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lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

I have OS 4.2.1 on my ipod touch (shoud be IOS 5 now).  I have the latest tiuens (10.6.1). itunes tells me my ipod OS is up to date, and therefore will not let me update.


Any ideas?


I am having a (BIG) problem with itunes not seeing the correct free space on my ipod, so I cannot add anything (I have very little on it). apple store told me to start by getting the most current OS - can't do it. Big problem.


In addition, my computer (Windows 7) does not see my ipod as a disk drive. It's listed in devices and when I check for updates it says the driver is up to date. But otherwise does not see it.

iPod touch, iOS 4.1
  • lllaass Level 10 (176,128 points)

    I suspect you have a 2G iPod. That one can only go to iOS 4.2.1. If yous is an 8 or 16 GB one without a camera it is a 2G iPod. A 32 GB without a camera can be either a 2G or 3G iPod,. To idenity yours see:

    Identifying iPod models

  • wiclee Level 5 (6,955 points)

    IOS 5 is only compatible to 3rd and 4th generation iPod touch.

  • the fiend Level 6 (8,285 points)

    The iPod Touch does not have a disk drive that you can see.


    What do you mean by "not seeing the correct free space" on your iPod? How do you know?


    If there is a lot of "Other", that you can correct. Otherwise, what free space are you trying to find?

  • lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

    I have 3G

  • lllaass Level 10 (176,128 points)

    Are you sure?

    What is the capacity and what model number is on the back?

  • lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

    Fiend - in the past I was pretty sure that the computer saw my ipod as a removable drive - am I remembering



    The free space on my ipod - ie space that I should be able to add more music, etc. to. I know because itunes tells me I have not enough free space to add. But I only have 287 songs on an *GB. the iopod itself is saying I have 5MB free of the total 6.8GB available - also crazy. itunes thinks the vast majority is taken up by audio.


    It turns out it is an ipod 2 so the OS is up to date, despite ehat Apple store guy told me,

  • the fiend Level 6 (8,285 points)

    If you take a screenshot on your iPod Touch, then when you connect it to iTunes, you will be able to see the folder on the iPod with the photos (screenshots) in there. Although you may think it looks like a disk drive, you cannot use it to store files.


    The iPod Touch does not have any "disk drive or flash storage space" that you can use.


    Now to the "free space";

    5MB is not very much. In fact it's not enough and that's probably why iTunes is saying there isn't enough space available. Don't forget, the Touch will need space to use for whatever it's trying to do, i.e. remember tracks played etc. A three-minute song at 128Kbps will take up approximately 3.2MB, leaving only 1.8MB for the iPod to use. So there isn't any space left for you to use, not even for one song, I reckon. 5MB simply isn't enough to add more music and leave room for the iPod to "perform its work".


    So why is so much space being used up by only 287 songs?

    What format are you songs in?


    Apple's figures for the number of songs you can put on an 8GB iPod (I think it's approximately 1,500) is based on each song being an average of 4 minutes and in AAC format at 128Kbps.


    So if your songs are all eight to ten minutes long (or average 8-10 minutes) that will reduce the number of songs you can store. Even if they are all only 3 or 4 minutes long, if they are in MP3 format at 256Kbps, once again that will reduce the number of songs you can get on your iPod.


    So if you are using a high bit-rate format (192Kbps or higher), perhaps you should try a lower rate. You may not even notice the difference. Free up some space on the iPod and then put on it several different copies of the same song, but in different formats. If you cannot hear the difference between the high rate and the low rate formats, why bother with the high rate format? (If you regularly listen to your songs through a high quality amplifier, you may hear the difference.)

  • lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

    Here's my point - I know there is a LOT more than 5MB on the ipod. When this first started happening itunes said I had 6.6GB of audio. I took 3.3 GB OFF. itunes Still said I had 6.6 GB of audio on the iopd - it did not even see that I had deleted a ton. And it would not let me put anything back on.


    Then I started looking at the ipod itself. At this point it said I only had 19MB free. I took off a tiny ebook, I did a backup and restore - then it said I had 5MB left - less thatn before !!


    When I had the other 3.3 GB on there everything played fine and it had let me put more on.


    Most of my songs are under 3 mins, and were taken from the CDs using Windows media player and seem to be  in .wma. Some things are in .mp3 format. I have no idea what bit rate.  I am not doing anything to fancy to put things on here.  but all of this, I believe is completely besides the point. I have very little on there I had a ton more and suddenly it would not add any more even when I took a ton off. It is not reading the free space correctly.


    This is a problem many people are having and have been having for quite a while. Ans it is happening on ipods, iphones, and ipads! Some people think it is since some version of itunes 10, but that would not explain why my ipod itself is reading incorrectly.


    You can take a quick peek at this thread and see what I mean  -


    I'm just hoping someone somewhere else in this community has figured this put, but so far no luck.


    (itune shows 6.6 GB as audio, .02 as Other)

  • the fiend Level 6 (8,285 points)

    lakeside339 wrote:


    Here's my point - I know there is a LOT more than 5MB on the ipod.

    But you said 5MB, so that's what I responded to and if that's what iTunes says, why do you disbelieve it?



    lakeside339 wrote:



    Most of my songs are under 3 mins, and were taken from the CDs using Windows media player and seem to be  in .wma. Some things are in .mp3 format. I have no idea what bit rate.


    Then you need to find out, especially the wma files that were created by something other than iTunes, which is the case since iTunes doesn't rip in wma format. Select a song and then click File/Get Info/Summary>Bit Rate. You will also notice the file size listed on that pane too. Try a few songs, both the wma and the MP3s, not just one of each.


    lakeside339 wrote:

    but all of this, I believe is completely besides the point.

    That depends, you started off with one set of circumstances and then changed to a different set. So you now have to rule out every possibilty.


    I don't know how you are managing your ipod, but the results appear less than satisfactory. I think you should start by connecting the iPod to iTunes and then looking on the Device/Summary pane and making a note of what iTunes says is on the iPod. If, as you say, the Audio is taking up 6.6GB with just 287 songs, then work out exactly what that 6.6Gb is. Don't forget, it's audio, so do have other audio such as Podcasts or iTunes U on your iPod? What about video, photos, books or Apps?


    It's either that, or the bit rate of the 287 songs, since you say that Other is only using 0.2GB, which I would say is a very small amount. My iPod shows 0.41GB of Other. Oh! and by the way, my iTunes says I have 3.4GB free, but the iPod says 3.3Gb free, so there will be slight discrepancies, but they aren't worth worrying about since even 19MB isn't going to get you very far.


    I wouldn't spend too much time concentrating on the topic you linked to - it's eighteen months old and since there have been updates to both iTunes and your iPod since then, it probably isn't relevant.


    Or, you could simply Restore your iPod which will remove everything from it and if you use Sync to manage your iPod, then whatever is selected in your Library to Sync with your iPod will be put on it, but nothing else. If there is still a problem then, I would say it's the bit rate.


    By all means hope that someone else in this community has this figured out, but since you asked for "any ideas", then until you try the ones I've made, what else are you hoping for? After all, as you said, the store employee was wrong, wasn't he?

  • the fiend Level 6 (8,285 points)

    I notice in that post you linked to, you mention that you have four Apps on your iPod - and yet you didn't think to mention that here, in your own discussion!

  • stevejobsfan0123 Level 8 (40,262 points)

    I'm afraid you are mistaken-- you have a 2nd gen iPod, which is why it says 4.2.1 is the latest version.

    To confirm, get your serial number: printed on the back of the iPod, or go to Settings > General > About > Serial Number.


    Then enter it here:

  • lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

    Yes - I did figure that out and I guess only mentioned it in another post.

    Thank you

  • lakeside339 Level 1 (0 points)

    @the fiend - sorry for being crabby. This is very frustrating.  I had 4 small apps on the ipod - I took them off and both itunes and the ipod 'gave me back' 85 MB. 


    Why don't I believe itunes? Because it said I was using 6.6 GB of audio. I removed over 3 GB (which I used to listen to regularly) and it still says I have over 6 GB of audio, and would only let me put a (short) song or two on.


    Here are examples of the details you were asking me about:


    287 songs/audios

    2:30 min = 4.8MB

    bit rate = 256 kbps

    sample rate = 44.100 kHz

    format:  mpeg-1, layer 3

    encoded with: itunes, Quick Time 7.6.6 (Or older),

    Kind - AAC audio file


    MPEG audio file

    2:41 mins

    2.5 MB

    format:  mpeg-1, layer 3

    bit rate =  128  kbps (160)

    encoded with - unknown


    MPEG audio file

    3.45 mins

    5.2 mb

    bit rate - 192 kbps

    format:  mpeg-1, layer 3

    encoded with LAME3.92


    18 lectures:


    29 mins

    33 MB

    160 kbps

    format:  mpeg-1, layer 3

    encoded with Lavf52.3.2.0

  • the fiend Level 6 (8,285 points)

    In your list, you haven't stated how many songs are in any particular bit rate, but you can see for yourself  that a song with a bit rate of 256Kbps uses twice as much storage space as a song at 128Kbps for the same time.


    lakeside339 wrote:


    2:30 min = 4.8MB

    bit rate = 256 kbps




    2:41 mins

    2.5 MB

    bit rate =  128  kbps (160)

    So I say again; the probable reason that your 287 songs are using so much space and leaving you with so litlte space is the bit rate of the some of the songs you have on the iPod. In addition, you have some lectures that not only use a bit rate higher than 128Kbps (you state 160Kbps), but they are 29 minutes long. Is that each (of the 18) episodes?


    That's all a far cry from 128Kbps and four minutes long. (The figure Apple use to determine how many songs will fit on an iPod.)


    So where do you go from here? Well, a Restore has been mentioned, by me, and by turingtest2 in another post you contributed to. A Restore will remove everything from your iPod and then only put back what you tell it to and it will clean up any left-over files that you've deleted but for some strange reason, haven't been removed from the count of how much storage space has been used. They should be listed under Other, but previously, you stated that this figure was very small. If you use Sync only ticked songs and videos to help manage your iPod, you mnay find it easier. That way, you can tick/untick stuff in your iTunes Library, then Sync the iPod for those changes to take effect on the iPod.


    I suggest:

    • you don't assume that other posts will help you because they have losts of contributors , especially if they have not been marked as answered by the person who first posted the question.
    • note how many points a contributor has. Turingtest2 has far more than me, by the way. More points means that more of that contributor's responses have been marked as useful, hepful or solved the problem, by the person who started the thread. It doesn't mean that someone with zero points is definitely wrong, but, how else do you decide which person's "help" really is helpful? It is at least some sort of guide.
    • you believe me and turingtest2, you DO NOT have an 8GB 3rd gen Touch (I believe you now know that) - 'cos there is no such thing as a 3rd gen Touch in 8GB capacity. (Yes, there is a 2nd, and a 4th gen in 8GB, but there still isn't a 3rd gen in that size.) No matter what anyone else says in any post or to your face.
    • the 2nd gen Touch cannot - repeat cannot - go higher than iOS 4.2.1 - no matter what anyone else says - including Apple Store staff. If they said you can go to iOS 5, they're wrong!
    • you stick to one post and not keep adding to other posts. I can't follow the trail of your discussions, can you? And since different threads have different information from you, sometimes conflicting information, it's hard to work out where the problem is. No wonder you find it frustrating.
    • accept that if iTunes says there is only so much space, then it really doesn't matter what you think, because that will not get any more space on the iPod. If iTunes thinks there is 5MB, then that's what iTunes will work with. If - if and once again if, you really have good grounds for believing that the iPod is incorrectly reporting the free space, then do a Restore. But don't go listening to everyone else saying "my iPod is reporting the wrong amount of free space", because at the moment, that isn't helping you, is it? And I've yet to see one post with that "problem" that has been marked as solved.


    Make sure that you have accounted for every single song, video, lecture, Podcast and picture on your iPod and that you know what bit rate and format they are using. Try putting the same song onto your iPod in different formats and (more importantly), different bit rates. If you cannot hear and appreciate the difference between a song at 128Kbps and the same song at 256Kbps, then why use 256Kbps? (Try listening in the various ways you usually do, headphones, docking station, audio lead to high quality Hi-Fi stereo, etc. etc. (The HiFi system is most likely to highlight the difference.)


    If you cannot appreciate the difference and decide that 128Kbps is good enough for you, then reduce the bit rate of your existing songs. Either import them from CD again, but at the lower rate, or if iTunes will do it, convert higher bit rate songs to 128Kbps using the facility on Device/Summary>convert higher bit rate songs to 128Kbps. I suggest you don't use any lower than 128Kbps.


    Don't forget either, any screenshots that you've taken on the iPod will stay in the Camera Roll on the iPod until you remove them. So even if you copy photos (those screenshots) from your iPod to the computer, until you remove them form the ipod, they are still taking up space.


    Finally, perhaps you simply have to accept that an 8Gb iPod isn't large enough for your requirements. So either, you decide if you can afford to buy a larger capacity iPod and sell your current one, or you simply have to be more agressive in managing the space on the current one. I have to make sure I remove any Podcasts from my iPod that I no longer want on there, because I run out of space quickly if I don't.

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