14 Replies Latest reply: Feb 24, 2012 6:15 AM by léonie
Ross Millard Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)

Aperture Keyword Inconsistency


All photos were migrated from iPhoto to Aperture because Apple insisted iPhoto database not as stable as Aperture.


What I am trying to understand…


If the Keyword Hud shows as Flowers …. 1,000

If I select Photos at the top left I am told that includes all photo's in the data base.

In Filter: Photos … Flowers entered

The filter finds only 900 Flowers

Where are the other 100?

How do I resole this.


This is the first of several Keyword mysteries. Hoping this answer will unlock a solution

to the others.


Thanks in advance for any kind help.

MacBookPro 17', Mac OS X (10.5.6)
  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    Do you have any Stacks?  Expand them.  Also make sure that nothing else is active in the Filter.  To select one keyword and cancel all others in the same Rule, "{Option}+click" the checkbox.

  • Ross Millard Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)

    I had quite a number of Stacks ... all I unstacked to see if that made a difference. Then I used the 3 Tune Up steps ... in some cases the Hud count for a Keyworh increases ... in others the Display of images found increased over what was shown on the Keyword Hud.


    I have been very careful to be certain only one item is checked in Keywords in Filter.

    When comparing I copy paste the Keywod Hud's keyword into the text box to be sure it is exactly the same.


    Of 9,650 + images it appears seems to be a bunch screwed up.


    Keyword name = Compare iPhoto Originals .. Keword = 7,020  .. Actual displayed = 6,562 ..  Missing 458

    This makes me sick to see this mess.


    Thanks on the Optn..Click to be sure one keywoed alone is selected. I've been doing a careful visual check.

    I just can not believe an app relied on by so many has come up so corrupted. I have been super careful taking images in and out of Aperture only using Import and Export. I learned in iPhoto when I it was confirmed again and again that drag-&-drop was the same. Then was told that action probably corrupted my iPhoto library.

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    When I see behavior that doesn't make sense, I triple-check for user error or misunderstanding.  Most programs work as they were designed to work.  A few are poorly designed.  Almost none misbehaves (and when they do, it usually causes a hang or a crash).


    So let's examine what's happening and see if we can make sense of it.


    Are all Stacks expanded?

    "Stacks→Open All Stacks"


    Is the Browser showing all Images?

    Click the drop-down magnifying glass icon inside the Browser search field and select "Show All".  The gray text on the back of the search field should read "Showing All".


    Have you emptied the Aperture Trash?  Do so (after, as needed, confirming that you want to permanently remove those items from your Library).


    Don't use the Filter Rule "Text" to search for only Keywords.  The Rule searches more fields than just "Keywords".


    Search your Keyword HUD for duplicate keywords.  The search field is at the top of the HUD.  Merge the duplicates as needed.


    Redo the comparison of the Keyword HUD numbers and the Photos view numbers when filtered by keyword.  Reconfirm that there are no other Rules active.  Make sure that the checkbox at the top, "Stack Picks Only", is not checked.  Repeat for several keywords.  What do you find?

  • Ross Millard Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)

    All stacks open .. Open stacks dimmed

    Checked all images usung magnifying glass .. showing all ... 9,660 .. same as before

    Tons of stuff in Aprture trash .. Could Keywords in trash be adding to the Keyword HUD? I was told they are not.

        Lots there ... I need to be certain I want to delete perminently

    I use Filter > Text > IS > and keyword > All other selections unchecked.  Is this valid?

    Single level of Keywords except for 3 ... not duplicates

    Stack Pick Only .. never checked. Thi is how I uncovered the problem


    Again, thanks for working w/ me, Ross

  • Frank Caggiano Level 7 Level 7 (25,715 points)

    Ross Millard wrote:



        Lots there ... I need to be certain I want to delete perminently


    Using the Trash (either Aperture's or the system's) as temporary storage is never a good idea. Way to easy to delete something you don't want to.



    I use Filter > Text > IS > and keyword > All other selections unchecked.  Is this valid?

    Why are you using the Text rule for keyword search? The Keyword rule is more reliable if you are searching for keywords.

  • Badunit Level 6 Level 6 (11,440 points)

    To search keywords, you should use the Keywords part of the filter. It should work in the text field too but there must be something going on that you and we are not aware of.

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    I think we're making progress.

    Could Keywords in trash be adding to the Keyword HUD? I was told they are not.

    Keywords in the Trash are counted in the totals shown in the Keywords HUD.  Who told you they were not?


    Select Trash on the Library tab of the Inspector, and filter the Trash for the Keyword "Compare iPhoto Originals" (or any the keywords you are testing).  Report back.

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    Hi again Ross.  In addition to the above (Keywords in Trash are counted in Keyword HUD totals), the following bear follow-up actions:

    Ross Millard wrote:

    All stacks open .. Open stacks dimmed

    What do mean by "dimmed"?  I honestly just don't understand.  Stacks are either open or closed.  I'm not aware of "dimmed", a state which I suppose alternates with "not dimmed".

    I need to be certain I want to delete permanently.

    Don't use the Trash as a holding bin.  (I use the rating "Rejected", and then confirm per Project whether to delete the rejected Images.)


    Create a new Project.  Call it something like "Stuff that was in the Trash but I need to review".  Select all the Images in the Trash, and drag them into this new Project.  Use it to make decisions.


    I use Filter > Text > IS > and keyword > All other selections unchecked.  Is this valid?

    It does not make sense.  Are you using TWO rules, one for Keyword and one for TEXT?  The Filter Rules are explained in the User Manual here.  The parameters of the TEXT Rule are explained here.  Note that the TEXT rule searches more than just Keywords.  In general, do not use the TEXT Rule to search for Keywords.



    Also, please check the totals for three or four different Keywords.  Make sure at least two of them have no spaces in the Keyword name.


    Message was edited by: Kirby Krieger

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    Screenshot showing two Browsers open, one to Photos and one to Trash.  Each Browser has been filtered to show Images with the Keyword "RossMillard".  There are 16 Images with this Keyword in Photos.  There are 8 Images with the Keyword in Trash.  The Keyword HUD correctly shows that the number of Images in the Library with the Keyword "RossMillard" is 24.  (Sorry for the large screenshot -- wanted the Keywords displayed in the Metadata Overlay to show.)



  • Ross Millard Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)

    Frank Caggiano and Badunit … Thanks guys for the help.


    Why use Filter: Text rather than Filter: Keyword

    Started out that way. When several keywords in HUD were not represented in Filter: Keyword, I thought of using the text w/ copy/paste for exact duplication.


    Kirby, Can't thank enough for hanging with me.


    Stacks .. After manually checking and opening the few I saw in Library > Photos, all photos not unstacked, I unstacked them. Then did: Menu Bar > Stacks > Open All Stacks.  Open All Stacks menu selection appears dimmed. Close All Stacks shows un-dimmed.


    Trash Items .. Rejected, great tip. I have just trashed stuff and not emptied trash till I could get around to verifying I'm not deleting something valuable. I have found good stuff, though infrequently, in the trash. It has just mushroomed.


    Graphics clearly depicts what I was clarifying just below. Again, nice graphic!

    From our "trash" discussion: Keywords in trash add to active image keywords to make the total in Keyword HUD. ie: 50 Flowers in "Photos", 10 Flowers in Trash … Keyword HUD shows 60? A text search would reveal only the 50 in "Photos"


    So:  when I put all trash into a new Project and Check for exact numbers… I should get super close. GREAT IDEA!


    Kirby, not two rules at once. See note at top to Frank and Badnit. Text rather than Keyword because that Keyword does not appear in the Filter: Photo > Keyword > include all of the following .. list of keywords. Nice graphic! Using the Filter Trash will give me equally another way to investigate


    Once I get the numbers understood and in line, then I want to address why a few keywords appear in the HUD but can not be seen in any of the ways I've tried to uncover them. I bet I find them in trash. Several HUD Keyworfd that show 0 … when I go to delete the Keyword I get a Warning: 6 photos have this keyword .. Or something quite similar. Others showing 0 stay 3 versions have this Keyword.


    I have gone over the Filter rules in the manual and parameters. It does bear way more careful review, which I will do.


    I will: Look at images in Trash via the graphic example & document findings … Take images out of Trash to new Project then see if numbers come into line and document … Report results here.

    Review Filter rules and parameters.


    Great, Great ideas, suggestion and help!!! I'll be back.


    Owww, a PS: By way of qualifying accuracy. I have searched everywhere for a discussion on … Unstack versus open stack. Nothing I looked for answered this. I totally believe they are the same thing ... yet the to commands appear at opposite ends of the Stacks menu selection.

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    Two things to add while you work on what you've mentioned.


    Don't use the Rule "Text" to search for Keywords.  Use the Rule "Keywords".  NB: the Filter HUD Rule "Keyword" lists only those Keywords that are present in the Images in the currently selected container(s).  The Keyword HUD shows _all_ Keywords.  (This is, of course, helpful, and a nice touch from Aperture's designers.)


    Images can be in a Stack.  Stacks can be expanded (shows all Images, signaled by a darker surround in the Browser), or collapsed (all Images visually "stacked" under the top Image, called the "Stack Pick").  To create a Stack, select Images and "Stacks→Stack".  To remove that Stack, select an Image in the Stack, and "Stack→Unstack".  Creating and removing Stacks is quite different from opening and closing (expanding and collapsing) existing Stacks.


    Searching the on-line User Manual for "Unstack" took me to this page.

    Searching the on-line User Manual for "Close Stack" took me to this page (the next one in the User Manual, both under the section "Stacking Images and Making Picks").


    Message was edited by: Kirby Krieger -- User Manual links added.

  • Ross Millard Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)



    I can not thank you enough! You not only uncovered the problem … you were incredibly thorough and offered way, way more than a solution. You, sir are a master instructor, very patient and super helpful.


    In my quest to launch into lots of photo editing I thought I had a better than average understanding of the system scheme. My questions, you know showed this to be untrue. That's changing .. your guidance.


    Trash items are now in a Project. ALL … all items are now accounted for! What a rat race I created simply having the understanding Keywords in trash did not add to the Keyword HUD count.


    One last request. As I begin to validate images in trash and remove them permanently … I want to do so in the most non-destrutive way to other photos in valid Projects and albums. Your sage comments will be so appreciated.


    Trash items are valid trash. I just always double check items before the final "flush!" Time has made this task now more consuming but an immediate project.


    Finally, as I close out… you thoroughly deserve way more than 10 points for Solved Question.

    1,000 may be excessive but that would certainly reflect your kind effort as well as the magnitude the anomole was pointing to ...  suspecion there was a significant data base "Problem". If it's possible to award more points, Please, let me know.                Best Wishes! Ross Millard

  • Kirby Krieger Level 6 Level 6 (12,510 points)

    Hi Ross,


    Please -- you'll drag me across the Léonie line for blushing smileys.  You are quite welcome.  I hope you make the most of Aperture.  When the chance presents itself, pass it forward.


    Start a new topic with your "last request" -- it's a separate issue, better answered seperately.




    Kirby. .

  • léonie Level 10 Level 10 (82,085 points)


    Please -- you'll drag me across the Léonie line for blushing smileys.


    Just got back - and what a greeting!


    Don't you worry Kirby, I'll soon shift that line - so no danger for you to cross it ...