stressed in some way. But the consistent timing does not support that. I am now suspecting some graphics driver update that we all did around the same time, possibly in conjunction with a graphics hardware weakness or vulnerability.

Thanks to those who suggest removing extensions. I will pursue!

Well, the outcome of my discussion with someone in CR at Apple is that they acted like they had never heard such a thing and told me that basically I was screwed because I don't have AppleCare and we should go over the $50 software consultation or whatever they do when you phone them for help w/o AppleCare. I told them that I am pretty sure I know what the problem is, but they will hear nothing of it.

Basically, I was told that "people say all kinds of things on the forums" and that he was pretty sure it was a software issue as they have not heard any "official" cases of what we are describing and denied hearing of it before I phoned.

Frustrating. We can pay the $50, go through the software motions and he told me even if it WAS a defect, without AppleCare, we'd be responsible for any repairs. This is WRONG. I can see if it's a user error, but it is clearly a flaw in the system from what we are seeing so far.

I have yet to have found time to sit on the phone with their tech people for however long, but I will go ahead and do it just to see what the outcome is. Maybe this afternoon. Sigh

Sure, but those w/o AppleCare are being forced to pay $50 for them to tell us it's not a software issue. Hardware fix will cost us whatever they want to charge according to the Customer Relations I spoke with.

Well, the outcome of my discussion with someone in CR
at Apple is that they acted like they had never heard
such a thing and told me that basically I was screwed
because I don't have AppleCare and we should go over
the $50 software consultation or whatever they do
when you phone them for help w/o AppleCare. I told
them that I am pretty sure I know what the problem
is, but they will hear nothing of it.

Basically, I was told that "people say all kinds of
things on the forums" and that he was pretty sure it
was a software issue as they have not heard any
"official" cases of what we are describing and denied
hearing of it before I phoned.

Frustrating. We can pay the $50, go through the
software motions and he told me even if it WAS a
defect, without AppleCare, we'd be responsible for
any repairs. This is WRONG. I can see if it's a
user error, but it is clearly a flaw in the system
from what we are seeing so far.

I have yet to have found time to sit on the phone
with their tech people for however long, but I will
go ahead and do it just to see what the outcome is.
Maybe this afternoon. Sigh

They tried to sell me the $50 consultation, too, but since I knew what the problem was, I refused. I can't believe CR is still saying they've never heard of the problem. I was assured that my complaint was logged and would be seen by others at CR. Apple is just stonewalling and it is going to really hurt their reputation, especially when schools start experiencing these problems in large numbers. They'd better wake up.

I'll post my results when I get the computer back from Apple, but I'm betting it's leaking caps on the logic board.

Removing ATIRadeonDriver.bundle fixed things for me. That was the only ATI extension that had any effect. Screensaver, etc, are now lower-performance, but other things now work. No freezes yet, anyway. But that ext is almost a year old, so no explanation why the problem would just show up now. I don't believe in coincidences. Must be something I'm not seeing.

We too are having this problem. It occurs when the screensaver comes on. After about 5 minutes, the computer will freeze and the only way to get it to respond is to hold down the power button until it turns off and then to turn it on again. I have used Disk Utility to repair the drive and permissions, but it has not made any difference. The only solution I have found is to change the screensaver to "Flurry." Use of any other Apple screensaver or use of any other pictures leads to a freeze. For some reason, "Flurry" does not cause a freeze. Right now, this is the only way it is effecting our use of the computer. We purchased the computer at the end of June, 2004 through the Apple Education Store.

We purchased AppleCare at the time of purchasing the computer, but the website is not recognizing our serial number. It is on our receipt we were emailed from Apple. Any suggestions on either of these problems will be appreciated.

eMac Mac OS X (10.3.9)

Your info says that you're from Florida. AppleCare was not valid in the State of Florida until December, 2005. (I think it was 7 December, but I could be wrong on the day.) I'd get in contact with an actual human and see if your AppleCare is really, ah, real.

Greetings!

If you wish to see the ugly proof of blown eMac capacitors, check the image references at:

http://www.macintouch.com/readerreports/emac/index.html#mar04

This IS a manufacturing fault and the user should NOT dip into their wallet to fix it! One wonders why Apple, after the similar G5 iMac fiasco, didn't check out where else that bad batch of capacitors went. Worst (if you want to get dark about it) did Apple know that eMacs were as infected but let them go knowing the breakdowns would occur beyond the original warranty? You could almost imagine them wagging "Should'a Got Apple Care, so get it in your NEXT Mac." I don't think so. How Apple handles this determines whether I get a Dell laptop with the $700 Apple wants for logic board replacement.

James Greenidge


1.25 gig eMac and Performa 6320

The local AppleStore had a look at my eMac, declared its motherboard dead, said that replacing the motherboard would cost $720 (including labor costs) and said, in so many words, that if it were their machine they'd not spend the money.

They had a floor-model iMac G5 20" 2.1GHz which they'd just worked up for sale, cheap. I got that one. The difference in the price of the iMac and that of a MacBook Pro is rather more than $720... and I'd been planning on buying a MacBook Pro. Now I won't be, or at least not for a considerable time. I must have a machine which will run Classic, and the eMac can't be relied on (it works, sorta, for now, but that'll likely change, rapidly) and the MacBook has an Intel chip and so will never run Classic. (It might run OS 9, courtesy of 3rd-party hacks, later, but I will NOT buy hardware based on 'might' and 'hack'.) I'd planned to buy the MacBook before the end of March. Now, it'll probably be next year or perhaps longer before I buy another Mac.

Well I posted in another forum but here I am reading what I thought might be my unique problem.
Unbelievable- the common thread here is that all these machines are 1 1/2 years old-how obvious that there is a major problem with Apple-and of course being an avid faithful Apple purchaser-I know I never need to buy the warranty-as nothing goes wrong with them! HA! What a joke- My screen freezes after 5 minutes and gets all weird. Nothing has worked-might try the safe mode start up thing but other than that I get the feeling I am out of luck!

Well, everyone, I got my eMac back from the local Apple shop after replacing the logic board.

Apple paid for the diagnostic, the part AND the labour.
Originally I was told I would have to pay the labour.
So that was pleasant surprise.

So far, despite my best efforts to make the machine freeze, nothing works. That is to say that the machine no longer has the problem!

To all of you who are not getting anywhere with Apple Customer Relations (ACR), continue to call them. But remember, to kill them with kindness, be firm but tactful, resolved but not abusive. Have righteous indignance not anger.

As someone who has trained others for custome service, I know that this is the best way to get what you want. As evidenced by my experience with ACR.

This problem is widespread. It's a bad batch of capacitors. It even affects PC's, it's not just an Apple issue. Dell and HP/Compaq have had to do recalls for all the machines that used the bad capacitors.

It's just a matter of time and enough people reporting the issue for Apple to issue a recall even for out of warranty machines. However, each of us must go through the process of proving that this is the issue by going through all the steps of proving that it's NOT something else. A diagnostic by an Apple certified tech is REQUIRED by Apple policy. So have your local tech crack open the machine and look at the caps near the RAM. Really, you should only have to open the RAM hatch to see it. But have THEM document it and call Apple AFTER you call ACR and get a Case #.

We KNOW what the problem is.
Let's get the word out and get Apple to fix this as have other computer companies!