Previous 1 4 5 6 7 8 9 Next 121 Replies Latest reply: Apr 9, 2015 9:16 PM by beckypaynee Go to original post Branched to a new discussion.
  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    Is this how apple users have been living all these years?

    No, AVI is a legacy file container which remains compatible with QT 7 "legacy" player apps assuming the required codecs are both available for the Mac and installed on the users operating system. Basically, Apple is currently embarked on a program of modernization of QT based structures and apps that employ these structures. E.g., the QT embedded structure is now basically a hybrid to support the various apps like QT 7 and GarageBand ("classic" QT) and QT X, iMovie, and iTunes (which have more or less crossed over to "the dark side" of QT).

     

    On the other hand, why do you wish to use a "legacy" file container initially developed and introduced by Microsoft in November of 1992 and for which Microsoft dropped official support eleven years ago as part of its own program for multimedia modernization to overcome a mutitude of AVI file container limitations? For example (See Wikipedia "AVI" article here):

     

    • AVI does not provide a standardized way to encode aspect ratio information, with the result that players cannot select the right one automatically (though it may be possible to do so manually).
    • There are several competing approaches to including a time code in AVI files, which affects usability of the format in film and television post-production, although it is widely used. For WAV audio files, Broadcast Wave extensions were designed to standardize post-production metadata, but an equivalent for AVI files has not emerged.
    • AVI is not intended to contain variable frame rate material. Workarounds for this limitation increase overhead dramatically.
    • AVI was not intended to contain video using any compression technique which requires access to future video frame data beyond the current frame. Approaches exist to support modern video compression techniques (such as MPEG-4) which rely on this function, although this is beyond the intent of the original specification and may cause problems with playback software which does not anticipate this use.
    • AVI cannot contain some specific types of variable bit rate (VBR) data reliably (such as MP3 audio at sample rates below 32 kHz).
    • Overhead for AVI files at the resolutions and frame rates normally used to encode standard definition feature films is about 5 MB per hour of video, the significance of which varies with the application.

     

    Basically, the file container was designed for use with "legacy" compression formats being abandoned by both Apple and Microsoft and which are becoming harder and harder to support on a continuing basis and still retain compatibility with the more modern compression formats available today. A better question might be "Why doesn't QT natively support a more modern file format type like MKV?" which was developed as an open standard for the universal storage of an unlimited number of video, audio, picture or subtitle tracks in a single file. The use of AVI only retains its current popularity because most users do not know of its limitations and those that do are, for the most part, simply too lazy to make the effort to modernize their files.

     

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  • Planitron Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Cause the most popular file is AVI, the player VLC.org work on android, why don't on apple.

     

    Why android trust the world ? it's for this reason, the system is more open.

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    Cause the most popular file is AVI,

    And will likely remain so until the average mutimedia user becomes better educated and more selective in targeting the best combination of features for their particular container and compression format requirements for multimedia use and/or distribution.

     

     

    the player VLC.org work on android, why don't on apple.

    Development of VLC player apps is the perogative of the Videolan project team. They have already developed apps for a number of operating systems. Since Apple is not involved in this project, its tasks, or their prioities, you would have to as the VideoLan people why an IOS player version has not been developed. If you are asking why Apple does not create its own AVI specific player, then I refer you to the above explanation regarding the fact that Apple is in the process of moderizing its multimedia applications and not trying to attain compatibility with technology that is crippled by two decades of multimedia evolution nor are they in the business of supporting a file container developed and then abandoned by Microsoft.

     

     

    Why android trust the world ? it's for this reason, the system is more open.

    You lost me on this one. If you are asking why Apple developed its own operating system for its own mobile devices, then you would have to go and ask Apple. If you are asking why IOS is not more open to the public, then I suggest you become an IOS deveoper.

     

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  • dannyml Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    What sort of talk is this? I want to watch a movie, I dont care about compression and variable bit rate, all I know is Apple devices can not do natively what every other device out there can do, and that makes me feel cheated. Keep telling yourself that you are doing the noble thing by not touching "legacy compression", soon enough apple will be legacy. Be customer oriented, not technical oriented, if the customers want it, give it to them.

  • Planitron Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Jon Walker wrote:

     

    Cause the most popular file is AVI,

    And will likely remain so until the average mutimedia user becomes better educated and more selective in targeting the best combination of features for their particular container and compression format requirements for multimedia use and/or distribution.

     

     

    the player VLC.org work on android, why don't on apple.

    Development of VLC player apps is the perogative of the Videolan project team. They have already developed apps for a number of operating systems. Since Apple is not involved in this project, its tasks, or their prioities, you would have to as the VideoLan people why an IOS player version has not been developed. If you are asking why Apple does not create its own AVI specific player, then I refer you to the above explanation regarding the fact that Apple is in the process of moderizing its multimedia applications and not trying to attain compatibility with technology that is crippled by two decades of multimedia evolution nor are they in the business of supporting a file container developed and then abandoned by Microsoft.

     

    Apple doesn't accept a gpl app , it's why the vlc are not present.

    http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/no-gpl-apps-for-apples-app-store/8046

     

     

    Why android trust the world ? it's for this reason, the system is more open.

    You lost me on this one. If you are asking why Apple developed its own operating system for its own mobile devices, then you would have to go and ask Apple. If you are asking why IOS is not more open to the public, then I suggest you become an IOS deveoper.

     

    We need only the OS accept this functionnality  or itunes convert automatically the file on drag and drop.

    You make this , iphone ll win a lot of customer.

     

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  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    I want to watch a movie, I dont care about compression and variable bit rate, all I know is Apple devices can not do natively what every other device out there can do, and that makes me feel cheated.

    If all you want to do is play the in the container and compression format you want to use then puchase software or devices that are compatible with those files. The Apple site lists the capabilities of its software and devices so you know what you are getting before you buy. Why do you insist on buying something that won't play the files you want to play and then complain that the manufacturer cheated you—caveat emptor.

     

     

    Keep telling yourself that you are doing the noble thing by not touching "legacy compression", soon enough apple will be legacy. Be customer oriented, not technical oriented, if the customers want it, give it to them.

    I tend to feel the best customer is an informed customer. I do not believe people should go through life pretending to be blind, dumb, and disabled just so they can expect others to cater tho their every want or desire. As to not touching "legacy compression," I am not sure what you are trying to say here. I re-enabled the native "legacy" video formats I use on a regular basis as soon as Apple disabled them. As to other common "legacy" formats, I keep a basic set installed for use with classic QT apps. I cannot, however, install those that were never ported over from PC platforms to Mac, those that are only compatible with older 8, 9, or X PowerPC operating systems, or those never adapted to Mac Intel platforms. In short, if you wish to have fully PC compatible software and devices, then purchase and use equipment designed and manufactured for this compatibility and let Apple sink or swim on its own as the case may be. And if you really want to make recommendations regarding changes to QT and QT based applications, why aren't you sending these suggestions and recommendations directly to Apple using the Product Feedback forms provided instead of posting here?

     

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  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    Apple doesn't accept a gpl app , it's why the vlc are not present.

    http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/no-gpl-apps-for-apples-app-store/8046

    Interesting article. Thanks for the link. I must agree with your disappointment in Apple's apparent discriminatory "control" practices which take obvious precedence over all other issues. My major regret here is that I don't normally keep up to date on App Store offerings and so missed an opportunity to download a copy for my mobile devices since VLC is one of the few alternative player packages I use on a daily basis on my main system. I guess the question becomes, "Can a separate but similar commercial/non-GPL version be merchandised?"

     

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  • dannyml Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    You are missing the point Mr. Appleismymother,

    If I bought a phone and took it home only to realise that it cannot make international calls, and that this is actually listed on the company site, I will not be able to sue the manufacturer, but will I be happy with my pruchase?...NO. That is all I am trying to say, I am not happy with my purchase, I cannot sue Apple, but you bet this is the last apple device I buy, thanks to your advice.

     

    Now I'd like to play some music, is there anything special I should know? Should I start googling the downsides of MP3? any special software I should purchase?

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    If I bought a phone and took it home only to realise that it cannot make international calls, and that this is actually listed on the company site, I will not be able to sue the manufacturer, but will I be happy with my pruchase?...NO. That is all I am trying to say, I am not happy with my purchase, I cannot sue Apple, but you bet this is the last apple device I buy, thanks to your advice.

    And you again make my case. Why would anyone buy an iPhone without first ensuring the carrier provided voice and/or data plans for the country of interest or which carrier partners are supported in that country or checking on the cost of additional fees or charges that might be incurred or how to reset the phone for international use?  The laws of most countries support the principal that the buyer must assume, in whole or in part, some responisbility for non-fraudulant purchases he or she makes.

     

     

    Now I'd like to play some music, is there anything special I should know? Should I start googling the downsides of MP3? any special software I should purchase?

    By default, most software player apps and devices are compatible with the default options available for iTunes import and if not, can be sync'd to older, non-compatible devices as part of an internal conversion/sync process. The native encoder compression formats are AAC, AIFF, Apple Lossless, MP3, and WAV. Since you did not indicate how you plan to source your music or play your music, I can make no specific recommendations at this point. As a "rule of thumb," I would normally recommend you import content at the highest available quality, use iTunes as the content manager, and then, only if necessisary, downconvert for most efficient use as you may desire for a specific player, device, or other use—e,g. creating MP3 Audio discs, posting to web pages, streaming to internal home or external targets via the internet, etc. Sourcing of content could impact software purchases and library requirements may impact hardware purchases depending on how large a library you have or plan to build—e.g., spreading content across single or multiple libraries on single or multiple extenal drives, or single or mutiple RAID devices.

     

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  • Klainman Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I agree with the person above who suggested MPEG Streamclip. That app is fantastic, and you can create a batch list of all the files you want to change, and then go away and come back in 20 mins and everything will be done. I can't see the point in using handbrake because you'll just lose quality in the conversion. Handbrake is great but it's not needed here. You just want to change the container format as outlined above.

  • GPWaters Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    my personal preference was to utilise iTunes mostly for the sorting of video files. (although SO slow at times)

    specifically TV shows. for the use of a 3rd party media server named Plex.

    basically im not all together impressed with much fo the media apps that mac produce.

    Plex plays very nearly ANYTHING.

     

    but back to iTunes, i used it to sort tv shows into titles, seasons and episodes so the files were handled cleanly and easy to find.

    now ive read about AVI. being old technology and thats the excuse for the lack of support.

    90% of the files i have are AVI, and still commonly used.

    unfortunately for me my original mac mini i was using as my media server has kicked the bucket.

    at the time of setting it up as a server i searched through many foums to get an understanding of how things work.

    for importing (not necessarliy playing) i discovered the handiest app that handled file types and could change avi. container info into (from memory) an mpg4 or mov container.

    unfortunately what frustrates me the most is that i cannot remember the title of this app and trying to find it leads me in circles and back to these forums re. importing.

    but it was the perfect solution, iTunes would import it just fine and no file conversion was required. this worked with MKV files also though importing time was a lot longer.

     

    since i was using iTunes for sorting and not necessarily playing videos i cant comment on the capabaility of iTunes in playing various formats. basically i feel iTunes/Front Row are crap and there are plenty of other options out there with much better features. (Seriously check out Plex)

     

    SO... now im on the latest mac mini trying to nut out how to get my system back into a workable media server, discovering all of the new and exciting ways in which mac limit our abilities in makinig our own needs met.

     

    if anyone knows what im speaking about and can let me know what the name of this "file typer" app may be, id appreciate the information.

    i discovered a little item named "file buddy", this did ring a bell. but as yet i havnt been able to get a version of this that will even open up for me in OS 10.8.2

     

    so around we go... i guess id prefer nto to have to sort my files into folders etc. by hand.

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    for importing (not necessarliy playing) i discovered the handiest app that handled file types and could change avi. container info into (from memory) an mpg4 or mov container.

    unfortunately what frustrates me the most is that i cannot remember the title of this app and trying to find it leads me in circles and back to these forums re. importing.

    but it was the perfect solution, iTunes would import it just fine and no file conversion was required. this worked with MKV files also though importing time was a lot longer.

    If the data wrapped in the file container (AVI, MKV, etc.) already conforms to MPEG-4 Chapter 2 or MPEG-4 AVC Chapter 10 video standards and MPEG-4 (AAC) audio standards, then there are several applications than can copy the data from "supported" third-party file types to MOV, MP4, and/or M4V file containers which are compatible with newer versions of iTunes that no longer support the AVI (or other) third-party file containers. Unfortunately, this does not work for proprietary or open codecs which produce hybridized Profile/Level combinations of media which require third-party codecs for proper playback.

     

    1) For instance, the oldest QT app that can do this would be QT Pro. In the case you would simply use the "Save As..." option to copy the source data to a standard MOV file container without recompressing the data.

     

    2) A better option would probably be the free MPEG Streamclip app. It also uses the "Save As..." File menu option to copy source data from one file container to your choice of either an MOV or MP4 file container without data conversion. Be advised, however, that targeting an MP4 file container limits the data which which can be transferred to MPEG-4, MPEG-5 AVC, and AAC data. Other data tracks are normally "filtered" out and ignored during the copy process.

     

    3) Another app sometimes used would be Subler. It has the ability to remux compliant H.264, AAC, AC3, and Chapter tracks to an M4V file container, correct anamorphic aspect ratios for both old and new technology players, "lie" about Profile/Level settings if desired but may require a two-step work flow for many container types.

     

    Other commercial apps (as previously discussed at different points in this forum) are also available which can automsatically copy data without conversion if possible or convert the data if the app determines conversion to be required.

     

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  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,125 points)

    2) A better option would probably be the free MPEG Streamclip app. It also uses the "Save As..." File menu option to copy source data from one file container to your choice of either an MOV or MP4 file container without data conversion. Be advised, however, that targeting an MP4 file container limits the data which which can be transferred to MPEG-4, MPEG-5 AVC, and AAC data. Other data tracks are normally "filtered" out and ignored during the copy process.

    Should have read:

     

    2) A better option would probably be the free MPEG Streamclip app. It also uses the "Save As..." File menu option to copy source data from one file container to your choice of either an MOV or MP4 file container without data conversion. Be advised, however, that targeting an MP4 file container limits the data which which can be transferred to MPEG-4, MPEG-4 AVC, and AAC data. Other data tracks are normally "filtered" out and ignored during the copy process.

  • GPWaters Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    honestly for my needs I think I'm going to just avoid iTunes all

    together. and manage my files by hand. as I have said plex catalogues and plays every file I have.

    i like how itunes is set out and how it runs but its far too limited and seems to be getting less user friendly for the all

    important commercialization of ITunes Store. great for shopping but practically useless.

  • GPWaters Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I agree with dannyml here...

    the users are not interested in te specifics... we all want plug and play why else would we buy Mac?

    apple will push consumers away from their products if they expect us to have a better understanding of how things work...

    i use Mac and windows computers at home, and you do have to pay more attention with windows and have some degree of tech knowledge to over come what isn't handed to you for your needs.

    I guess I trust apple to concentrate on use friendly systems, I've certainly felt its been steered that way for consumers.

    but such an obvious shortcoming with media is one **** of a let down for the "lazy people's" system of choice.

    fine, we want simple support on older/all media files, go windows! end of story.

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