3G Internet sharing

Question

Level 1

46 points

3G Internet sharing

Has anyone managed to get Internet Sharing working from a USB dongle or iPhone for that matter?

We live in the sticks, so rely on a reasonably fast 3G dongle which was connected using my old Mac Mini (10.6.8), which is now unplugged and boxed waiting to be presented to my Mom. This set up worked flawlessly for two years. Grrrrr.

It is now set up as follows;

3G dongle -> Mac Mini (10.6.8) fixed IP -> Ethernet -> Time Capsule (7.6.1) fixed IP (to ensure connection to the NAS) running as DHCP server -> Ethernet connects to;

1. ReadyNAS NV+ fixed IP (a must)

2. Windows 7 CAD machine (Sorry but I need to use Solidworks) -> using DHCP

Wireless connection to;

Airport Extreme (7.6.1) at the other side of the house (necessary because of good old Irish concrete construction) -> using DHCP

Mac Mini (10.6.8) under the TV mainly for running Plex.app -> using DHCP

MacBook (10.6.8) Pro -> using DHCP

So th eonly difference is Lion 10.7.3.

Runnning 100% DHCP is a no no due to the NAS. Although I did try and still had no connections.

All lights are green on the Macs, APE & TC, showing that the connection is ok, but unfortunately there is no internet available. Running Network Diagnostics on the Macs shows network ok, but IP shows red. So the issue is with the brand new Mac Mini I have running 10.7.3. It just doesn't want to share (perhaps it was a banker in its last life).

Any thoughts? Its obviously a bridging issue with Internet sharing on the Mac Mini which is allowing Ping through but not any connections, which is fooling the dumb Apple hardware into thinking they have an internet connection. Interestingly I have an Android tablet that thinks it has internet too, but won't connect either.

Moving the dongle won't work as the signal is rubbish anywhere else in the house, I can only imagine the radio waves I being bombarded with every day. But that healthy country living for you.

So far I've wasted half a day on this. From what I can gather Apple have known about this since last summer, I wish I checked before purchasing.

Thank you Apple.

Posted on Feb 29, 2012 12:43 PM

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Answer 1

jamesee

Level 1

8 points

Mar 11, 2012 4:29 PM in response to Hibernian56

I (now) have Internet Sharing working with OS X 10.7.3. 🙂

My network setup is very similar to yours as I also live in a rural area where the best available broadband service is a 3G mobile service that uses a USB dongle. I have a fixed ethernet LAN and a wireless network based on a Time Capsule.

When I first tried using Internet Sharing with 10.7.3 on my network, “it just worked” and I was delighted. However, my delight was short-lived.

When I went to install an Airport Express to extend the wireless range of my network, the on-line services offered to upgrade the firmware of my Time Capsule, Airport Express and the Airport Utility. I accepted these upgrades and that’s when it all turned to custard and I experienced problems and frustrations exactly as you have described.

After about half a day of experimenting, I managed to find out what was going on, and to develop a solution, which is now working just fine. (Details follow)

For the record, my network setup is as follows.

1. USB dongle connected to Mac Mini with OS 10.7.3

2. Mac Mini connected to an Ethernet LAN with a Cisco router providing DHCP services for the entire network.

3. Various printers are connected to the LAN with fixed IP addresses as well as an old G4 desktop.

4. My Time Capsule is connected to the LAN with a fixed IP address and is set to bridging mode so that the Cisco DHCP addresses are sent to devices on the ethernet LAN and on the wireless LAN.

5. On the wireless LAN I have two MacBook Airs running Snow Leopard (10.6.8), a MacBook Pro running Lion (10.7.3) and an iPad 2. All devices on the Wireless LAN are set to use DHCP.

Here’s what I found out about Internet Sharing. I have never seen this in writing, so what follows was discovered by trial and error.

My main clue was the message that is displayed when you turn on Internet Sharing…

“If your computer is connected to a network, turning on Internet Sharing may affect the network settings of other computers and disrupt the network.”

This information is exactly correct, but not very helpful. Nor is the advice, which says, “Contact your system administrator before turning on Internet Sharing. (I am the System Administrator, so where does that get me!!)

To start Internet Sharing I click on “Start” for Internet Sharing (in System Settings>Sharing>Internet Sharing, with (in my case) Ethernet selected for “connect to computers using…” because I want to share the Mac Mini’s Internet Connection via the ethernet LAN).

What now happens is that the Mac Mini assigns itself two further IP addresses in addition to the fixed address that I have already assigned it.

The two further addresses are as follows:

1. Assigned address (server?) 192.168.2.2

2. Router address 192.168.2.1

The subnet mask is set to 255.255.255.0 – which it probably was already.

In addition the Mac Mini will then act as a DHCP server and supply IP addresses and other configuration information to all of the devices that are set to use DHCP. (You may need to click on “Renew DHCP Lease in System Preferences>Network>(Ethernet or Airport as applicable for the machine concerned)>Advanced>TCP/IP in order to see the new address.)

The client machine IP addresses are to set to unique unused addresses in the subnet range (192.168.2.XXX) and the subnet mask on the client machine is set to 255.255.255.0 and the router address to 192.168.2.1.

At this point, the client machines will probably by able to access the Internet – however this mucks up the performance of any devices on the network that have fixed IP addresses, because they will (most likely) be on a different subnet.

The way I got around this issue was rearrange my network addressing scheme (before turning on Internet Sharing) to use the subnet 192.168.2.XXX, but taking care to avoid the early addresses 192.168.2.1 to 192.168.2.90 (say) for fixed addresses. Then turn on Internet Sharing, (and reset the DHCP leases if necessary) and bingo – everything works.

I am delighted to have my network and internet sharing working again. So far everything is now fine, and has been so for the last 24 hours.

I hope this information is helpful to you and others who have been struggling with this issue. It would have been nice if Apple had provided some better advice or information to help us through this setup. 🙂

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Answer 2

jamesee

Level 1

8 points

Mar 11, 2012 6:07 PM in response to jamesee

Correction: Internet sharing assigns only one IP address to the sharing host. It is 192.168.2.1 🙂

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Answer 3

Hibernian56 Author

Level 1

46 points

Apr 3, 2012 12:01 PM in response to jamesee

Jamese,

Same here, I am the user, sys admin & boss ;-)

Yep figured that out too using a couple of ping tools. It took me a while to figure out the "apple knows best" DHCP server thing. The Eureka moment came when I substituted my dongle with my iPhone and turned off the DHCP server on the TC. Bingo.

Unbelievable that they have strong armed this into OSX internet sharing, which is fine if you have a static public IP, but with 3G its a mess, any changes to the public IP and wham. NAS drive disappears, network shares get dropped, WIFI printer is unreachable and a whole lot more headaches.

The biggest pain is the headless mac mini I use under the TV, try pressing command - K with an apple remote. I have to either use screen sharing or just cycle the power. It would be laughable if were not so serious an error.

Also it gets messed up everytime you answer a call on the iPhone, it is a phone after all.

But yes, I had to turn off the DHCP server on my €500 Timecapsule so I could use my mac mini to share an internet connection in which I now have ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL over any IP addresses. So now instead of using a fairly obscure IP range, you must use one of the "out of the box" standards that any hacker can guess in about half a second.

CONTROL FREAKS. It just works my ***.

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Answer 4

jamesee

Level 1

8 points

Apr 4, 2012 1:15 PM in response to Hibernian56

I agree that it's a bit surprising that Apple hasn't told us what's going on here.

However, I now have my installation working quite satisfactoriy.

I don't have an iPhone (yet 🙂) but it's working quite satisfactorily with the USB dongle.

I have left my Linksys router's DHCP server switched on. It seems to play happily with the Mini's setting for Internet Sharing once you set up a compatible addressing scheme for the DHCP server (as per my earlier post). When Internet Sharing is turned on the Mini overrides the original settings for the clients that are set to "use DHCP". The printers etc. with fixed IP addresses are unaffected so my network continues to function properly whether or not Internet Sharing is turned on. It is also unaffected by changes in the public IP address. I expect that you should be able to achieve the same results with your Time Capsule.

It's worth persisting. My only annoyance now is the need to restart the mobile broadband link when it goes down which is typically every 2 or 3 days.

Hope this helps. 🙂

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Answer 5

Hibernian56 Author

Level 1

46 points

May 9, 2012 9:02 AM in response to Hibernian56

Even more problems. Everytime the connection is reset Lion freaks out and can't connect to ANYTHING on the network, even fixed with IP's. I normally find this out anytime I go to print, the printer is not found by 10.7 but everything else can see it?

I filled out a bug report and got a response telling me how to use terminal to turn off the DHCP server on the mac mini, which didn't work of course;

Engineering has provided the following information:

We think the main issue is that you have both the mac mini as well as the time capsule as your dhcp servers. As of Lion, we no longer allowed the user to set up the address on the sharing interface. Basically, we will assign out private ip's in the ranges of 192.168.x.x or 10.0.0.x. And hence we think that's where the issue is. You wanted to assign a particular address for the time capsule.

What you can do is the following:

1. share you mac mini's to some computer. On that computer, check the ip address assigned. It should be in 192.168.x.x

2. now assign that address to the wan of the time capsule.

3. assign some other private address for your nas, maybe in the 10.0.0.x range.

We think this should solve your problem. If you want to disable the dhcp server on the mac mini, just do a sudo killall -9 bootpd.

Please let us know if that information helps you resolve the issue.

So Apple's solution is to hack your OS to try and over-ride their ridiculous control freak settings. Do you see the bit "Basically, we will assign out private ip's in the ranges of 192.168.x.x or 10.0.0.x". Who do they think they are? Really, they will assign the IP address' on MY network? Is that secure? Am I the only one who is extremely uncomfortable with this? Big Brother x 1000.

Assign a new IP address to my NAS, what? Again, are they in the real world? What about all of my network shortcuts, work files, backup paths, Plex, iTunes etc? Will I just spend a few more hours of my life rebuilding those libraries due to Apple's incompetence?

As I mentioned their suggested "fix" didn't work, I told them and of course was ignored once more. Case closed. Another idiot (sorry customer) satisfied. This is lunacy, give me back control of MY MACHINE.

Lets all go play Angry Birds on our iPad's.

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Answer 6

etresoft

Level 8

46,530 points

May 9, 2012 10:03 AM in response to Hibernian56

Hibernian56 wrote:

So Apple's solution is to hack your OS to try and over-ride their ridiculous control freak settings. Do you see the bit "Basically, we will assign out private ip's in the ranges of 192.168.x.x or 10.0.0.x". Who do they think they are? Really, they will assign the IP address' on MY network? Is that secure? Am I the only one who is extremely uncomfortable with this? Big Brother x 1000.

You are going to have to redirect your anger a bit higher up the food chain from Apple. International standards and organizations define the ranges for private subnets. If you expect to be connected to the internet, you must abide by the internet's standards. Apple has nothing to do with it.

Assign a new IP address to my NAS, what? Again, are they in the real world? What about all of my network shortcuts, work files, backup paths, Plex, iTunes etc? Will I just spend a few more hours of my life rebuilding those libraries due to Apple's incompetence?

Use names instead of IP addresses. All of your devices support Bonjour. Use it.

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Answer 7

Hibernian56 Author

Level 1

46 points

May 9, 2012 11:38 AM in response to etresoft

etresoft wrote:

You are going to have to redirect your anger a bit higher up the food chain from Apple. International standards and organizations define the ranges for private subnets. If you expect to be connected to the internet, you must abide by the internet's standards. Apple has nothing to do with it.

Use names instead of IP addresses. All of your devices support Bonjour. Use it.

What anger?

I have spent €1000's on Apple hardware and had a system setup that worked fine for 2 years until Apple decided to change a fundamental setting in the OS and told nobody. Remember its Apple who coined the phrase "it just works" not me.

I waited patiently for my Bug Report response which more or less told me "too bad". AND you missed the point. Apple told me to stick to TWO SPECIFIC RANGES. Read the post,

Use names instead of IP addresses. All of your devices support Bonjour. Use it.

Why do some responders always assume the poster is a newbie that knows nothing about OS X? I have been using Mac's for over 10 years now, relatively hassle free. I know what Bonjour is. I have a mixed environment, does Bonjour run on Linux (Avahi - too flaky no thanks)? It's also a bit of a Bloat-fest on Windows. So Bonjour doesn't help, it makes things worse.

Another reason for not using Bonjour is that it doesn't play well with fixed IP's. A fixed IP is a must for a NAS drive, otherwise accessing the stored media on it (3+Tb) becomes pointless.

Then there is the security related to Bonjour, will I use names? lets see, like what? Big Hard Drive? Printer Thing? Personal Windows Computer? All My Media Files Here?

Give me a break. Patronising is not very cool. Also, Bonjour can't handle iTunes properly, so why would I trust moving irreplaceable files with it? Will I stop there?

I keep a spreadsheet with all hardware listed against a fixed IP, it makes my life easier when something goes wrong. I also reserved a limited pool of IP addresses for DHCP. I also used to have exclusions in my Airport Express, "not on the list, no entry" but Lion's internet sharing broke that too. In my opinion, DHCP is only really needed for guest access. But that might just be me.

Anyway, what about the sudo killall -9 bootpd command I was told to use? Anyone have any real ideas as to why that didn't work?

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Answer 8

etresoft

Level 8

46,530 points

May 9, 2012 12:55 PM in response to Hibernian56

Hibernian56 wrote:

I waited patiently for my Bug Report response which more or less told me "too bad". AND you missed the point. Apple told me to stick to TWO SPECIFIC RANGES.

Yes. I know. Those are the only two ranges you should use for a private network. Apple isn't dictating that, the IANA is.

does Bonjour run on Linux (Avahi - too flaky no thanks)? It's also a bit of a Bloat-fest on Windows. So Bonjour doesn't help, it makes things worse.

I thnik Bonjour is your best solution.

Another reason for not using Bonjour is that it doesn't play well with fixed IP's. A fixed IP is a must for a NAS drive, otherwise accessing the stored media on it (3+Tb) becomes pointless.

You don't need a fixed IP address for that. That NAS supports Bonjour. You can even customize it as much as you want. Here is just one example: http://www.theculture.org/rich/sharpblue/archives/000192.html

Using Bonjour will not put any of your data at risk.

I keep a spreadsheet with all hardware listed against a fixed IP, it makes my life easier when something goes wrong. I also reserved a limited pool of IP addresses for DHCP.

That sure doesn't sound easier. If you used Bonjour things wouldn't go wrong. You can use fixed IP addresses if you want. They just have to be in one of the two private network ranges. You can hack up Lion if you want. Follow these instructions from Lion Server. They should work fine in Lion too.

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Answer 9

Hibernian56 Author

Level 1

46 points

May 9, 2012 1:39 PM in response to etresoft

Yes. I know. Those are the only two ranges you should use for a private network. Apple isn't dictating that, the IANA is.

Well well, you learn something new every day. What were they thinking?

You don't need a fixed IP address for that. That NAS supports Bonjour. You can even customize it as much as you want. Here is just one example: http://www.theculture.org/rich/sharpblue/archives/000192.html

I will give the NAS thing a look, but the problem now as I mentioned is the fact that all of my libraries point to the IP address (due to early CIF / SMB issues with Windows XP & OSX). That's a good pointer, but I hope it works with SMB. You made me think about SMB, I'm feeling depressed now.

That sure doesn't sound easier. If you used Bonjour things wouldn't go wrong. You can use fixed IP addresses if you want. They just have to be in one of the two private network ranges. You can hack up Lion if you want. Follow these instructions from Lion Server. They should work fine in Lion too.

Ok, I'll try Bonjour. It's late and I have beers!!

I haven't looked at it since I last battled with iTunes Sharing. But does it run on Android? I have my Calibre ebook library running on my Dell Cad Monster Windows Machine (it crawls on OSX), it took a while to set up, I don't want to go down that road again.

You can hack up Lion if you want. Follow these instructions from Lion Server. They should work fine in Lion too.

I try to avoid hacks because usually a couple of weeks later I forget what I've done!!

Thanks for the help.

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