Previous 1 2 3 Next 31 Replies Latest reply: May 10, 2011 6:35 PM by Fred Davenport
Fred Davenport Level 1 (0 points)

But Apple's software (Mail, Ical, Address Book) continues to stink! at best.


My mail just quit again, I cannot send attachements and Address Book continues to triplicate every time I sync.


How about an good update to Apple's software BEFORE the next update to the HARDWARE....


Please, please, Please


< Edited by Host >

Mac Book Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.1)
  • thomas_r. Level 7 (30,707 points)

    Fred, you've been complaining about Mail for a very long time, and I know Ernie Stamper - our resident Mail super-guru - has repeatedly talked to you privately about your issues.  The last few times he has pointed this out on these forums, you fall suddenly quiet, then later start a new topic starting the whole issue over from the beginning.  This is not productive behavior, and it robs you of your credibility.  Especially when there's a big "Edited by Host" notice at the bottom of your post.


    As to what is causing your current issues, I have not kept tabs on you closely enough to know what's going on without more details.  Certainly, the behavior you describe is not normal.  Post more details, in a more polite manner, and you may get some more positive responses.

  • Fred Davenport Level 1 (0 points)

    Thx Tom,


    Sorry for my rants, but Mail continues to be awful! I am only a paying customer who continues to have issues. I am NOT a person who can explain why Mail stinks in computer terms.


    What am I suppose to do? It quits unexpectedly all the time, I cannot send jpg attachments that recipients can view and now I am required to explain the details of my problems in computer terminology.


    Been using Apple Hardware and software since 1978, and might be time that Apple starts making a priority to develop new and better software at the same pace they are making new and better hardware.


    I have sent numerous rants to the "old" discussions lists and numerous requests to "feedback" and Mail still stinks. iCal, Address Book & iMovie are not much better!


    What am I suppose to do?

  • thomas_r. Level 7 (30,707 points)
    It quits unexpectedly all the time


    That is definitely not normal.  Since you seem to be having problems with other apps (not sure what problems), they might not be caused by something specific to Mail.  However, you may want to consider rebuilding your Mail data from scratch.  Move the following items to the desktop (where '~' means "your user folder"):





    When you start up Mail the next time, it'll be like the first time.  Set up your accounts and settings all over again, then import any mailboxes from the old Mail folder on your desktop.  Like I said, that may or may not fix the crashing, considering the other things going on, but it's worth a try.


    I cannot send jpg attachments that recipients can view


    I am obviously not privy to the conversations, but I know I've seen Ernie say that he has e-mailed you personally about this issue, analyzed messages you have sent him and has determined it's an issue with your university systems.  There's not much more to be said in that regard.  When it comes to e-mail issues, Ernie knows what he's talking about better than anyone else here, as far as I know.  You'll need to address this with your university, or get yourself a different e-mail account (maybe a free GMail account, for example) that will allow you to bypass the university systems.


    Been using Apple Hardware and software since 1978, and might be time that Apple starts making a priority to develop new and better software at the same pace they are making new and better hardware.


    That's a pretty silly thing to say, especially considering that the gripe I have come to associate your name with - due to its frequent repetition - is apparently not an Apple problem at all.  Most people use the apps you mention without any issues.  You've got a problem with your system somewhere, but again, nobody can tell you where without more information.

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 (37,545 points)

    I would like everyone to know that Fred has never been anything other than appropriate in private exchanges.  I had thought our exchanges back in November of 2009 had centered on the problem, but apparently not as further posts demonstrate.


    Fred's university (which I will not be the source to reveal) is very PC centric in the network implementation.  It uses a Citrix based network, which requires that to use a MacIntosh, special client software must be installed.  That software is specific for Intel vs PPC.  I can only assume it may be kept uptodate with changes to versions of OSX, but have no way of knowing.  None of us in these forums are likely to be able to sort out the issues that might be related to this client software vs normal situation.  I can only guess that Fred does not find much friendly help from the IT people at his university.


    I have constantly encouraged Fred to take a Mac away from campus, use another email account and SMTP to test the attachments issues.  However, I cannot say if once the Citrix access client is installed, that a Mac will operate in a normal manner.  One would hope that it could, but how to determine remotely to the venue.



  • Ronda Wilson Level 8 (41,205 points)

    If Mail didn't work for me, I would use an online e-mail provider such as Gmail or Yahoo! and forget about trying to use Mail.


    Is there some reason that won't work for you, Fred?

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 (37,545 points)

    And, btw, Citrix from a PC will not work with Firefox -- only IE.



  • thomas_r. Level 7 (30,707 points)

    I would like everyone to know that Fred has never been anything other than appropriate in private exchanges.


    I didn't mean to suggest I otherwise.  It's clear, though, that he is frustrated and lashing out in the wrong directions.

  • etresoft Level 7 (27,786 points)

    Fred wants to use his university e-mail. Unfortunately, his university e-mail server scrambles his outgoing e-mail messages with an anti-phishing filter. The resulting messages can no longer be attributed to Apple Mail. In fact, it is such a poor filter that Apple Mail is probably the only e-mail client that could extract the original attachment from the message.


    I suggested to Fred that he use plain text e-mails instead. In this particular case, plain text e-mails with attachments might have better luck with the university servers.


    I have no idea why he is having problems with Mail quitting. He is certainly wasting his time complaining about it. The only people who can begin to address the problem are his university's IT staff. They caused it, so they should be the ones to fix it.

  • Fred Davenport Level 1 (0 points)



    Just want you to know that my mail quit again after composing a lengthy response to a colleague.


    Whether I am appropriate or not I am not that concerned. What does concern me is that my Apple software is becoming very, very undependable.


    I am not a programmer and do not know what do but write to this list, as well as send the exact same notes to feedback.


    Mail continues to quit often, as well as not allow me to send a photo attachment so that the recepients of my emails can view and save.


    I wil continue to itch to this site as all that read and view are very helpful and I know that Apple reads this concerns and has made improvements/fixes based on some of the info on this list.


    I also would prefer to stay with Apple products rather than run away to other software makers.


    Like my fav baseball team, I like and will also be loyal to Apple even if everything is not perfect.


    Hopefully Apple will fix Mail and also hope Apple starts to prioritize more its software like it has done for the hardware.

  • Fred Davenport Level 1 (0 points)



    They (campus IT) did not cause this, as All work perfectly until one of the recent Upgrades??? to Mail.


    Oh well, just lost another long email response after Mail quite (again!).


    Really disappointing and this discussion list if nothing else is a great place to vent and maybe, just maybe someone from Apple will see.


    Thx for listening to my rants,

  • etresoft Level 7 (27,786 points)

    Fred Davenport wrote:


    They (campus IT) did not cause this, as All work perfectly until one of the recent Upgrades??? to Mail.

    How do you know this? Which update was it?


    You are the only one experiencing this problem, so the burden is on you to track it down. Create a new account on your machine and see if Mail behaves the same way there. If that doesn't help, reformat your hard drive and reinstall the original OS that came with your machine and check mail. Then keep upgrading until it stops working. At that point you can ask your IT people to submit a bug report to Apple with the exact version of Mail that no longer works with their servers. Apple can work with the IT people to identify what they are doing with the server that is causing Mail to crash.


    Until you do that, your Mail problem will persist - forever. Ranting here is a useless endeavour. No one from Apple will ever see it - I guarantee. The only logical approach to solving your problem is to get a competent technician to look at your machine and fix it. There will be no bug fix from Apple because no one else is having this problem.

  • a Mac user Level 3 (715 points)

    EDIT: this is not a reply meant at you etresoft, I was trying to reply to Fred and then switched to full editor and then made the reply to see it was directed at you for some reason. My apologies.


    This is a hassle, have you tried calling apple support and requesting to speak with an engineer? If you can get that far then you can ask it a work order can be done to investigate what is happening. If apple can replicate what you are experiencing then they will try to fix the problem as quickly as they can. The hard part about this is getting through the 3 levels of phone reps to get to someone that can put you in contact with an engineer.

  • thomas_r. Level 7 (30,707 points)
    Just want you to know that my mail quit again

    Did you try the solution I suggested to you in an earlier message above?  If not, you should do so, and tell us the results.  If you tried some other fix, again, you should tell us what and what the results were.  If you have not tried any fixes, then you have only yourself to blame for the persistence of the problem.


    Hopefully Apple will fix Mail

    There is nothing to fix in this regard.  Mail is crashing because there is something wrong with your specific system.  Waiting for Apple to fix it will only lead to disappointment and, probably, further ranting.

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 (37,545 points)



    Back in November of 2009, if not a bit earlier, you began to complain that Snow Leopard, and its Mail program were faulty, and you thought them to be greatly changed from the Leopard.  Yet I found that your campus had made a great change in its network and associated servers around the same time -- this could be determined at the time from descriptions available on your university's web pages.


    You cannot deny that on your campus web pages the following is posted, and where I have redacted the name of your institution:


    Macintosh Users
    If you are using a Mac, you must go through the following additional steps the first time you use Citrix:

    • Download a Citrix client for Mac OS X to download the appropriate client (Intel or PowerPC).
    • Once you install, please visit: "a Citrix link for your school"
    • Click before logging in, click 'Advanced Options".
    • Make sure Native Client is selected under 'Remote Client Type'.


    This means your Mac is no longer standard.


    I also found an interesting site on Facebook -- I can furnish you the link -- that advertises the following:  "If you need help with your mac and the Tech help won't touch it because it's a mac . . . we're the answer."  You or someone familiar with Facebook can find by searching for xxxxxxxxxx Mac Help, where "xxxxxxxxxx" is the ten letter name of your university.


    It is clear you are not going to get help from your IT people, and as you say you are not "a programer" -- this works both ways, and means you are not in any position to judge that Apple is the problem, and not your campus network.  Those of us who have seen your emails know clearly where the fault lies.




    Message was edited by: Ernie Stamper

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