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lucafrombrooklyn

Q: Disable autosave

Hello, anybody figured out how one can disable autosave? I just *don't* want it, and I have my reasons.

Thanks,

 

l.

Mac OS X (10.7)

Posted on Jul 21, 2011 10:30 AM

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Q: Disable autosave

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  • by JoeyR,

    JoeyR JoeyR Aug 11, 2011 5:03 AM in response to papalapapp
    Level 6 (8,280 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 5:03 AM in response to papalapapp
    What I can say from my iPhone and iPad is that I have always missed ( and still do ) that "close" button to get rid of an app when I don't need it anymore. The "recent apps" stack just gets cluttered and annoying. Some start up from zero again and some open in the state they were cloesd. That's confusing.

     

    That's the one thing I really love about WebOS.  My first smartphone was a Plam Pré.  Having the ability to open and close each app as I want is a major advantage.  It's also done very well... you use the apps full screen... you swipe to make them into windows ("cards")... and then you can scroll through your open apps.  To close any of them, you just swipe up... brilliant.  WebOS is pretty much universally loved.  After Palm was bought out by HP, I was really hoping they would come out with some great hardware.  I had high hopes for the TouchPad.  Unfortunately, the reviews of the hardware have just been mediocre.  I ended up getting an Android tablet (the Asus Transformer) which is an excellent piece of hardware.  I immediately missed being able to have as many apps open as I wanted and closing them as I choose. 

     

    Apple has come out with some innovative ideas in Lion, but many of them drastically change the way the OS works.  I expect many people would never turn these features on if they had the choice.  By making them mandatory, I guess they hope that people will eventually see the usefullness of them (although, I'm not sure I will).  They're going away from some of the fundamental aspects of the way operating systems work... all operating systems.  That's a bold move and it does take some guts.  Unfortunately, it will make using other systems difficult for people who experience nothing but the iPhone, iPad, OS X ecosystem.  What happens when kids grow up  using nothing but "i" devices and then they get into the workforce and, more than likely, will be using Windows?  They won't know most of the basic functions with respect to saving and revising documents.  As an employer, I'm not going to be happy if someone looks at me like a chicken without a head when I ask them to "save a document".  It could also be a smart move on Apple's part to keep people in the Apple ecosystem as using Windows (and every other OS) will just seem too difficult... e.g. "What do you mean I have to save something when I'm done working on it?  It's so much easier on a Mac... it does all that for you.".  I am a big fan of OS X (well... have been).  I'm not thrilled with where it seems to be going.  Options are great, but making major changes in the way the OS works and making them mandatory are not exactly "options".

  • by Werner P.,

    Werner P. Werner P. Aug 11, 2011 5:30 AM in response to JoeyR
    Level 1 (5 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 5:30 AM in response to JoeyR

    Actually just to sum up my feelings about autosave. I work professionally, and usually have thousands of files I have to touch. Fortunately my tools dont use autosave and hopefully never will be (I rather doubt programming tools will fall into the autosave trap). But if they move over to the new system I have to move to another system.

    Thats the hard reality. The closest system to what I need probably then again will be Linux.

    But once going away from OSX why buying Apple at all then? Thats the question I will ask me at that stage. And I am probably not alone in this question then.

  • by KOENIG Yvan,

    KOENIG Yvan Aug 11, 2011 5:37 AM in response to RicksonQ
    Level 8 (41,790 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 5:37 AM in response to RicksonQ

    RicksonQ wrote:

     

    - First; who has decided that there "should" be no difference between an open and a closed program or function? And why is not the user considered fit to make that decision for her- or himself? Who can decide that better than the user?

     

    - Second; what is the rationale behind such a goal?

     

    In fact, this is a major logical difference, therefore software programs must be made accordingly - and be capable of being opened and closed at will.

    Apple team seems to wish to make iOS and OSX quite identical.

    As far as I know, they are free to decide what they want to produce.

     

    On the other side, we are free to decide if we agree and buy their new products or

    decide that we disagree and don't buy these new products.

     

    It's the common rule.

     

    Vendors decide what they try to sell, customers decide what they want to buy.

     

    Everything else is rant.

     

    When I worked as a potter, when a visitor started saying "it would be better to do this piece with this or that change", I showed him the door without any kind of precautions.

    I made what I wanted, the way I wanted.

    As you see, I'm consistent along years.

     

    Yvan KOENIG (VALLAURIS, France) jeudi 11 août 2011 14:33:28

    iMac 21”5, i7, 2.8 GHz, 4 Gbytes, 1 Tbytes, mac OS X 10.6.8 and 10.7.0

    My iDisk is : <http://public.me.com/koenigyvan>


    Please : Search for questions similar to your own before submitting them to the community

     

    To be the AW6 successor, iWork MUST integrate a TRUE DB, not a list organizer !

  • by papalapapp,

    papalapapp papalapapp Aug 11, 2011 5:42 AM in response to RicksonQ
    Level 1 (95 points)
    Mac OS X
    Aug 11, 2011 5:42 AM in response to RicksonQ

    RicksonQ wrote:

     

    papalapapp wrote:

     

    ----

    "I am afraid that autosave will never be able to be turned off just like the autoquitting apps. The goal behind all that, I suspect, is that in future there will be no difference between an open and a closed app. Apps just will be there for the user. (In the Lion beta the indicators in the doc were turned off.)"

    ----

     

    - First; who has decided that there "should" be no difference between an open and a closed program or function? And why is not the user considered fit to make that decision for her- or himself? Who can decide that better than the user?

     

    - Second; what is the rationale behind such a goal?

     

    In fact, this is a major logical difference, therefore software programs must be made accordingly - and be capable of being opened and closed at will.

     

    Writing these answers does not mean that I support them. I'ts what I think they think.

     

    - First; who has decided that there "should" be no difference between an open and a closed program or function?

    >>> The Apple usability engineers, obviously.

     

    And why is not the user considered fit to make that decision for her- or himself?

    >>> Because one decision less for the user is one improvement more for the OS.

     

    Who can decide that better than the user?

    >>> The Apple software designers, obviously.

     

    - Second; what is the rationale behind such a goal?

    >>> Corporate strategy is the only answer I can see right now.

     

    All this would be obsolete if there was a clear benefit from those new features.

  • by Marc Troy,

    Marc Troy Marc Troy Aug 11, 2011 5:41 AM in response to Werner P.
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 5:41 AM in response to Werner P.

    Werner P. wrote:

     

    Fortunately my tools dont use autosave and hopefully never will be

    Apple changed iWork '09 to enforce the new feature. I am very worried that other vendors update existing packages without giving the user an option. I bet I'll soon regret switching to the Mac App Store: You can't hide/skip updates.

  • by stefano67,

    stefano67 stefano67 Aug 11, 2011 6:17 AM in response to lucafrombrooklyn
    Level 1 (10 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 6:17 AM in response to lucafrombrooklyn

    Here is what I found (or at least what I believe I found):

     

    Applications supporting Autosave/Versions do not save directly to the file system, but they use a system process called revisiond. You can find it in

     

    /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/GenerationalStorage.framework/Versions/A/Suppo rt/revisiond

     

    It is possible to kill the process and avoit it to restart but in such a case not only versions autosave and versions are disable but it becomes also impossible to save a file in a normal way.

     

    A possibility could consist in cracking the revisiond executable so that it only saves when the user press command-s and not otherwise...

  • by RicksonQ,

    RicksonQ RicksonQ Aug 11, 2011 7:20 AM in response to papalapapp
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 7:20 AM in response to papalapapp

    papalapapp wrote:

     

    Per Inge Oestmoen wrote:

     

    "And why is not the user considered fit to make that decision for her- or himself?"

     

    >>> Because one decision less for the user is one improvement more for the OS.

     

    Comment: The more options, the more configurability a system has, the better it can be tailored to different needs and situations.

     

    We should inform Apple about that fact.

  • by KOENIG Yvan,

    KOENIG Yvan Aug 11, 2011 7:40 AM in response to Marc Troy
    Level 8 (41,790 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 7:40 AM in response to Marc Troy

    Why aren't you reverting to iWork 9.0.5 which is supported by Lion ?

    Why aren't you reverting to TextEdit 1.6 which is supported by Lion ?

    I apologize, I didn't checked if Preview 5.0.3 is supported by Lion but I guess that it is.

     

    Yvan KOENIG (VALLAURIS, France) jeudi 11 août 2011 16:38:09

    iMac 21”5, i7, 2.8 GHz, 4 Gbytes, 1 Tbytes, mac OS X 10.6.8 and 10.7.0

    My iDisk is : <http://public.me.com/koenigyvan>


    Please : Search for questions similar to your own before submitting them to the community

     

    To be the AW6 successor, iWork MUST integrate a TRUE DB, not a list organizer !

  • by papalapapp,

    papalapapp papalapapp Aug 11, 2011 7:42 AM in response to RicksonQ
    Level 1 (95 points)
    Mac OS X
    Aug 11, 2011 7:42 AM in response to RicksonQ

    RicksonQ, I am totally with you on that. Sadly the trend is the other way round: The less options the easier it is to use, the more people will use it. Personally I consider this as a not so good concept. The optimum is somewhere inbetween: remove complexity but not funcionality.

     

    But if OSX should work like iOS, there couldn't be any options to turn off autosave or autoquit. Otherwise it would not work.

  • by paulsalter,

    paulsalter paulsalter Aug 11, 2011 7:46 AM in response to KOENIG Yvan
    Level 2 (465 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 7:46 AM in response to KOENIG Yvan

    I have tried to revert these apps back but not a great deal of success

     

    When I put back the iWork apps from time machine they just hang (after it has asked what type of document you want to create), might be something that needs deleting first, unsure on this

     

    TextEdit - This restored quite happily and works fine

     

    Preview crahses upon launch when going back a version, it cant find library files

  • by Marc Troy,

    Marc Troy Marc Troy Aug 11, 2011 7:52 AM in response to paulsalter
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 7:52 AM in response to paulsalter

    Same here, I also couldn't get the old iWork to run. For me the TextEdit downgrade is pointless now, I've already paid money for BBEdit. It looks like I also gotta buy MS Office. I'll switch back to SL if AS can't be turned off in the next update.

  • by Tom in London,

    Tom in London Tom in London Aug 11, 2011 8:10 AM in response to Marc Troy
    Level 4 (1,626 points)
    Mac OS X
    Aug 11, 2011 8:10 AM in response to Marc Troy

    Marc - don't buy MSOffice 2011 because I believe it's going to be updated to function with Apple's Autosave.

     

    Get Office 2008 - it's better than 2011 anyway.

     

    And BTW these threads are driving me nuts. I keep getting sent back to the top of the thread, for no good reason....

  • by KOENIG Yvan,

    KOENIG Yvan Aug 11, 2011 9:09 AM in response to paulsalter
    Level 8 (41,790 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 9:09 AM in response to paulsalter

    Yesterdays I  helped a Polish user which was bored because after the update 9.1, the Charts inspector use Portuguese messages when the app is supposed to use Polish..

    She is running 10.7.

     

    She reinstalled iWork (I say iWork, the package, I don't know for the apps bought from MAS)  from the DVD then applied the updater 9.0.5 which she downloaded from my iDisk because Apple no longer deliver the updaters 9.0.4 and 9.0.5.

    Now she is working with this version under Lion.

     

    As far as I know, Time Machine does a bad work when we ask it to restore an old version of iWork apps because it restore only the applications files.

     

    When the apps were bought as a single package, there are several files in other locations which must be restored too.

     

    Pages 4.1 is unable to run with the set of shared files of version 9.0.5

    And Pages 4.0.5 is unable to work with the set of shared files of version 9.1

     

    These files are located this way:

    2011_08_01 à 16.30.10.jpg

     

    Yvan KOENIG (VALLAURIS, France) jeudi 11 août 2011 18:09:20

    iMac 21”5, i7, 2.8 GHz, 4 Gbytes, 1 Tbytes, mac OS X 10.6.8 and 10.7.0

    My iDisk is : <http://public.me.com/koenigyvan>


    Please : Search for questions similar to your own before submitting them to the community

     

    To be the AW6 successor, iWork MUST integrate a TRUE DB, not a list organizer !

  • by KOENIG Yvan,

    KOENIG Yvan Aug 11, 2011 9:13 AM in response to Tom in London
    Level 8 (41,790 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 9:13 AM in response to Tom in London

    Tom in London wrote:

     

    Marc - don't buy MSOffice 2011 because I believe it's going to be updated to function with Apple's Autosave.

     

    Get Office 2008 - it's better than 2011 anyway.

    (1) Mer.oSoft officially announced that they will deliver a version using the new features but they need some months to achieve the changes.

     

    (2) Sadly, Office 2008 dropped the macros feature

    At last, Office 2011 reintroduced them.

    I would buy none of them but use LibreOffice.

     

    Yvan KOENIG (VALLAURIS, France) jeudi 11 août 2011 18:13:06

     

    iMac 21”5, i7, 2.8 GHz, 4 Gbytes, 1 Tbytes, mac OS X 10.6.8 and 10.7.0

    My iDisk is : <http://public.me.com/koenigyvan>


    Please : Search for questions similar to your own before submitting them to the community

     

    To be the AW6 successor, iWork MUST integrate a TRUE DB, not a list organizer !

  • by tienga,

    tienga tienga Aug 11, 2011 8:54 PM in response to Steven W. Riggins
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 11, 2011 8:54 PM in response to Steven W. Riggins

    re: letting Apple know why we might want to turn off verions, here are my two cents:

     

    For me, it is because autosave/versions will change the "Date Modified" for files even if you are opening a file just to view it and close it again.  In fact, even if you use the revert to last saved feature, which will leave the document in its original state, the date modified still changes.

     

    Why does this matter?  Syncing.  For example, if I'm sharing a Dropbox file with my assistant and we are both viewing the file without saving, because the "Date Modified" gets updated, Dropbox will attempt to sync the copies but end up with two conflicting copies because they have different "Date Modified" values.  Apple's "Numbers" program will consider a file modified even if you just browse between different sheets, so any viewing of a document leads to re-syncing on Dropbox, and if more than one person is viewing you get conflicting copies even when you're not actually making any changes!  Basically versions now prevents easy file sharing between computers.

     

    So as excited as I am about versions, I would like to disable it for this reason, at least in my Dropbox folder.

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