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  • PieterBreda Level 1 (0 points)

    Although Apple made no official announcement during the WWDC keynote, the absence of the 17-inch MacBook Pro from the online store can be taken as proof positive that the notebook has been dumped from the lineup. So, it's certainly gone, but why?

    Rumors that Apple was going to dump the 17-inch MacBook Pro go as far back as April when Ming-Chi Kuo, an analyst with KGI Securities, predicted that Apple was "likely to stop making" the large notebook because of weak sales. Weak sales would be a good reason for a company like Apple to ditch a product, especially given how rapidly the company turns over its inventory every five days or so. Apple doesn't want products laying around in stores gathering dust. It wants them to roll up in delivery trucks today, and be carried out by happy customers tomorrow.

    However, one thing that blows a hole in this weak sales theory is Apple's continued commitment to the Mac Pro. While we're not offered any figures by Apple, I'm certain that the company sold more 17-inch MacBook Pros over the last year than it has Mac Pro systems. I certainly come across more 17-inch MacBook Pro systems than I do Mac Pros. While I'm sure that while sales played a part in Apple's decision to drop the larger of the MacBook Pro systems, I'm also certain that it wasn't the only reason for their demise.

    So what other reason might Apple have had to dump the 17-inch MacBook Pro? To answer this, I think we need to look at the screen.

    Why Apple dumped the 17-inch MacBook Pro _ ZDNet_2012-12-02_18-37-07.png

    Apple revamped the MacBook Pro lineup and moved them over to having high-resolution 'retina' display screens. The 15.4-inch display on the MacBook Pro has a 2880-by-1800 resolution and packs over 5 million pixels into the panel. That's not only an amazingly large high pixel density, it's also a very large panel to have that sort of pixel density.

    Back in May 2012, Richard Shim, senior analyst with NPD DisplaySearch, believed that Apple was in a position to source high pixel density 13.3-inch and 15.4-inch LCD panels from suppliers such as Sharp, LG Display, and Samsung. What wasn't mentioned was 17-inch panels, and the likely reason for this is that panel makers have not yet perfected a technique for making these panels at the appropriate cost and yield for Apple to be able to continue to offer a 17-inch MacBook Pro.

    When LCD panel makers get better at making 'retina' display screen, and 17-inch panels start rolling off the production lines at the right price point, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Apple starts to offer 'retina' display enabled 17-inch MacBook Pro systems once again. Especially if the demand is there.

    As every one can notice, the demand for the Apple Macbook Pro 17 inch with Retina Display is very alive world wide.


    Message was edited by: PieterBreda

  • Marcinfromny Level 1 (0 points)

    The only reason I didn't by the new Macbook pro is that:


    1 - I plan to keep it it for years to come, I currently own a 2007 model.15inch not powerfull enough.

    2 - It's video card is not powerfull enough to keep up with the current top of the line games, such as Witcher two running the full resulotion with settings maxed out.

    3 - I want a larger screen in a laptop, I have 17inch pro and it could be bigger



    Also after looking elsewhere I'm a step away form buying a Lenovo all in one machine. Imac not impressive without the bluray, no retina, no touch interface.


    Apple please give us 17 inch with retina.

  • BarefootHank Level 1 (0 points)

    Hi All,


    Please hunker down, take your time and read this through please, it's worth it, I promise.


    FIrst and Foremost, I join our MacBook Pro 17 community in our utter disbelief in Apple's apparent decision...


    OK, so Apple has removed their best, most functional notebook (MBP17) for power users and professionals from their product line up, depriving millions of us of the amazing, truly mobile office they had available.

    OK, I've heard the argument that side by side the 17 can be mistaken for the 15, and it's true to an extent.

    OK, I've listened patiently while the nonsense of the unacceptable 2% sales number is thrown around.

    AND of course I/We understand Tim Cook's responsibility to his shareholders and THAT is exactly why I propose what to do about it right here.



    You don't want a MacBook Pro 17 with Retina Display. Yes, you heard that right.

    You want a MacBook Pro 19, a real workstation, that fits in the same computer bag you have today.



    We all lose our way occasionally, and Apple needs a gentle roar of a nudge to remember what is involved to produce and market a high-end professional product from us; But let's make this really productive.

    Apple needs to acknowledge to themselves that HOW you sell a high-end product profitably is simply this:

    GIVE IT FEATURES THAT WE WANT, THAT WE CAN'T GET ANYWHERE ELSE, including in their own products, namely the 13, 15 and older 17.

    And also consider that maybe this pause in production of the 17 is exactly that... just a pause, to test the market reaction?

    What if Apple is actually pursuing an end-all-be-all mobile workstation like I'm describing here.

    Hearing support from all of you right here, right now may be all that is needed to light a proverbial fire.


    Do you honestly think Apple wants to go backward? I don't think so.

    When is the last time that Apple has acted in an illogical way?

    Apple is made up of very smart people, including those on the board of directors (with the possible exception of Al Gore); and it defies logic that they would throw in the towel in the professional mobile workstation arena, doesn't it?


    Look Apple, "We" suggest that you just call the introduction of MacBook Pro 19 a celebration of your unprecedented success... and then proceed to profitably produce "The Flagship" to say thank you.


    There is only one way to go at this point.


    Produce an even larger MacBook Pro than the 17 and justify it by having features on it that you CANNOT GET ON THE SMALLER MODELS...

    Come on Tim, think about this for a moment.  What features do we wish the 15 & 13 had but that there is obviously no room for?


    I agree that at a glance, especially closed, it's easy to mistake a 17 for a 15... SO?

    Make it a CAGE RATTLING DIFFERENCE! One that CANNOT be ignored.

    Bring the Flagship back and put it on growth hormone.

    I am deadly serious now:


    MacBook Pro 19

    (ships with 16GB memory and a 500GB SSD)

    A spectacular masterpiece of mobile computing!

    (ZERO identity crisis with the 15 now, right?)

    (with or without retina display, we honestly could not care less)

    • Matte Screen and original contoured keyboard... (this is a No Chicklet Zone)
    • Full Keyboard with modded Number Pad on the side of course. (CPA's and Accountants you're welcome)
    • Accessory bay for additional battery or SSD or Optical, whatever you like, ejects with a bottom button.
    • Extra Video card for a total of 3 displays... this is GIGANTIC.
    • 4 Memory slots for a maximum of 32GB Ram, but configure it to handle 64GB so someone will develop it.
    • 6 USB ports and the ususal compliment of other ports.
    • Quad Core processors and extra fan that makes this absurdly FAST!
    • Cellular Radio built in with 4G (may or may not require a sim card)
    • GPS unit built in for a complete Microcell Tower setup for poor iPhone reception areas. (incl antenna jack).
    • What else? SatComms? Anyone?
    • Come on, seriously, what else do you want to see on this?


    Folks, this is a REAL MOBILE OFFICE for REAL professionals.




    The argument that you couldn't find a case for a big machine is FALSE.

    2 of these machines will fit in my Brenthaven bag right now, as is, back to back, NO Problem, but they will certainly make a great selection of bags for it, should it arrive on the market. I cut plywood blanks, it works.

    Current MacBook Pro 17 = 15.4"W x 10.4"D

    Flagship Macbook Pro 19 = 17.4"W x 11.4"D

    This is be 2" Wider and 1" Deeper larger than the Current MBP 17 is right now!


    (If you reduce the lip around the screen by .2" that would be = 17"W x 11"D as you are with other displays...

    This would be only 1.6" Wider and .6" Deeper larger than the Current MBP 17 is right now!




    MSRP Base Price $3,495. Topping out at around $5,000 for the fastest everything.


    I'm willing to bet that there are several million well paid professionals that wouldn't think twice about that price tag. I'm also willing to bet that many accountants would jump on this, maybe just for the numberpad alone. And Apple?.. accountants make a ton of money; so add another segment of the pro population to your list of enthusiastic buyers.



    20 Million iphones at $299 = $6 Billion

    2 Million MBP19 at $4000 = $8 Billion (IF you make it a one-of-a-kind machine)



    I need this machine... I'll take two, right now... Credit Card standing by...

    I need it for day trading, map making in Illustrator, Inventing with AutoCAD inventor and publishing books.


    I can visualize pulling two of these out of my case and popping them open in a WiFi hotspot coffee shop.

    Tandem MBP19's up and running in minutes... Bloomberg Terminal on the left, NinjaTrader on the right.

    Heck I'd probably sell 4-5 more of them for you just from people passing by and seeing this setup.

    Heck for once I'll actually have a greater icebreaking topic of conversation then my Vibram Five Fingers, LOL.

    And of course, what is my tag line?  "Yep, they are the fastest Windows machines on the planet".


    DESIGN: Make it in Annodized Aluminum like a menacing, dark 80's Silicon Graphic Indy machine... Sexy and Bad to the Bone... Talk about standing out?   And while you're at it, why not introduce the solid block anodized aluminum mouse that matches?


    NECESSARY MARKETING: (NOT a segue) You need to start sponsoring Professional Tennis like BNP Paribas and Mercedes; and not just to make a statement. That's where you sell machines like this... Imagine Roger Federer placing a trade or browsing the net on a MBP19 in front of 20 million wealthy tennis fans?


    NEW AREA: Have you thought about selling pre-partitioned machines with your own brand of Parallels or VMware on them?  Do you know how many people run Windows, by neccessity on your MacBooks?


    ADVERSITY: You faced it before over your iphone 4 antenna... How did that work out?

    The iOS Mapping App you released that is receiving so much criticism is a FANTASTIC APP... you just need time to bring the global data up to speed... to reiterate... it BLOWS GOOGLE AWAY.  Especially for navigation.

    Take that chance again, on us, your loyal base. But do it right... in grand fashion.



    This isn't just about sales.  This is a declaration to the world "We are all about our professionals". And the professionals will all say "They're not just making cool toys for teenagers; They remembered us."


    I can hear it now when some people first hear about the MBP19 or see it online... "Look at that behemoth" and "it's way too big" and "4 Grand for a notebook?"...

    Yeah, then you sell 4 million of them, bank $16B and the mealymouthing turns into glowing admiration, yet again.

    Your stock hits $900/share.

    Apple is unstoppable in ALL areas of the computing industry... I'm just saying.


    Mr. Cook you'd sell millions of MBP19's, just because...

    Just make the decision to completely annhilate the notebook market competition, once and for all.

    Talk to your share holders.

    Talk to the big thinkers and more open-minded designers in your company.

    Think about it.




    OK Guys and Girls, now it's your turn to help Apple realize what a great idea this is by showing your support.

    The 17 is dead.. ALL HAIL THE NEW KING MBP19!!

  • quantxxx Level 1 (0 points)

    Screen Shot 2012-12-02 at 21.27.42.png

  • STUPENDOUS!!! Level 1 (25 points)

    Apple would need a 17" retina panel to make a 17" rMBP. Does one exist? No.

    Who makes the retina displays? Samsung & Sharp.

    Who is currently embroiled in billion dollar court cases with Apple?


    When the retina manufacturers feel that there would be demand for a 17" display,

    I am sure that they'd make one.

    Or maybe those manufacturers have Apple where they want them.

    As Apple focuses more and more on profit-making, they are shrugging off their unprofitable products.

    That could include Final Cut Studio, and 17" MBP's. Unfortunately I use both of those.

    So let's all ask Apple if we can please have a 17" rMBP.

    Here's the link to do so

  • Calvin Vette Level 1 (0 points)

    I have bought every version of the 17" MacBook Pro since they've been offered. For reasons that are my own, I feel I need a 17" screen. I'm extremely disappointed that it's no longer available for my next laptop purchase.


    I expect Apple to offer top-of-the-line options to go along with the top-of-the-line price tags. Not offering a 17" MacBook while Dell and HP offer multiple lines (Inpsiron, Precision, Envy, Pavillion)  of 17" at significantly lower prices places Apple in a league below them.


    This is the kind of pre-Steve thinking that can't return in the post-Steve world. If Apple stops obsessing about its image again, it will fall again.


    I don't want to seriously consider going back to buying PCs, but Apple just isn't offering me a choice here.

  • Grant Bennet-Alder Level 9 (56,466 points)

    Should your new 19" display MacBook pro come with a detachable display with a kickstand and ability to add a 1 meter cord?

  • BarefootHank Level 1 (0 points)

    Nah.  There are more and more portable USB powered displays coming out.


    You want one big notebook with plenty of USB 3.0 ports so that you could run two other 16 or 20" displays on either side potentially.


    The macbook would have to be plugged in though because those things suck you battery dry fast.



  • BarefootHank Level 1 (0 points)

    Check out Notebooks by M-Tech.

    Check out USB-powered displays by AOC.


    I have as my wallpaper, a young Steve Jobs holding an apple, with the caption "Think Different".

    That is how loyal I am.


    But when Apple abandons my professional needs I don't just pine away and stop being that professional.

    I look elsewhere.


    And while we're on the topic... has anyone taken a good hard look at Windows 8 yet?

    As a Mac guy, let me tell you... it IS superior to MacOS in many ways.

    That's a fact.


    I hope you're listening Mr. Cook.

  • BarefootHank Level 1 (0 points)

    To Clarify...

    I neither want nor do I need a so-called "Retina Display".

    All the reading glasses, contact lenses and lasik surgery in the world will get you only so far after you clear age 50.


    The question?

    Who has the money and desire to buy large, high powered professional equipment?

    Age 40 and up.

    That and institutions.


    The fact remains...

    20 Million iphones at $299 = $6 Billion

    2 Million MBP19 at $4000 = $8 Billion (IF you make it a one-of-a-kind machine AND market it to the right people)


    Isn't math great?

  • veepro Level 1 (0 points)

    Please help me to understand these numbers ???


    Hello everyone,



    Please help me make sense of all these numbers and if I should be mindful of anything in particular about my two refurb 17" MBPs of late 2011 and 2.5Ghz quadcore i7 notebooks (recently arrived to me to test drive):












    Are the numbers typical and in good over all levels or should I be concerned?





    Thanks much!

  • clintonfrombirmingham Level 7 (30,000 points)

    The top image has the 'best' charge remaining from the original charge, although the second is nothing to worry about. Apple considers batteries to be 'consumables' so, at some point in the future, either could require a new battery. The cycle count is very, very low on both batteries (even less on the second image) indicating that the batteries have not really been cycled enough for a late 2011 computer. Again, nothing to worry about.


    Both batteries look to be in fine shape - the first perhaps a bit 'healthier' - so I would buy either one. All things being equal, go for the one in the first image as the battery there seems a little 'healthier'.


    Just my 2¢...


  • veepro Level 1 (0 points)

    Thanks Clinton,


    Curious, if Apple's refurb standards are so 'strict' then why would they not install a brand new battery prior to shipping the order?    The display of the second image's power stat is also a little less bright than the first.  Though OS X Lion on the second one is running snappier and less problematic than OS X Mountain Lion on the first one. 


    I will call them tomorrow about the battery again because the first time I talked with a tech phone support and he had no idea what I was talking about when I read those numbers from the images...   Maybe I can bring it in and get a fresh battery installed right there at the store?

  • clintonfrombirmingham Level 7 (30,000 points)

    Maybe I can bring it in and get a fresh battery installed right there at the store?


    I don't know about that - I'm sure that the batteries on both machines passed Apple's tech check when it went in for the refurb. It's something you could always try to 'negotiate', I suppose.



  • OGELTHORPE Level 8 (45,035 points)

    Did you get these two MBPs from Apple or an Apple reseller?  When you made the images of the Battery Information display, were the MBPs connected to a power adapter?


    Here is are the statistics from my MBP (late 2011,17" 2.5 GHz CPU)


    Screen Shot 2012-12-15 at 5.52.15 AM.png



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