What's the point of iCloud

capaho wrote:

If I take Lion to a Genius Bar the genius will debug the code to fix the slow startup and shutdown, fix the wifi and bluetooth stability issues, fix the memory management issues, fix the Safari issues and fix the HDMI issues?

If I take Lion Server to a Genius Bar the genius will debug the source code, stop the Lion upgrade from breaking services originally set up in SL Server, put the web admin tools and MySQL manager back in the Server Admin app and add support for modsecurity in Apache?

If I take iCloud to a Genius Bar the genius will put in an iDisc and add remote access to Time Capsules?

Who knows. If you are having that much trouble with your machine and the new software they may replace it, or give you a User Manuel. They may even explain that most people have no such problems and those that do should wait for an update, as they continued to address in every OS to date. Or they may recommend Windows for you, and a Windows phone, since your posts show you hate Apple so much.

Anyhow Good Luck. Think You may need it.

Man, I thought I used to be an Apple fanboy, but I couldn't come close to this. You really don't know about all of the issues capaho has listed? I don't know how new to Macs you are, but I suspect that most of the grousing, myself included, comes from those who have used Macs for a long time, back when "It just works" meant just that.

"...most people have no such problems" you say. There are so many problems with iCloud that even the "gurus" like Leo Laporte and Andy Ihnatko are waiting to switch over. Capaho is exactly correct and specific about the issues.

And by the way, your analogy about buying a BMW is not only snide, but incorrect. A better analogy would be living in a town with two dealerships: BMW (Apple) and Kia (Microsoft). You are used to the BMW, but this year they have stripped out features and changed the dash interface. You still prefer it to the Kia and buy one, but keep running into problems with parts of the car that do less than before and others that aren't working properly. You (and I) have every right to complain about the course that Apple is taking and doing so doesn't mean you want Windows. And lay off the stuff about "give you a User Manuel [SIC]" I'd wager that capaho could run rings around you tech-wise, and even if that's not true, it's inappropriate.

Don T wrote:

I don't know how new to Macs you are, but I suspect that most of the grousing, myself included, comes from those who have used Macs for a long time, back when "It just works" meant just that.

"...most people have no such problems" you say.

Never used anything else. never had many problems and certainly none with Lion and IOS 5. The absolute majority of people have no problems with Lion if you bother sticking your head out of troubleshooting forums and into the real world where Mac sales have kept increasing for the 22nd quarter in a row including a massive 43% rise in the Business sector.

iCloud is new and buggy, I have never stated otherwise, that is why I am trying to pick up hints here. I also use Windows 7, and have an android phone as a back up. This Fanboy term must be American or something. Never heard it before. Anyhow have a wonderful experience with whatever you choose to run, all good here, man. Get out of the stone age and actually try to learn new technology 'cause it ain't going backwards.

Cheerio

Sorry Mulligans Missus, but I have to agree with Don T. In my expreience, OS X is leading edge technology and it still is. But what I see is the trend. Apple seems to enchanted with the big bucks to be made in the iPad / iPod Touch / iPhone world, they seemed to be devoted to stripping the Mac OS X down to that level. To use Don T's analogy we still have a BMW but one that is not as good as it was. I would and do continue to choose it gladly over the Window's platform with which I struggled for years. At work, I need to use Windows (corporate mandate). If I make pretty heavy use of it. Some people argue with me that I open to many apps / windows at a time and that the system won't take it. It does but if I don't reboot the computer daily, I'm looking for a world of hurt the next day. Currently, my iMac has been up for 9 days and that is a short time for me. I've run it for months without rebooting unless I get a Safari or OS update. (Off topic, but why does a Safari install require a reboot. I was always amazed that MS made IE so integral to the op sys. Appaerntly Apple does too. On both platforms I can update Chrome and Firefix without rebooting so it is not browsers in general. There is something they are both doing under the hood).

When Steve Jobs introduced iCloud last spring, he joked that they had learned their lesson from MobileMe (which apparently was a disaster to begin with. I didn't adopt it until the problems settled down). There was a lot of laughter at his statement. Unfortunately, his people didn't live up to his promises. The impression I received from the presentation (which looking back with an experience eye, I can now see, I was led astray by fancy and careful marketing weasle words to believe something they were not promising. I have a MacBook for doing things which are not handled by the iPad kind of platform yet. But the tablet is so much more convenient to carry and use, I carry it more. I would like to be able to update a spreadsheet, a document, or a presentation on my iMac or MacBook and then open it on my iPad from the Cloud and show the customer, manager, co-worker, whoever I want to show it too, without the nonsense of downloading it from iWork and then uploading it to iCloud. It is an extra step to do and an extra step to make a mistake on or to forget to perform.

I think one of the things which got many of us is that they changed things and expected us to just guess what to do now. There was no guide to upgraders to point out what had changed and what that meant to an existing Mac user. In time, authors published books to teach us what was new. The funny thing is that when I switched to Mac, I didn't need a third party book to teach me how to use it. A few online videos for those switching from Windows gave me all that I needed to start using the Mac powerfully and by hanging around these forums, I learned more and did more. A video for users of preLion OS X systems would ahve been helpful.

A lot of the perception here does depend on what you do with your system. If your work flow aligned well with those things that didn't change substantially you would have few complaints. Some of us had changes that hit in the middle of what we do regularly. This is not about how sophistocated your use is but how much it lined up with what they changed.

bkitchin wrote:

Sorry Mulligans Missus, but I have to agree with Don T. In my expreience, OS X is leading edge technology and it still is. But what I see is the trend. Apple seems to enchanted with the big bucks to be made in the iPad / iPod Touch / iPhone world, they seemed to be devoted to stripping the Mac OS X down to that level.

Don't be sorry, I am more than happy with Apple's direction. As the richest company on the planet, they must have done something right, and their sales are still going up. So I am happy to trust this direction, and I see the younger generation grabbing it with both hands. Computing as we know it has been changed forever and iCloud is but the start of it. Hasn't even been around for 3 months yet.

Cheers

I don't think people are expecting things for free. I think what's going on is people are upset (myself included to a certain degree) that iCloud was positioned as one thing prior to inception but turned into something else in practice. I think Apple led MobileMe users to believe iCloud would serve the same functions when in fact is does not in many instances.

Don T wrote:

I'd wager that capaho could run rings around you tech-wise, and even if that's not true, it's inappropriate.

Thanks, Don T, it's a rare moment here when kind words are directed my way. I appreciate it.

As for mulligans missus, I don't think technical or performance issues are important to him/her as he/she appears to be stuck in an infinite loop.

Alan Brunettin wrote:

I think Apple led MobileMe users to believe iCloud would serve the same functions when in fact is does not in many instances.

I agree, that's why I'm annoyed at the demise of MobileMe in favor of iCloud. It is essentially a new service with a different purpose, it doesn't provide the same features as MobileMe, leaving MobileMe users with nothing to do but keep their iTunes files synced across all of their Apple devices. It's useless in relation to the way I was using MobileMe, which was essentially an additional productivity tool for my work.

Alan Brunettin wrote:

I think Apple led MobileMe users to believe iCloud would serve the same functions when in fact is does not in many instances.

Not so, this information has been available for well over 6 months. In fact upon checking I note I opened my Dropbox account on May 13, 2011 which is when I was informed I'd need an alternative to iDisk, indeed I likely knew before that, but that's the date I opened my dropbox account.

So no Apple didn't lead anyone to conclude iCloud would do what mobile me would do, some folks just chose not to find out what iCloud would do and now want to blame someone else for their own short comings.

Winston Churchill wrote:

So no Apple didn't lead anyone to conclude iCloud would do what mobile me would do, some folks just chose not to find out what iCloud would do and now want to blame someone else for their own short comings.

AFAIK, the web page you referenced wasn't posted until iCloud went online. Prior to that, I was also of the impression that iCloud would be an enhanced version of MobileMe that added cloud storage of iTunes media files. I did not expect that key MobileMe features like the iDisk and remote access to Time Capsules would be dropped. Remote file access was very useful in MobileMe and I'm not interested in having my iTunes files wafting across the ether in iCloud.

It's also interesting to note the the U.S. online Apple store still says this about the Time Capsule:

"If you’re a MobileMe member using a Mac with OS X Leopard or later, you can even access the files on the drive over the Internet."

Is that misleading? It is no longer possible to sign up for a MobileMe account and remote access to Time Capsules is lost as soon as you migrate from MobileMe to iCloud.

http://store.apple.com/us/product/MD032LL/A/Time-Capsule-2TB

Since I made the big switch from PC to Apple 9 years ago, I have bought a PowerPC, a PowerBook, 2 MacBookPros, an Apple Air with native Lion, several iPods, an iPhone 3G, an iPad (I), an iPhone 4, Pages, Numbers, Aperture, MOBILEME, and a number of other Apple products. Not to mention every OS X upgrade since my PowerPC.

I'm not looking for anything free. I'm looking for iCloud to meet or exceed the features and quality of MobileMe. I want to keep iDisk. I want to keep my galleries. I want my iCloud email to arrive reliably, which it doesn't. I want to know why Mac Mail on my Air doesn't collect most of my iCloud email, when my MacBook Pro does (I assume it does; who knows, though; it's more than possible that a whole lot of email is floating around in cyberspace, looking for the proper place to land). I want to know why iCal on my Air insists that my password is wrong (it isn't) and bounces the icon in the tray, which makes my ADD go crazy.

Basically, I want to know why, when MobileMe was great and I was happy to pay $99/year for the past 9 years (before it was MobileMe), they have decided to "improve it" by removing features and wreaking havoc with my email? I will continue, after MobileMe goes away in June, to pay for the storage. But I'm not a happy camper.

And yes, it's usually convenient that calendars, documents, etc. are updated by iCloud, but occasionally it means a frantic run to turn off the router before opening the one device that still has my whole address book on it after I've accidentally deleted 90% of it.

I resent your description of loyal (yes, LOYAL!) Apple customers who are complaining because they are no longer able to have features they had been paying for. Call me a whiner. But I would like iCloud to at least do what MobileMe did. I'll happily continue paying my $99/year and not expect anything for free. But don't make assumptions about those of us who aren't totally thrilled with every little thing that comes out of Cupertino. Especially when it doesn't work.

I agree 100% with your comments. I am a 23 year veteran of mac ownership ( currently have 9) and have held off on switching to iCloud because of so many uncertanties. I am hoping that 10.7.3 will address the many issues that 10.7.2 did not and make iCloud more of what it is supposed to be.

Carolyn Samit wrote:

What is the point of iCloud?

If you update a document on your Mac, it would automatically update the same document on an iOS device and vice versa. Same with Calendars, Mail, Photos, Contacts, and Bookmarks.

If you purchase music on your Mac, it will automatically sync to your iPhone.

This is the problem with the iCloud concept - it is a massive waste of time and battery energy to automatically update so much content between a mobile device and a computer for the following reasons:

1 - Most people I know dont work on documents on their phones. The phone is a device you would use to view a document or make a note while in transit between a Laptop or Desktop computer.

2 - If you have a huge iTunes library you aren not going to want it all on your phone all the time constantly updating. You are going to make a playlist and sync only relevant items

3 - If you take lots of photos on the phone, you normally want to discard all those duds before you load them at home to iPhoto.

4 - Email updates anyway between your phone and your computer - you do not need iCloud.

5 - My bookmarks on a Desktop or Notebook are completely different to those on my Phone. I dont need all my Desktop bookmarks on my Phone and wouldnt want them to be updated.

6 - Addresses & Calendars are the only thing that need to be updated arguably in real time.

THose are all pertinent points; ones that I have also come to myself trying to work with iCloud and try to divine a reason for its existence. WHat's bugging me now is that I want to just deactivate it and whenever I try to I get a warning that anything I've uploaded to iCloud will be deleted from my HARDDRIVE and left in the cloud; available to me when I sign on again. What on earth is THAT about? Why don't the iCloud files get deleted and left untouched on my computer's drive? It makes no sense.

iCloud is a service that programs can opt to support. iWork is not and will not be the only software that supports it, and you’re not under any obligation to only buy software that does. If you only use one computer, there’s really no reason to worry about iCloud, since it’s all about syncing.