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  • Layne_Staley Level 1 Level 1
    Mac OS X

    I read some of this thread and it's very helpful.

    I got a brand new 2011 Mini in an enterprise environment.  We cannot use Lion as it isnt compatible with proprietary software we have installed.  We cannot use virtualization.

    So I Deploy Studio'd my 10.6.8 image on the mini and noticed some odd items immediately, which brought me to this thread eventually and I see you had the same issues...

    When the mini is connected to a monitor via the HDMI-DVI connection, the mini has a ghost monitor in Sys Prefs.  I can mirror them to make it work yet it's not optimal.

    Also the cursor doesnt adjust correctly when moving over items.  It stays as a "text insert" cursor when it should be a hand and it doesnt line up correctly with text entry points.  The hand cursor stays a while then eventually turns into an arrow pointer, etc...

    I tried using the Thunderbolt port and I couldnt get the monitor to light even after zapping PRAM; I used a variety of adapters - VGA and DVI - and LCDs.

    There were also some graphical glitches; the dock was all messed up with broken graphics...

    I'm going to try to Carbon Copy Clone my stock coeporate 10.6.8 image onto the mini and see if there are any differences that doing it via Deploy Studio...


    Queation: Do you really believe Apple or anyone else will make a way for us to install SL on the 2011 Mac Minis or should I tell my boss we're screwed?


  • cathy fasano Level 2 Level 2
    Mac OS X

    I'm not sure why you say you cannot use virtualization...  We tested Parallels Server with Leopard Server and Snow Leopard Server last June, and found the Parallels people great as far as giving us a free trial.  It's not the cheapest solution for sure, but you should be able to tell in a day or so whether or not it's going to work for you, and then can decide whether to fork over the money.

  • Layne_Staley Level 1 Level 1
    Mac OS X

    We can't use virtualization software because the Director of IT says we can't.

    I need to find a way to install SL and I'm hoping someone here finds a way to do it without having to sacrifice performance and reliability.


  • MichaelLAX Level 1 Level 1

    Layne_Staley wrote:


    I read some of this thread and it's very helpful.

    I got a brand new 2011 Mini in an enterprise environment.  We cannot use Lion as it isnt compatible with proprietary software we have installed.




    Que[s]tion: Do you really believe Apple or anyone else will make a way for us to install SL on the 2011 Mac Minis or should I tell my boss we're screwed?




    What is the publisher of your proprietary software's position on an upgrade compatible with Lion?  Will they?  When?


    The new Mac Mini contains several hardware issues that were never faced by Snow Leopard, such as the i5 or i7 Intel processors, Thunderbolt, etc.


    My educated guess is that they will NOT release an update to Snow Leopard that will address these issues.  These issues are already addressed in Lion and that is where Apple wants the OS X consumer to migrate to; not make it easier to migrate backwards.


    I have no direct crystal ball into Apple; just years of being an Apple consumer, and as they say: "past performance is no guarantee of future performance!"


    That being said, I do remember that Apple DID release a System 6.0.8 update (to implement TrueType fonts) AFTER they released System 7!

  • Layne_Staley Level 1 Level 1
    Mac OS X

    Upgrade is far too costly and we're in the process moving to a more off the shelf solution yet that won't happen for a year.  So we need Apple hardware for about a year that's compatible with Snow Leopard/Rosetta.

    I saw a few hopeful posts here that hint that there may be an Apple or 3rd party solution to this widespread problem. 

    I'll keep monitoring the posts here and hope for the best, yet I understand it's a long shot.


  • MichaelLAX Level 1 Level 1

    Ah, Rosetta:


    Here is what I did to run my Rosetta software on the new Lion Mac Mini before I was able to install Snow Leopard in Parallels 7:


    Pick up the cheapest Mac Mini you can find in Craigslist or eBay; either PPC or Intel, that will work with your proprietary software.


    Connect it to your current Display that you normally use for the new 2011 Mac Mini and connect it to your enterprise network either through Ethernet or Airport.


    Install Leopord if PPC, or Snow Leopard if Intel and your proprietary software.


    In System Preferences: Sharing - turn on Screen Sharing.


    In System Preferences: Network: Advanced... - Select DHCP with Manual Address and give it a Fixed IP.


    Shut it down, remove the Display (and reconnect the Display to your new 2011 Lion Mac Mini) and Restart both of them (older Mac Minis may require the Display Adapter to be connected to make it think that a Display is connected; newer ones do not).


    On the Lion Mac Mini: In the Finder: Use the GO menu to Connect to Server and enter "vnc://" but do not enter the quotation marks and substitute the Fixed IP from the older Mac Mini, click the + symbol to "remember" this entry and then click CONNECT.  Click the Green Button in the upper left hand of the window or otherwise resize it to full screen.


    Connect to your enterprise network as needed.


    You will now have remote screen sharing and can run your proprietary software.


    In my case my Lion Mac Mini is my "server" and stores all of my data files, serves them out to all of my computers and uses Time Machine for backup.  So I was able to use my Lion Mac Mini to remotely control another computer that was running my Rosetta software that in turn was using my data files and saving them back to my Lion Mac Mini; and at the same time I was able to use my Lion Mac Mini to run all of my non-Rosetta software, too.


    Saves you from having to tell the boss "we're screwed!"


    Good Luck!

  • Steve Jolly Level 1 Level 1

    Okay, you clearly have a bad attitude. Whatever happened to realistic cynicism, and healthy, weight-loss-promoting depression and resignation?


    MichaeLAX, if you keep this up there will be LOTS of happy, Snow-Leopard-running 2011 Mini users, and huge numbers of folks will spend more money on tiny but powerful Macs, and the US economy will collapse because no one will be paying debit card fees or buying netbooks anymore. The world economy goes kerploop! In the Age of Nihilism that follows, Eric Schmidt is elected World President, everyone is forced to adopt Chrome, and while we're waiting for useful software the lack of procreation ends with total annihilation of the human race. Only Siri will survive to testify, someday, to the occasional visiting alien about human glory and The Meaning Of Life. Unless, of course, Apple steps in and loans every country a few billion. All of this is inevitable.


    So, buy an Android phone and wait for the virus apocalypse! Invest in the economy, resist growing unemployment by buying two Acer netbooks or maybe a used G5 (as it happens, I have one to sell, now that my 2011 Mini is zooming along with Rosetta, but of course I am above having mixed agendas). And, no, Apple will not update Snow Leopard to run on the 2011 Mini (you can expect Global Glaciation down in ****, first!), but they may have another little helpful surprise in store for us if my source is accurate. So, stay tuned.


    And, actually, your little trick with the vnc and screen-sharing is one of the neatest, most elegant things I've read in Discussions in quite a while. Nice! Great thinking! -- and thanks!


      Yes, we can! Some of us have!    Free the Snow Leopard 27,000 (yup!)!!

  • donikatz Level 1 Level 1

    Can someone please clarify: has anyone successfully installed SL on a 2011 Mac Mini WITHOUT display problems? Or are the cursor and other graphics problems universal? Slow performance is okay for my needs (for now), but the graphics issues are a non-starter. TIA

  • dimoe Level 1 Level 1

    I had no display-problems (24'' Dell-Display) with Snow-Leopard on my MacMini (2011)

    But I stopped it after two days, because it was to slow:

    Geekbench (32 bit) with SnowLeopard: 1700

    Geekbench (32 bit) with Lion: 6700


    Now I have a virtual Leopard for my Rosetta Stuff

    Geekbench (32 bit): 4.800

    (It's faster than my Snow-Leo on my MacMini 2010 Geekbench (32 bit): 4000)


    But I don´t like Lion with its restrictions!

    At the moment I work with my old Mini (and SnowLeopard), only for renderings I use the new one!


    I wan't ONE Apple-Macintosh for all my applications!

  • Yo Yo Scrape Level 1 Level 1

    I just booted a mini released with 10.7 using a bootable 10.6 install on a USB HD (with all updates installed) and I can confirm that it boots. I am seeing a bit of weirness with the way cursors draw, but other than that, it seems fine.

  • Kimbakat Level 1 Level 1

    This is AWESOME!!!

  • Steve Jolly Level 1 Level 1

    SCOOOOOORRRRRRE!!!!  (sorry, folks!  couldn't figure out a better "celebration word" than SCORE like they shout it in a soccer match!)  We got about 90% of our wish, and it's enough, IMHO!


    Apple has quietly approved a policy by which certain Virtualization software can now run PREVIOUS system versions -- specifically, Leopard and Snow Leopard -- under Lion version of OSX.  Wahooooo!


    A quote this morning from MacRumors:

        ...Those rules seem to have changed a bit in the latest version of VMWare 4.1 which was released on Friday. As first noted by Macworld, VMWare's Fusion no longer strictly prohibits the virtualization of client editions of Mac OS X Leopard and Snow Leopard.

    But one big change with this update isn’t documented anywhere: The software has been modified so that it will run the non-server versions of Snow Leopard (Mac OS X 10.6) and Leopard (Mac OS X 10.5). Previously, VMware Fusion supported virtual Macs running Lion, Lion Server, Snow Leopard Server, and Leopard Server.

    The change in support, however, is a bit subtle.  Instead of prohibiting the use of non-server Snow Leopard and Leopard, VMWare prompts the user to verify that they are licensed to run such copies -- and if you say "yes," you're up and running Snow Leopard (or Leopard) under Lion!  Oh, did I say "SCORRRRRE!" ??


    As someone else wryly commented in another forum:

        Yes, it's kinda the software version of Don't Ask, Don't Tell -- but it boots for me !


    More details will follow -- and remember, virtualization software is cheap cheap cheap and very powerful, and Fusion provides make-goods and work-arounds for the code and drivers that are missing from Lion and from the chips that support Lion (but don't have various snippets needed by Snow Leopard) that are in the new LIon-only versions of Macs! 


    And, of course, that includes the 2011 Mac Mini!


    NOTE:  I have not used this yet, so I can't personally vouch for its smoothness, completeness, etc., but knowing VMWare's commitment to quality and effectiveness in a very competitive field -- and the same for the other virtualization companies -- you can expect a very workable situation very shortly!  There are innumerable thousands of people waiting for this step, and who will embrace it and buy / update the virtualization software needed to make this not only possible but easy and effective!


        Yes, we can! We have!    Free the Snow Leopard 33,000!!

                           (more views, here, every day!







                 LION. SO, SHARE!  SHARE!  SHARE!

  • Steve Jolly Level 1 Level 1

    And one last thing:  (heh!)


    My personal thanks -- and, I think I can say this, for everyone -- our deepest appreciation to the various folks at VMWare and Parallels who took up this issue and pushed it forward. 


    And our thanks to the management at Apple who saw it as a reasonable request and who tried to find a way that would make Snow-Leopard-under-Lion possible. (Think:  the recent, temporary reissuing of Final Cut Pro and other recent help-the-customer-even-more moves by Apple. Great work, folks!)


    Their goal -- all of them -- was to allow this resolution of the problem without compromising the rules that keep Macs moving forward, hardware-wise. The decision to allow new generations of Macs to only support the latest OS is the opposite (very intentionally!) of the Microsoft Windows situation, where layers of legacy OS support leads to much of the sluggishness and crash-prone behaviors that many of us are happy to escape whenever we hear the fine chime of a Mac starting up!


    (Why is my Mac Mini doing a little Snoopy-dance over on the desk right now? Expecting a nice Thanksgiving present and a dose of sterioids, Little Buddy?)   ;-)


         And, my thanks to the thousands of you who've kept checking in to see if common sense and commercial competition would prevail.  It did!  Now, if VMWare and Parallels are smart, there will be intense competition to make each company's SnowLep-under-Lion product the best and fastest. There are more thousands of Mac owners who need this than I think they realize -- yet!  So, let them know -- take a moment to email them!


    This may require some hard hours of work by their coding teams. Making this run fast and perfectly brings up challenges that are much greater than it might seem at first glance. I hope that VMWare and Parallels move vigorously forward, even if it means issuing a special optional dedicated version that requires a small extra charge from customers. Personally, I'll pay to play on this one so long as the charge is reasonable. (Oooops! -- Please do not shoot the messenger!)



           Yes, we can! We have!    Free the Snow Leopard 33,000!!

                                (more views, here, every day!

  • lancefromsquamish Level 1 Level 1

    been following this discussion for awhile as I've been thinking of a new mac mini. If so how do I using

    Virtualization install my current version of snow Leopard family pack software with it's associated rosetta

    dependent applications to the new mini Os lion

  • dimoe Level 1 Level 1

    Of course its fine if it's legal to use the client version of SnowLeo in a virtualisation, but this doesn't work for all applications!

    I have a scanner with an FireWire interface and use Silverfast-Software.

    Firewire isn't supported in virtualisation

    The new Version of Silverfast (Lion compatible) doesn't support this type of scanner!


    I started in 1995 with a Mac and paid a lot for My Software.

    I don't want to buy everything new every MacOS Upgrade!

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