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Restore bounce to Mail in Lion

108538 Views 446 Replies Latest reply: Apr 17, 2014 4:15 PM by cameronw RSS Branched to a new discussion.
  • petermac87 Level 5 Level 5 (4,065 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 6:46 PM (in response to el Duque)

    el Duque wrote:

     

    petermac87 wrote:

     

    Sorry, can you please back this up with facts? Looking forward to your response.

     

    Cheers

     

    pete

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Email_spam

     

    Because everyone knows wikipedia is the best source for quoting facts.  I don't see anything in there about bouncing being spam.  There seems to be a high level of ignorance here by members with the most dots.

    But can you please point out the bit about Bouncing being an effective deterent to Spam, especially given your complete trust in Wikipedia.

     

    Waiting on this reply.

     

    Thanks again

     

    Pete

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 Level 8 (37,455 points)
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    Aug 15, 2012 6:55 PM (in response to el Duque)

    As long as we are referencing Wikipedia, see the entry about backscatter, which these types of bounces are:

     

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backscatter_(email)

     

    ISPs can suspend users from internet access for being a source of back scatter.  It not only is ineffective, it is SPAM itself.

     

    Ernie

  • metalhawk Calculating status...
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 8:22 PM (in response to Ernie Stamper)

    It's not inherently SPAM. It's only SPAM when used ON SPAM (and not always in this case, but more than likely is these days...). Use the Junk button for SPAM, as people have pointed out, and Apple has tried to enforce by removing the funcitonality.

     


    I use bounce for messages that clearly are not SPAM. This is the special case that I need it for, and why I've used the hints in here to restore that functionality.

     

    I can't see a way you can define my bouncing those messages as SPAM.

  • petermac87 Level 5 Level 5 (4,065 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 9:30 PM (in response to metalhawk)

    Can you please post what I asked.

     

    Thanks

     

    Pete

  • metalhawk Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 9:34 PM (in response to petermac87)

    Why are  you asking me this? I explicitly didn't claim it was a deterrent to spam, you asked for that information from someone else.

  • petermac87 Level 5 Level 5 (4,065 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 10:01 PM (in response to metalhawk)

    metalhawk wrote:

     

    Why are  you asking me this? I explicitly didn't claim it was a deterrent to spam, you asked for that information from someone else.

    Sorry, I didn't notice you entering the post as what you said was such old claims that have already been dealt with over the past 18 months after Apple clearly dropped the bounce feature for a reason. If you have something new to add though, please do add it, but do back it up with facts as I asked the last poster (who hasn't or couldn't).

     

    Cheers

     

    Pete

  • metalhawk Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 10:14 PM (in response to petermac87)

    I wasn't replying to your comments, as I do agree that bounce isn't appropriate for Spam.

     

    I was, however, replying to Ernie who had (I thought) claimed that bouncing is always spam. I may actually be wrong about that, he may only be referring to a subset of spam, now that I re-read his comment.

     

    However, despite you saying this has been dealt with, you and some others frequently treat it as not, or at least seem to feel justified in saying bouncing is always spam. You did imply that in a comment yesterday. I don't believe we've ever "dealt with" that.

  • petermac87 Level 5 Level 5 (4,065 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 10:29 PM (in response to metalhawk)

    Have you searched these forums on the subject??

     

    Cheers

     

    Pete

  • metalhawk Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 15, 2012 10:44 PM (in response to petermac87)

    On what subject? Do you mean search for yet other threads on bouncing that might have "proved" that all bouncing is spam? 

     

    I've only read one other thread on it. I have, however, read this whole thread, which is what you appeared to be referring to. I've made this point here in this thread before, and don't believe that it has been refuted. I don't see it refuted in the other thread either, though some other posters disagree and seem to think "delete" is a better response than bounce. I've mostly found that bounce works for the case I'm using it for (mis-addressed email).

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 Level 8 (37,455 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 9:47 AM (in response to metalhawk)

    metalhawk,

     

    I replied specifically to a recent post of another talking about Spam and Wiki definitions.  If used indiscrimately, on every message you would have liked to dodged, it is Spam.  If you search this very topic, you will find that I earlier responded that there could be a use that is not Spam, that of trying to avoid some specific sender.  While I think that is about as effective as pulling down the blinds, turning offf the lights and pretending you are not home when you car is parked in the drive, it would probably not be Spam.

     

    Ernie

  • NathanB1068 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 9:55 AM (in response to objectivistzen)

    My my, what tedious drivel.

    The question is how to get "bounce" feature back.

    Who cares about whose definition of spam is best.

    If the Bounce feature works to keep the crap out of your inbox - then who cares if someone is shouting down at you from their high horse. 

    Get a life.

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 Level 8 (37,455 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 10:03 AM (in response to NathanB1068)

    The point of course is that it doesn't work, is frowned upon by networks, and can actually get the user banned.  Neither Apple, nor any of the other developers of email clients are going to bring it back -- their legal departments will not allow it.

     

    Ernie

  • metalhawk Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 10:29 AM (in response to Ernie Stamper)

    Ernie

     

    Yes, after I reread your post, I realized that you weren't saying that all bouncing is a bad usage or spam. I apologize for misunderstanding you. A lot of ppl coming to this thread have made that claim, and I jumped to conclusions.

     

    I do find it to be an effective for responding to specific senders. I get quite a bit of email from people who type the address wrong, on one of my email addresses. I don't feel like typing a response every time (though I suppose I could just set up a canned response), and then getting back apologies, so I use bounce. It seems to work (that is, I don't usually *continue* to get incorrectly addressed messages from the same sender.

     

    On a side note, posters are frequently suggesting searching these forums or "this thread" and I can't see an obvious way to do that, as is common at many other forums. Am I missing an advanced or thread search feature? All I can see is "search communities"

  • Csound1 Level 7 Level 7 (32,475 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 10:44 AM (in response to metalhawk)

    metalhawk wrote:

     

    Ernie

     

    Yes, after I reread your post, I realized that you weren't saying that all bouncing is a bad usage or spam. I apologize for misunderstanding you. A lot of ppl coming to this thread have made that claim, and I jumped to conclusions.

     

    I do find it to be an effective for responding to specific senders. I get quite a bit of email from people who type the address wrong, on one of my email addresses. I don't feel like typing a response every time (though I suppose I could just set up a canned response), and then getting back apologies, so I use bounce. It seems to work (that is, I don't usually *continue* to get incorrectly addressed messages from the same sender.

     

    On a side note, posters are frequently suggesting searching these forums or "this thread" and I can't see an obvious way to do that, as is common at many other forums. Am I missing an advanced or thread search feature? All I can see is "search communities"

     

    That is the search function, this forum is a collection of communities under the one banner, have you tried to use it? Screen Shot 2012-08-16 at 12.42.46 PM.png

  • Ernie Stamper Level 8 Level 8 (37,455 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 16, 2012 10:48 AM (in response to metalhawk)

    If you type in that box, and then click and hold your cursor, you can choose to impose some limits on where to search.  How narrow will depend upon the forum.  For this one, the limit offered will be to all 10.7 areas.  Try that.

     

    Ernie

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