Q: MacBook Pro Retina display burn-in?

DrAndyWright,

The Retina Display as any other LCD display from APPLE and most other brands nowadays is LED-Backlit display, all of them. therefore they all use phosphors and phosphors are responsible for ghosting, Image Retention, Flicks and some other issues related to PWM (Pulse-Width Modulation). I can link a post from the the AVS Forum where i discuss that if you want. But good that you now acknowledge, even if still in confusion, that IR is standard for LCDs.

In spite of all these issues with LG displays, as I have been following the thread from the beginning, I finally decided to take the risk and ordered a BTO rMBP anyway. Unfortunately, my parents will only let me return and receive replacements for a week into school, and the first one has not arrived yet. I have about two weeks as of now. Hoping it has a Samsung display.

I do have a few questions. Are "advanced replacements" just higher priority, faster replacements? How can I ask for one if my first laptop turns out to have image persistence?

Although it is understandably hard for Apple to give this information, how have some of you guys been able to request Samsung-made displays? Could you please tell me?

Lastly, if I get an LG display, do you think I should return it immediately even if it has no IR? I've read that some of you guys had LGs with no problems, but later developed IR after the return period expired.

Thanks in advance for your help. Would be much appreciated!

Rocky007 wrote:

 

I just noticed this problem today. I ordered the lapton about 2 days after it came out and it was delivered within 3 weeks. I checked the terminal and its LG. I called apple and set up an appoitnment at the genius bar for tomorrow. I hope they fix this problem for me. I'll ask for a samsung replacement to see if they agree. I will post back tomorrow and let you all know how my issue is resolved.

I'll be curious to see what they say when you ask for a Samsung screen replacement because when I asked, they said they had no way to determine the manufacturer prior to installing it (and most likely after installing it unless they are familiar with the terminal command to get the info, which they probably are not).

shayster98,

I  just received an LG a couple of days ago. As of yet I see no IR problems, if anything only very faint after a 30-45 min test. But regardless I am not very happy by the yellowness of my screen (and I have not achieved much success from trying to calibrate it manually). The LG-return dilemma has kept my brain whiring over since I stumbled across this forum a few days after it arrived, but I have now decided to return it before the 14 days is up.

Even though it appears IR free at the moment, the yellowness bothers me, and so does the potential that IR may develop in a few weeks or so. So I think I am going to try reordering once it's returned, and if that one is LG too I will just return it straight away and wait for a month or however long it takes for all these issues to be resolved - and for Apple to at least make some kind of official statement about it all.

While some might think I'm being abit rash, as my LG screen isn't suffering from IR (at the moment?!), I just don't have any confidence in this product now. There seem to be alot of issues going on, and they need sorting before I will feel happy giving up £2000! I am a new convert to Apple - I still have an albeit older personal PC, but have been using Apple at work in the last year, and I waited for months for the new macbook pro before I made the switch. I guess a few more months of suffering with my old PC won't kill me, but it sure is frustrating as I already waited since Christmas for the new release!

As for your question about requesting a samsung screen - I don't believe it is possible. The only way of knowing which screen it is, is to run the terminal command once you have the mac in hand. The serial number doesn't tell you that info. So even Apple don't know what you're being sent.

Good luck with yours, whatever decision you make! Post back with any updates.

Thanks Apples_8212! I guess even if it has no ghosting there's still a potential for it to develop, and the fact that the native white-point of the LG screen is also wrong deters me. (Although the LG floor sample in the Apple Store's color seemed fine to me, but there was no Samsung to compare it with. Furthermore, it even had IR.) Do you guys know how to get an advanced replacement and what really is it?

Although it seems pretty impossible to find out the display manufacturer before turning on the computer, as the only known way is that Terminal command, I seem to remember reading in this thread that some people asked AppleCare for a Samsung display and they got one, but they didn't know whether it was a coincidence or not.

High death,

Peace man, you won't live to a big age getting so worked up.

Thanks for the technology lesson, I will read a bit more.

But again, technology is irrelevant, user experience is everything.

Users here experience bad ir on some panels (Lg) and not on others (Samsung), many of these being people who have compared both.

So apple CAN build MBPrs without noticeable ir, that's all that matters. They are accepting back ones that exhibit noticeable ir therefore they know it is not supposed to be noticeable.

All I want (as I am sure is the case for all here) is a screen that performs as expected with no noticeable ir in normal use (as we know is possible from those with the good panels)

Is anyone expecting their MBP w/Retina display to ship this week or next week (original order or replacement)?

"May the Odds Be Ever in Your Favor." (just watched movie, couldn't help it).

DrAndyWright

"All I want (as I am sure is the case for all here) is a screen that performs as expected with no noticeable ir in normal use (as we know is possible from those with the good panels)"

God bless you with this! Pray for all of us also!

Very well said, agree with you completely - all this needs is a major news channel and thousands of users will become aware. 

High-Death wrote:

 

DrAndyWright,

 

The Retina Display as any other LCD display from APPLE and most other brands nowadays is LED-Backlit display, all of them. therefore they all use phosphors and phosphors are responsible for ghosting, Image Retention, Flicks and some other issues related to PWM (Pulse-Width Modulation). I can link a post from the the AVS Forum where i discuss that if you want. But good that you now acknowledge, even if still in confusion, that IR is standard for LCDs.

Please post the link, I'd like the lesson.

Thanks

High-Death wrote:

 

 

So I will tell you what is the trolling and MEANINGLESS USELESS type of posts here, it is the kind of POSER posts who only come here to JUDGE and trying some sort of CENSORSHIP over what is being posted and discussed here without ADDING A SINGLE INTERESTING or PRATICAL info to the thread whatsoever. This sort of post is indeed Off Topic...

Calm down. Is it really that hard to take that someone else has a different opinion than yours?

Come on guys, no need for in fighting - clearly we are all here to just try to help. 

High-Death wrote:

 

 

So again, if you are not a moderator or admin restrain yourself from trying to censor any sort of useful comment to the truly interested readers who want information about the whole problem instead of a simple defect propaganda to get what they want out of the people at the Apple Store.

I think you really need to look up the definition of censorship.  Hint: other people posting opinions contrary to your own is NOT censorship.

High-Death

DrAndyWright,

The Retina Display as any other LCD display from APPLE and most other brands nowadays is LED-Backlit display, all of them. therefore they all use phosphors and phosphors are responsible for ghosting, Image Retention, Flicks and some other issues related to PWM (Pulse-Width Modulation). I can link a post from the the AVS Forum where i discuss that if you want. But good that you now acknowledge, even if still in confusion, that IR is standard for LCDs.

The actual LCD doesn't utilize phosphors, while the LED backight light source does.  I am not sure how you arrive at the conclusion that phosphors is responsible for ghosting and imaging retention with LCD panels.   

reference  LED Backlighting for LCDs: Options, Design Considerations, and Benefits

Now if one looks at the LCD image persistence (ghosting) tech note from Leveno, you can see they are discussing what actually causes IR.

"Generally (Twisted Nematic- TN type) LCDs have a parallel electrical field, so all of the display area can be symmetrically controlled. By comparison, IPS LCDs have asymmetrical electrical fields in some small areas, the image persistence phenomenon  will occur at the asymmetrical electric fields. The image will dissipate during power off or by an image change in a short amount of time. This phenomenon is a natural characteristic of an IPS LCD."

IMHO both the LG AH-IPS and the Samsung ISP varient (PLS) would be subseptable to image persistance in varying degree's.

itsamacthing wrote:

 

Come on guys, no need for in fighting - clearly we are all here to just try to help. 

Unfortunately, it's pretty much impossible to have any lengthy discussion on the internet about a problem that people feel upset about without a devolvement into this kind of in-fighting.  I am quite certain that everyone involved in this discussion is a reasonable person but in this context I think emotions are running high and people are posting just for an emotional release rather than trying to rationally discuss the issue.

At this point there isn't a whole lot to discuss anyway.  The evidence clearly shows that a certain percentage of LG displays have an unusually high level of image retention.  There is also some hint that the LG displays are substandard compared to the Samsung displays for other reasons, although I personally am reserving judgement on this.

People are upset that Apple support doesn't have a consistent answer for this issue and isn't event officially acknowledging it.  I personally feel that it is premature to blame Apple for that because this is a new product and these problems really have only come to the forefront in the past few weeks.  I think in a month or two we should expect Apple to have a good response for this issue and if not, then it's time to elevate to a higher level of angst.

I personally would like to see someone like Anandtech address this issue; their test of the rMBP claimed that the display was the best they'd seen on any device.  I wonder if they were testing a Samsung display, and if so, I wonder if what they would find if they ran the same battery of tests as they had in their initial review.

I also would like to see an official response from Apple on the issue, but I don't necessarily expect them to admit fault in public; very few companies would do so as it would open them up to having to start every claim from the position of being at fault, as opposed to providing as much resistance as is likely to be profitable for them on a case-by-case basis.  But it's not just Apple that would do this; any company would.