Expanding 400mhz G4?

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Expanding 400mhz G4?

Hi,

I've got a Powermac G4 400mz that I want to use as a sever which I'll hook up to my Dual 1.8 G5.

Right now it has a 10gb WD hard drive in it!
What I'd like to know is what is the largest size HD I can put in the G4, is there a limit. Also, which type, Sata?

I'd appreciate any advice.

Thank you,

Mark

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

Posted on Mar 9, 2006 6:16 PM

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Answer 1

Mar 9, 2006 8:14 PM in response to ANDO111

You're pretty much limited to 137GB using the built-in ATA-66 or ATA-33 controller (the PCI graphics or "Yikes!" G4s have ATA-33, while the AGP graphics or "Sawtooth" G4s have ATA-66).

Any ATA drive should work fine as long as it's under 137GB. A larger drive should still work, but you would be unable to use its full capacity. Don't worry about drive speeds. If you get an ATA-100 drive, it will still work at 66 or 33 speeds.

If you want a larger and/or faster drive, I recommend picking up a SATA PCI card. The SeriTek card is a good performer and not too expensive. From that point you could really pick up just about any SATA drive.

Cheers!

MDD Dual 1.25 G4 | 2GB RAM | Mac OS X (10.4.5) | Logic Pro 7.2 | AMT8 | Unitor8 | Delta 44 | SoundDiver 3.1 PB2

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Answer 2

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 9, 2006 10:23 PM in response to Nathan Pangburn

Hi Nathan,

So what you are saying is if I swap out the existing card for a SERITEK CARD I can then go and get any size sata HD I like and it will work fine?

Also, how many drives will the G4 take? I have no idea.

Can I have more than one drive in a server?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm new to all this server stuff!

Regards,
Mark

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

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Answer 3

Mar 10, 2006 8:40 AM in response to ANDO111

Hi Mark,

There is no existing card. The ATA controller is built-in to the motherboard. But you are understanding correctly. If you add the PCI SATA controller you could use up to two SATA drives of any size and they should work fine in OS X. OS 9 would be a different story and you'd need to be sure that the card is supported.

You should be able to fit two drives in the Mac for sure (by removing the old 10GB disk), with the possibility of another in the bay below the optical drive if you don't have a Zip drive installed. I haven't looked inside the case of one of those old G4s in a long time, but it appears that another mounting location is available next to the dual drive carrier. You will have to look to see.

You also might find these instructions (PDF) helpful about installing a drive into an older G4 case.

Finally, yes you can have as many drives in your computer as you have space for. You just may need more controllers to connect them to.

What are you going to use the server for? Just storage space?

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Answer 4

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 10, 2006 4:41 PM in response to Nathan Pangburn

Hi Nathan,

Thanks for your excellent advice. Very much appreciated 🙂

I'm a photographer (Old school who just went over to digital recently) who has to send images by FTP all the time. Most of the time I ask people for their FTP address details and then upload them to their server. But lately there's been problems. You know, passwords wrong, no authorization etc, just a headache!. I asked a friend what I should do and he said dig out your old G4 out of your garage and use it as a server!

I have no idea how it is done but as he said to me, tear out the HD as it will be VERY small, put in a new larger one or two and I'll hook it up.

So, I opened up the G4 and discovered it was a 10gb HD (crazy huh!)
It looks so different inside from my G5 that I thought hummm! I better ask around. I couldn't ask my friend as he wasn't too sure himself.
When I told him about the card he said "Yes, of course that makes sense".

He said he can do it but he's never done it on a G4........(Haaaa! sounds like trouble brewing.)

Cheers,
Mark

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

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Answer 5

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 13, 2006 10:36 PM in response to ANDO111

Hi,

Nathan, just wondering. If I put in the Seritek card you recommended would I be able to use this HD?
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Seagate/ST3400832AS/

It's probably a stupid question but I had to ask.

Cheers,
Mark

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

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Answer 6

Mar 14, 2006 7:18 AM in response to ANDO111

Hi again Mark,

It's not a stupid question. The only stupid questions are those that aren't asked. But yes, you should be able to use that drive with the SeriTek controller. 🙂

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Answer 7

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 14, 2006 8:30 AM in response to Nathan Pangburn

Nathan,

Once again, Thank you.

Mark

G5 POWERMAC dual 1.8 Mac OS X (10.4.2)

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Answer 8

Mar 16, 2006 6:37 PM in response to Nathan Pangburn

Hi, Nathan!

Good advice! Mark could also purchase a 4-port SATA card and use a power splitter and/or extension cable on one of the power cables. He might be able to put a stacking drive tray in the bay next to the existing one, too, if the top will clear the logic board with the side door closed...

Gary

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Answer 9

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 30, 2006 10:19 PM in response to Majordadusma

Hi,

OK so I finally got down to Fry's to get the parts.
I ended up installing a Seagate 259gb Ultra ATA/100 HD .
Then, Fry's didn't have a Firmtek card so they suggested a
Promise Tec Ultra 133 card
http://www.promise.com/product/productdetail_eng.asp?segment=Non-RAID%20HBAs&productid=87

Anyway, I put them in, turned on the machine and I'm getting a flashing box/? image !
I then tried adding the jumpers in various configurations but still the flashing ?/box.

I have no idea what to do from here.

Regards,
Ando

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Answer 10

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 31, 2006 12:17 AM in response to ANDO111

I've been reading some other posts and I'm hopeing it's one of two things.
The card instructions said to connect the 40pin connector to the card itself, not the motherboard.

The other thing ifs the jumpers, what is the correct order they need to go in, can anyone tell me please.
There is only 1 HD in the G4 now, the new seagate I put in.

Any help appreciated.

Cheers,
Mark

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Answer 11

Mar 31, 2006 1:05 PM in response to ANDO111

Hi Mark,

The flashing ? you see is probably there because you don't have an operating system installed on the new drive. I assume the old drive still contains an operating system, you could reinstall that drive or more easily you could start up from an original system install disc and load the new drive with it.

I'm not sure if the original install disc will have any issues with the new ATA 133 and PCI card so perhaps a retail edition of OSX 10.4 might be needed.

As far as jumper settings are concerned, I would use the Master setting for the new drive. However if you choose the option of installing the old drive as well, on the 66 bus then I would try setting both to Cable Select first and if that didn't work I'd try using a Master/Slave setup with the new 133 drive designated as Master.

Dan

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Answer 12

Mar 31, 2006 2:05 PM in response to ANDO111

Ando:

Although hard drives are platform universal, PCI cards are not. You need a card that's specifically designed to work with Macs. It appears fom the specs on the site you referenced that the card you bought is for PCs (requires Windows).

I'd return it and get this one from Sonnet, this one from Acard, or this one from SIIG, since you opted for ATA versus SATA and purchased an ATA hard drive.

On an MDD Mac, set the jumpers on all of your hard drives to cable select and the computer should recognize them all aprropriately, regardless of the controller they're on. Also, when you have a single drive on a ribbon cable, it's good practice to connect it to the end connector of the cable to prevent fringe signal interference (which could cause drive data corruption).

The flashing question mark appears when the Mac does not "see" an OS to boot from. After an internal hardware addition, it's a good idea to reset PRAM to "retrain" the Mac where to look for the drives and other hardware (PCI cards, AGP video card, etc).

Gary

1GHz DP G4 Quicksilver 2002, 400MHz B&W rev.2 G3, Mac SE30 Mac OS X (10.4.5) 5G iPod, Epson 2200 & R300 & LW Select 360 Printers, Epson 3200 Scanner

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Answer 13

ANDO111 Author

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Mar 31, 2006 7:13 PM in response to Majordadusma

Thanks guys.

I'll return the card tomorriow and get a new one.
I can't find the original startup CD so I was going to install OS10.
Trouble is I have a cd player, need a DVD. I'll get one of those as well.

I'll let you know how I get on.

Once again, thank you for your help.

Regards,
Ando

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Answer 14

Apr 1, 2006 12:24 AM in response to ANDO111

Ando:

If you're going to install OS X, I'd recommend that you don't do it from your G5 OEM install disk, which has machine-specific drivers, as opposed to the universal ones that are present on the retail versions. If you purchase a retail copy of Tiger, you can swap the DVD for CDs with Apple for $10 using the Exchange Program. Alternately, you could install a DVD burner. A DL Pioneer DVR-100/110D or 111, or a NEC ND-3550A can be had for about $40 and they're both nicely compatible. You might also try doing the install using FW Target Disk Mode from the G5 to the G4, though I can't help you there because I've never done it myself.

Gary

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Answer 15

ANDO111 Author

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Apr 2, 2006 5:12 PM in response to Majordadusma

Hi,

Bought a DVD, hooked her up, partioned the drive and ran OX10, I'm running sweet.

Thanks everyone for the great advice.

Take care,
Ando

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