Previous 1 2 3 Next 80 Replies Latest reply: Mar 17, 2012 10:59 AM by ~Bee
Alf Megson Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

I have been having many problems with OS X 10.7 Lion since I installed it.

 

I have spent hours every day trying to find answers on here and I have tried everything. I haven't seen any posts where any of the issues I have been experiencing have been properly fixed.

 

I note that as of this moment there are 14005 threads about Lion - just over two weeks since its release, compared with 83617 for Snow Leopard which has been out for over two years. Admittedly, many threads concern the novel ways which Lion is installed, but even so, I mean come on! 16.75% of the threads in 2.273% of the time?

 

There are many threads covering the same topics and I have tried everything in my armoury as well as every suggestion. I'm not asking for any more technical support from well meaning people who are simply repeating the same suggestions ad nauseam to a growing number of people who are getting increasingly fed up.

 

There are people who have had positive Lion experiences and people who have had bad Lion experiences. I only read the same repeated suggestions from people with good Lion experiences - I am yet to read of anybody who has had a bad Lion experience and has fixed it. And by bad, I don't mean that they can't get used to natural scroll direction and needed to be show how to change it in the System Preferences. I mean bad like startup still taking several minutes and applications being unresponsive for about ten minutes after first hitting the power button.

 

I just want to list the problems I have had and which I am still having nearly after over two weeks and having re-installed Lion several times by different means, App Store, Utilities Partition, burned DVD, re-download. Fixed permissions, ran disk utility, reset the PRAM, reset SMC, cleaned caches, booted in Safe Mode etc. etc. not just once or twice but many times each. I do not have restore windows selected and I always deselect 'Reopen windows when logging back in'. I have allowed Spotlight to fully complete its indexing on every installation - the last few installations I have completely left it alone for an hour or however long it took.

 

Reluctantly, I even removed my Windows partition - though I don't regret that now - but it was there for a reason. That was one of the main causes of installation problems that I had read about but it had not affected my installation. Anyway, I did two further Lion installations after that and it made zero difference.

 

My inventory:

 

Slow startup, three minutes plus. The only way I have managed to reduce this my ten seconds was to turn off automatic login so that I didn't have to type my password.

 

Can't use any applications for up to ten minutes after startup - constant SBBoD.

 

Slow finder, frequent SBBoD when opening windows - windows are empty for up to thirty seconds.

 

Slo-o-o-ow scrolling. Just occasionally but s-o-o-o annoying.

 

MacBook Pro gets very hot. I have had to buy a gizmo for it to sit on to allow more air to flow under it. It was never this hot under Snow Leopard.

 

Save dialogue boxes also slow - also don't show folder content for up to thirty seconds.

 

Frequent drops in WiFi - evident either as lost connection to server alerts or the new look Safari cannot connect page informing me that I am not connected to the internet.

 

Video frequently freezing in QT and VLC. Strange garbled images when going to full screen - bits of desktop mangled up with bits of screensaver - incidentally, I selected Higher performance graphics in the Energy Saver preference pane but that didn't make a difference and seems to reset itself on every reboot.

 

General video performance.

 

My MacBook Pro does not go to sleep as per the settings in Energy Saver. It only sleeps when I shut the lid and never if I leave it open.

 

Battery life is greatly reduced, probably due to the last point.

 

Time Machine almost always active, mainly because it takes so long to start and cleanup but a 12MB backup can take 45 minutes. Then 15 minutes later it starts again.

 

Many frequently visited web [pages no longer look the same, particularly pages with embedded YouTube videos and images in frames, as much as half the video image is obscured. I have revisited with other browsers and they look fine.

 

Launchpad appearing empty with the words Looking for applications for ages after every reboot.

 

Anything to do with Flash and Safari is messed up. YouTube controls don't work properly and they have the same odd behaviour in other things like Google NASDAQ graphs - the cursor is 'sticky'. This doesn't happen in Firefox.

 

Pages randomly reloading - especially when using more than one tab. Very, very annoying when filling in forms etc. and you have to start again from scratch.

 

Typing often freezes for several seconds, mainly in Safari but also in Text Edit.

 

Not to mention the Mail fiasco on my first installation. I lost everything and had to manually import everything from a backup.

 

And I haven't the inclination to even start on the new 'features' which cannot be disabled.

 

So, are Apple going to fix it?

 

 

MacBook Pro 17' 2.66GHz, Mac OS X (10.7), 8GB RAM, 500GB HD (225GB free)


MacBook Pro 17' 2.66GHz, Mac OS X (10.7), 8GB RAM, 500GB HD
  • etresoft Level 7 Level 7 (26,880 points)

    Alf Megson wrote:

     

    I note that as of this moment there are 14005 threads about Lion - just over two weeks since its release, compared with 83617 for Snow Leopard which has been out for over two years. Admittedly, many threads concern the novel ways which Lion is installed, but even so, I mean come on! 16.75% of the threads in 2.273% of the time?

    With each new Apple product, the hype grows exponentially. As more and more people use Macs, you are going to have more and more reports of problems. I can assure you that the vast majority of valid Lion threads are the same problems that people reported with each new version. The rest are just rants.

     

    I just want to list the problems I have had

     

    I would be better to address each problem individually. I will try my best, but there is a lot to work through here.

     

    Slow startup, three minutes plus. The only way I have managed to reduce this my ten seconds was to turn off automatic login so that I didn't have to type my password.

     

    Startup and Login are two entirely different things. You have a 10 second startup. There is something going on with your user account that is likely causing your problems. Look in your Login Items first. You might try creating a new account to see how it performs. Sometimes, your old account is just really screwed up and you end up migrating all your old problems into the new system.

     

    Can't use any applications for up to ten minutes after startup - constant SBBoD.

     

    Slow finder, frequent SBBoD when opening windows - windows are empty for up to thirty seconds.

     

    Slo-o-o-ow scrolling. Just occasionally but s-o-o-o annoying.

     

    MacBook Pro gets very hot. I have had to buy a gizmo for it to sit on to allow more air to flow under it. It was never this hot under Snow Leopard.

     

    Run Activity Monitor and see what is going on. Show All processes. Something is taking all of your CPU.

     

    So, are Apple going to fix it?

     

    Unfortunately, nothing you have described is typical Lion behaviour. I think a new account will fix all of your problems. You might even want to create a new admin account, log in to that, and delete your old account altogether. Then, create a new account with that old user name and manually copy only your documents from backup. That should run much, much better.

  • Alf Megson Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    I don't understand why you say that there is a 10 secomnd startup.

     

    There is about 10 seconds before the gearwheel appears beneath the Apple logo but then there is about three minutes before I was asked for my password. Up to that point, nothing in my user account is relevant to the problem because, in simple terms, the MacBook does not have access to it.

     

    I only recently enabled automatic login so up until then, this was quite evident. As stated, I tried Safe Booting several times - which I know increases the boot time due to it running a disk check, but after boot, all the subsequent problems were evident.

     

    Howebver, I have disabled all third party startup items in sets, the way that Conflic Catcher used to do in the olden days, before OS X.

     

    Since discovering all these problems, have Activity Monitor as a startup item :-)

     

    Not typical, eh? Thanks for reading...

  • J.C Level 4 Level 4 (1,595 points)

    I suggest having a look in the Console to see if there are any messages which keep repeating or indicating a process that constantly keeps crashing and respawning, this would be difficult to spot with Activity Monitor.

     

    Slow start up and frequent SBBoD can indicate hardware (usually a hard drive) that is in the early stages of failure. Make sure all your important documents are backed up, if this is the case a complete failure could happen suddenly and without warning.

    I suggest running a surface scan using a utility such as TechTool or Drive Genius if you have them. Apple's built in Disk Utility may pick up or indicate errors related to volume corruption. Disk Utility does not do surface scans so it will not pick up bad blocks on the disk.

     

    I have heard a few reports of Lion not installing properly when a windows partition is present. It may have something to do with the recovery partition that is created during the Lion installation.

  • etresoft Level 7 Level 7 (26,880 points)

    I misunderstood what you were saying. So what does Activity monitor report? What about Console.app?

  • Alf Megson Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    So, as none of the startup slowness, SBBoD occurred three weeks ago, I guess I can assume that OS X 10.7 Lion is responsible for the impending failure of my one year old HD, is it?

     

    BTW, the SMART status of my HD is OK. Prior to installing Lion the first time I ran TTP and iDefrag. I had been experiencing slow boot times (as much as thirty seconds! I didn't realise how lucky I was !). I managed to fix that by removing duplicate fonts (I forgot to mention, that was the very first thing I did after installing Lion). Everything was zippy!

     

    Yes, I have considered TTP and other utilities again, but to be honest, given the flakiness of LION would you really risk everything on the compatibility of third party software with a new OS? I'm afraid I wouldn't.

     

    I also forgot to mention that SBBoDs often conclude with a software crash. I don't fancy having utilites crashing midway through a repair.

     

    I already stated that I had used Disk Utility (also during Safe Boot) and that I was aware of the problems of installing with a Windows partition and that I had removed my Windows partition and re-installed Lion twice since.

     

    I also said that I was no longer looking for technical support from here. I am simply asking if Apple are going to fix the problems. Had I not exhausted all my resources, I would not have made this bold statement.

     

    This is probably at least the twentieth major updrade I have carried out from OS 1.0 through 9.2.2, 10.0, 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, 10.4, 10.5, 10.6.

     

    The only time I ever had issues anything like the ones I am having now was when I first installed OS 10.0 back in 2001 on a G3 desktop. It was appallingly slow. Back then, Apple released a fix within three weeks and withing three months had released four updates - try updating OS X on a dialup connection - which I had then!

     

    As I stated in the OP, there are many who are not experiencing problems, and for them I am extremely happy. But those who are not experiencing problems are not the best to judge those who are.

     

    I've done my bit. Now, just as in 2001, it's over to Apple.

  • Alf Megson Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    Apart from kernal_task during the Spotlight indexing, there was nothing out of the ordinary apart from application not responding alongside Safari and Mail for up to two minutes.

     

    I have 8GB RAM and never has more than 50% been in use. No excessive CPU or threads. Not since the iniitial Spotlighting.

     

    Re: Console, as stated, I'm finished with diagnostics.

  • a brody Level 9 Level 9 (64,655 points)

    > I guess I can assume that OS X 10.7 Lion is responsible for the impending failure of my one year old HD, is it?

     

    Not directly responsible.  Hard drives die.  Software can't cause hardware to fail.  This is why one

    MUST

    have a backup plan.  See my backup FAQ*:

     

    http://www.macmaps.com/backup.html

     

    If you don't have a backup plan, only you can be responsible for your data loss.

     

    >BTW, the SMART status of my HD is OK. Prior to installing Lion the first time I ran TTP and iDefrag.

     

    SMART doesn't cover all diagnostics a hard drive can be told. Techtool Pro doesn't either.  Some only are available to hardware vendors.  iDefrag is not recommended unless your data is backed up, because a simple power loss during its use can cause data loss, and only use it if you have lots of 20MB files you can't just archive away and want to keep in its own sequential data area of the hard disk.

     

    >I've done my bit. Now, just as in 2001, it's over to Apple.

     

    Welcome to viruses, spyware, compatibility issues, and hard disk failures all at the same time.    Hard disk failures, and compatibility issues are all you really have to worry about with Apple.  Double the trouble as far as I consider.  I suggest reading my upgrade FAQ* before giving up on Apple:

     

    http://www.macmaps.com/upgradefaq.html

  • a brody Level 9 Level 9 (64,655 points)

    I might add Dell sold my parents a machine with a hard drive that was Dead On Arrival.    It can happen to anyone, any company.  One year for hard drive life while not something that always happens, is not uncommon.

  • J.C Level 4 Level 4 (1,595 points)
    So, as none of the startup slowness, SBBoD occurred three weeks ago, I guess I can assume that OS X 10.7 Lion is responsible for the impending failure of my one year old HD, is it?

    Not necessarily Lion but the process of installing Lion may have surfaced an issue which you were unaware of.

     

    I also forgot to mention that SBBoDs often conclude with a software crash. I don't fancy having utilites crashing midway through a repair.

    As the Console app logs crash reports it would be extremely helpful to post a crash report as it may indicate exactly what is happening during that beachballing period.

     

    I also said that I was no longer looking for technical support from here. I am simply asking if Apple are going to fix the problems.

    No one knows what bugs have been logged with Apple and which of those they consider high priority. You may want to log a few bug reports through bugreport.apple.com you will then be able to see the status of the bugs you report and if Apple require further information/clarification they will ask for it.

  • Alf Megson Level 1 Level 1 (95 points)

    I HAVE a backup plan!

     

    I have a Time Machine ReadyNAS Duo which means that I have two full backups of my system. I also have additional backups of specific folders.

     

    Power loss? I'm on a MacBook Pro with supposed 8 hour battery life and when I run anything like iDefrag, I have it connected to an APC UPS, itself backed up by a 12v battery from a Land Rover Defender which is connected to an array of solar panels. So, an arctic winter notwithstanding, I should be OK.

     

    Welcome to viruses etc.. don't have a clue what you are talking about, sorry...

     

    I only tried to list my problems because if I didn't, somebody would have asked and then I would have had to go through all the procedures I have already tried yet again. I was trying to avoid the tedium.

     

    TTP is not the only utility in my armoury, but it is one which was mentioned by a previous poster. Do you need a complete inventory of every utility I have installed before my topic post question becomes the actual topic of discussion?

     

    Is Apple going to fix OS X 10.7 Lion?

  • a brody Level 9 Level 9 (64,655 points)

    >Welcome to viruses etc.. don't have a clue what you are talking about, sorry...

     

    You said "it's over Apple", suggesting you wanted to move away from Apple.  That's why I said "Welcome to viruses."  Moving away from Apple is the surest way to move away from a nice secure computer ecosystem. Now I won't fault you for not desiring to upgrade, but blaming Apple for things which are not its fault, and assuming Apple will fix certain things when only you have experienced them, and a few select other people, and not everyone running Lion is experiencing these issues, is the surest way to lead yourself to disappointment about Apple's products.  Now I'm glad to hear you have a backup system, but let's not get carried away by Apple's supposed bugginess.  We are here to discuss and troubleshoot why individuals get into certain tedious issues.  We aren't here to rant about anything. 

     

    >Is Apple going to fix OS X 10.7 Lion?

     

    Is a bit like asking, will Apple come to my doorstep and make my machine run like a Ferrari? This is a user to user forum, so no one can know if or when or how Apple is going to change its operating system in the future.  The best you can hope to do is isolate your present system issues.  Let's stop asking questions for which no one has an answer.  That's a waste of time.

  • John Kitchen Level 3 Level 3 (645 points)

    Alf Megson wrote:

     

    Is Apple going to fix OS X 10.7 Lion?

    This is a question for Apple rather than the user community.

     

    Try http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html

  • mannypanda Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    My iMac was losing its wifi status; as I said before, I found it pretty easy to go into System Pref-->Network--> unlock, change from "unplugged cable" to wifi, and rejoin my own network. It still disconnected me, but not as often, once I clicked the lock again. But last time I went further intot he "Advanced" button, and made some changes that I would have to approve any network changes; my hope is it will at least notify me it has lost its sense to use wifi, or maybe, since it has been 24 hours, now, without a drop, it's a keeper.

    Either way, It's not a big problem anymore, but I would appreciate a download patch to fix this unsettling instability.

  • Barney-15E Level 8 Level 8 (42,130 points)

    Either way, It's not a big problem anymore, but I would appreciate a download patch to fix this unsettling instability.

    Well, then you might want to tell Apple about it as us users aren't going to write a "patch" for you.

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