Retina Display MBPs have 20% lower brightness than non-retinas?

I have the exact same issue. Brightness is very important to me and I would like to know what can be done to fix this issue, as it is holding me back from buying a MacBook Pro Retina. My iPad 3 brightness, my 17" MacBook Pro brightness and my iPhone 4S brightness is acceptable - the MB Pro Retina is not (to me). There should be an option to bump the brightness level up.

Troy

Wow, i thought i noticed them being dim in store, but chalked it up to lighting.dede

Im assuming this decreased brightness occurs even with power connected. If so, a fix sounds hard to come by.

I've just ordered one that is 3 - 4 weeks away. I don't think the locals store in my city has any yet but I'll check them out as soon as they come in. I guess, in the end it depends on whether there is enough brightness. I just checked my desktop and found that of 15 set points, in a fully dark room I use it at 12/15 which is 80%. If contrast and black levels are improved then maybe the 80% is more than sufficient? Of course, I haven't cehcked to see what my office iMac is set to (I'll do that tomorrow).

I'm surpised you have a problem with the display given the stellar reviews by multiple sources it has received. I guess it depends on the person viewing it. I guess, for now you can select the non retina model and enjoy all of the same performance minus the retina display and lighter weight.

I'm betting that if this becomes a serious issue for allot of people, Apple would be able to adjust it by a firmware update.

Feoen, I thought it was just me until a Google search brought me here. Glad I'm not the only one. Even after bumping it up to full brighness, the MBP on display had a dimmer display than the iPad sitting next to it.

The dimmer screen on the new MBP and the lack of a 17" option have me skipping this one.

I'm wondering if this is a question of not wanting the retinal display because when placed side by side it is dimmer, or it is because while not beside the non retina model it is not bright enough with enough contrast to make the screen easily readable?

As I posted above, I have found a few reviews that note the lower brightness, but not that have said that the new display is anything but exceptional to view and use. I'm not trying to vote in favour of an inferior display, just wondering whther those compaining about the 80% brightness of the retina compared to the other models find the screen too dim under normal usage or just outside in the sun?

I guess I'll have to check it out at the Apple Sotre when they get them. In the mean time, mine is in the pipeline for build and delivery.

Actually I saw one and it was just next to the MBP 15-inch (I guess i have to say the standard one or non-retina!). The first thing I noticed was the huge difference in dimension between these two models. Then I checked the display. It was fantastic. Yes it was a bit dimmer than the other no-retina 15-inch but it was better than the non-retina 15-inch with hi-res antiglare display! Being a bit dimmer helps to be more antiglare.

But it's a personal thing I mean for me it was never more than 60% brightness when it comes to my 15-inch MBP. At night it is something like 50% brightness otherwise i will have pain in my eyes, headache, and

eye strain.

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Anyway, I saw retina display and it was at night and it wasn't a big a deal. But if you are really care about the display and since it's not just about being fast or whatever and it's really important make sure you work with one of them in different timing of a day to see how it goes.

best luck.

I think one of the reasons is a hardware limitation. Look at these pictures of various LCD screens and resolutions under a microscope and compare the iPad retina and iPad 2.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5689/the-new-ipad-retina-display-analysis/2

Notice how much of the surface area is actually black compared to the tiny pixels, and how the tiny pixels just can't be as bright as huge pixels. Why is this? While four green Retina pixels are roughly the same size as one non-Retina pixel, the hi-res four pixel combo has to be darker because in the same amount of space, the hi-res combo must have black grid lines occupying a significant part of its surface area.

It has been said that because the amount of black grid also goes up as the number of pixels goes up, the Retina display requires more power to push the backlight through the black grid and brighten up those tiny pixels to the same level as the older bigger pixels. It looks like part of the problem is inherent in LCD technology itself, and if there was another practical mass-production technology that could be used that could eliminate the black grid altogether, brightness could go up by quite a lot.

In one sense I won't mind a dimmer display, because when working with images, modern LCDs are often too bright if you're trying to calibrate to paper brightness levels and so I often run my MBP below maximum brightness. But when working next to sunny windows, trying to overcome gloss reflections and glare, or general use, it's nice to have a bright screen.

I'm used to using my iPod Touch in next-to-nothing brightness levels to conserve battery, so I don't think this should be a problem for me (when my MBP w/ Retina comes in 4 weeks). However, I can see that some people may have an issue when constantly working in bright-light conditions. I guess time will tell on if this issue will be fixed. I have no doubt the computers can support the higher brightness, but it would chew the battery up.

As a test, I took my MacBook Pro into the Apple Store and set it up next to a display model of the Retina one. Same brightness. I then took a picure of the screen with my iPhone camera, and did the same when I got home. It seems brighter at home, so I would not rule out the possibility of the lighting in the store. I suppose it is possible that the brightness would be lowered on the retina model, as Apple claims the same 7-hour battery life as non-retina models yet the retina display would use more battery. However it should not be a significant difference.

I have ordered the Retina also. I am not concerned about brightness yet. The reason? Almost all screens at default are too bright for digital imaging work.

I have been editing photos since Photoshop 2 and I can tell you that I have had to dial down brightness on every monitor since the early 90's. To properly calibrate a monitor for imaging the brightness should not exceed 140 foot-candles, usually. At default an iMac is putting out over 300 foot-candles. This can cause prints to be too dark because of visual adaptation.

I do understand using a MacBook in bright surroundings might cause images to appear dim. Editing photos should not be done in bright light but in subdued light. Check out the various monitor calibration software companies and you will find that all of them suggest reducing luminence considerably.

Screens turned all the way up do look great for some things, but it usually is not the best practice for photography.

I'm a photographer as well and checked ou the retina version at the local Apple store and compared side to side with older MBP. I didn't really see any brightness issues. The retina held a little more contrast and gave a truer black and white without loss of midtones. When you calibrate your monitor for color correction, you really don't want you screen brightness greater than about 110-120 lumens and I know it's brighter than that. But at the store, they didn't seem particularly dim to me at all.

stevejobsfan0123 wrote:

I suppose it is possible that the brightness would be lowered on the retina model, as Apple claims the same 7-hour battery life as non-retina models yet the retina display would use more battery. However it should not be a significant difference.

There are more variables than just that, which go into the battery life vs screen, because Apple did the same thing they did with the iPad Retina. They crammed more battery packs into the nooks and crannies of the MBP case so that it would provide a higher capacity. That means if you are trying to figure out the effect of the retina display the battery run time compared to the old MBPs, you have to take into account not only the power draw and brightness level of the new screen, but the newer battery capacity as well.

The brightness is an important issue for me, also. I currently have the 17" MBP mid 2010 with hi res and non glare screen. I run my 17" and full brighness during the day and love it. I tried to figure out why and think that maybe I use the full brightness to enhance the contrast. Everything just looks dull and washed out at three steps down (12 of 15 on the brightness scale). Before this post, I had visited the Apple Store and looked at the new retina displays and immediately went to system prefernces and turned the brighness up to max because I thought it too dim. This thread simply confirmed what I already knew instictively.

However, cruching Anand Tech's numbers for the retina display vs a 2011 MBP: brightness is down by 18%... BUT blacks and contrast are both better by about 40%... so it may be a wash.

I'll take my 17" MBP down to the Apple Store and compare it side by side to the retina displaay and that will be 'proof of the pudding'.

That sounds like a good plan. In the end, what matters is whether the viewing experience is the same (or better) than the non retina model. My vision isn't the best and higher brightness seems to help, especially when I am typing a document. A dirty grey background from a lower brightness setting wouldn't help things for me. This might be solved by better blacks and higher contrast ratios (which is what a very bright white background does with respect to black print). Please post your impressions after the comparison if you don't mind. 🙂

This is a quote from a post on the Yahoo Group, Epson Wide Format.

> And are the current Datacolor products able to calibrate such displays?

Yes, the Spyder4 is working very well with the Retina display. It measures its color accurately, produces good white balance on screen, and a very smooth, precise tone response correction (gamma, its usually called). Quality, well mannered displays tend to be good candidates for calibration, unless they use exotic technology, or aim for an extreme gamut.

The Retinal display is a standard gamut display (meaning close to sRGB), uses the most common new backlight technology (White LED Edgelights) and appears to be an IPS screen (meaning the valves that control how much light comes through use In-Plane Switching). IPS offers a wide viewing angle without a lot of color change or brightness change. All of these things lead to a very well mannered, predictable, calibratable display.

Whats unique about the Retina display is its resolution, and calibration is resolution independent. Making the filters and valves that small is certainly high tech, but beyond that, this is a good, general purpose graphics display, with deep blacks, manageable colors, and a reasonable brightness range. Mine is about 280 candelas/m2 at full brightness, which is enough for use in well lit environments, while dimming nicely for use in color managed editing environments (studios and hotel rooms for the most part, in my case).

This is the first laptop display that I have been comfortable doing advanced image editing on. Not just a first peek at the RAW images, but actual Lightroom adjustments that will be the final image edits, and transferred with the images to my studio machine when I get back there. This eliminates redundant effort, and allows me to send out corrected high resolution files to clients the evening after a shoot, instead of days later.

While the gamut, the viewing angle, the deep blacks and lack of reflectance on this dislay are superb, it is the resolution that takes your breath away. After an hour or two working on it, looking at the older Unibody MacBook Pro that spent yesterday set up next to it was like looking back at a Titanium Powerbook running OS 9. Text looks like it was rendered with a dull crayon, in comparison!

C. David Tobie

Global Product Technology Manager

Datacolor

5 Princess Road

Lawrenceville, NJ 08648, USA

www.datacolor.com