Looks like no one’s replied in a while. To start the conversation again, simply ask a new question.

iMac won't boot, GSOD with Flashing Question Mark, safe/verbose mode not possible

I have an iMac 24", just over 2 years old running OS X v10.5 (Leopard). Mighty Mouse and bluetooth keyboard, no peripherals.


It slowed enormously over the last few weeks and has now ceased to boot.


On switching on I hear the chime (blank grey screen initially), the grey screen hangs for approx 30sec before the flashing folder/?mark icon appears.

There is no further progress.


Boot key combination results:


Can reset NVRAM (Option-Command-P-R)


  • Cannot boot to safe mode
  • Cannot boot to startup manager
  • Cannot boot to verbose mode
  • Cannot boot from target media (DVD etc)
  • Cannot boot to AHT mode
  • Cannot boot to single user mode



I have followed the steps here http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2570


Disconnect, test peripheral devices and network cables - done - de-powered and rebooted. No difference.


Perform a Safe Boot- this does not work. I am familiar with the boot combinations and timings. The safe boot leads to the same flashing folder/?mark icon. I have also tried verbose, single user, AHT and startup manager with the same result.


Reset the NVRAM / PRAM- done - this worked and kicks the system into an auto-reboot after 3-5 seconds. This also demonstrates the Keyboard is fine. The subsequent boot fails at the same point via normal, safe or verbose boot instructions.


Start from your Mac OS X Install disc; use Disk Utility – I never received an OSX install disk. I have the original box with receipts etc, the only disk present is an unsealed version of iLife (yeah thanks Apple). Where would I get one?


Check your cables and power source – done - all fine.


Remove third-party RAM and internal hardware – not applicable.


Perform an Archive and Install installation of Mac OS X – how would I do this when I cannot boot the device?


Perform an Erase and Install installation of Mac OS X as a last resort – how would I do this when I cannot boot the device?


To me the problem looks like a HDD failure. I had windows (dual boot) professionally installed when I bought the iMac and since the Windows boot option is also not visible (startup manager itself does not work) I suspect the system can’t find bootable media because the HDD isn’t spinning.


An OS corruption would generally affect one or the other but presumably not both Operating Systems simultaneously.


It's hard to be certain, but I’m sure it used to make more noise.

I had a look into opening it up and troubleshooting the physical components but it’s hard to know where to start. There are no obvious ways in and I’m not a professional so decided to post a question here rather than hack it open.


I'd be grateful if you could suggest next steps here, or is it time to go dig a hole in the garden? I certainly expected more than 2yrs life from a £1200 unit.


Many Thanks,

Ryan

iMac, Mac OS X (10.5.8), 2 yrs old, 24"

Posted on Jun 24, 2012 3:25 AM

Reply
14 replies

Jun 24, 2012 4:29 AM in response to ryanwelmans

Hi Ryan,


Did you buy this Machine secondhand, because a Mac running 10.5 would be closer to three years old.


If you have Applecare a two year old Mac would still be covered if you think it is the HDD.

It would be highly unusual if the OS discs were not in the box, so have a second look.

If you still can't find the DVD, it would be possible to request from Apple a replacement set for your particular model. You will need to have all the details handy and it will cost you something I believe, but I can't say how much.


If you think it is the HDD, alternatively, you could borrow someone else's 10.5 disk and boot from it just to see if Disk Utility can possibly repair your machine.

Another possibility is connecting your Mac to another Mac in order to run the second one's Disk utility to do a Repair operation on your first one. The second one would need to be running 10.5 as well.


I would not dispose of it even if it needs a new HDD, as you have a great screen so it would be worth keeping alive.


When it was slowing down over the past few weeks did you get any message that the disk was getting full? Not that this would help you now, but I'm just musing on the cause of the problem.

Jun 24, 2012 7:21 AM in response to roam

Thanks for the response,


I bought the iMac new, 17th Jan 2010, all receipts intact but no extended warrenty. I declined the Applecare Plan for two reasons.


(1) The sales rep seemed very confident in the product build. In fact the main justification of the price tag was the quality of the device. I'd also never had an apple device malfunction at that stage.


(2) The incumbent EU regulations are quite fair in so much as legislation dictates electrical goods should be manufactured to function for a 'reasonable' lifetime. I would be morally uncomfortable paying for rights I theoretically already have.


I triple checked on the OS X disks you mentioned but no joy. Unusual as it may be, the box has not been used and it's contents reflect the day of purchase.


I'm happy to order the OS X v10.5 DVD and attempt a boot to the disk utility, I don't mind risking a few bucks on a potential fix. I'll need to figure out where to order the disk, the call centre is closed ATM so watch this space.


What I'd really be interested in is; (a) is there a known diagnostic routine to determine the HDD functionality and (b) it is possible to replace/upgrade the HDD? This for me is where the iMac loses ground against a conventional PC in terms of motherboard/component access. It's far superior from an asthaetics perspective while things are running smoothly and the OS is great but the first sign of a hardware malfunction and there seems little or no scope to self-medicate the device.


The disk has around 40-60 GB free space.


I don't have a second Mac, nor any friends or family with a Mac to 'borrow' for the disk utility test you mentioned. I'll hunt around this afternoon/week but my instinct tells me finding a locally accessable Mac running 3 yr old OS X might not be possible. Again, watch this space, I'll post any further developments.


In the meantime any further assistance or answers to the above questions on determining HDD status would be much appreciated. No progress has yet been made on the original issue of failing to boot.


Many Thanks

Ryan

Jun 24, 2012 8:06 AM in response to ryanwelmans

Ryan


It does not look good.


It is relatively rare for Apple disks to fail so soon but a hard disk can fail at any age. For those who wish to spend time and money the best disk buying advice I can give is to always buy server grade disks with a 5 year guarantee. In general they will last many times longer than cheaper disks with a 2 or 3 year guarantee.


I recently wrote long replies for another user. Some of my remarks may help you: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4052414?answerId=18734377022#18734377022


Welcome to the unusual name club. Are you far from me? I live in Bedfordshire. From Google I suspect you work in London.


Neville

Jun 24, 2012 9:19 AM in response to ryanwelmans

It is too far for me to go to assist you but there are many people in London with old versions of OS X.


After reading my link are you convinced your old drive needs replacing?


Would dumping the old disk result is serious data loss?


From the link you gave I assume your drive should be 3.5 inch like: http://www.wdc.com/wdproducts/library/SpecSheet/ENG/2879-701277.pdf


In recent years I have bought both Western Digital and Seagate but I prefer my Seagate ST3750640NS. Further details at: http://www.seagate.com/staticfiles/support/disc/manuals/enterprise/Barracuda%20E S/SATA/100424667b.pdf


I can see no reason why one of this Seagate range should not match your requirements but it might be as well for you to check the specifications.


You are unlikely to get these higher quality enterprise drives in the high street but once you have a part number it is easy to Google for it.


Good luck.

Jun 24, 2012 10:35 AM in response to Neville Hillyer

Thanks for the Seagate recommendation, it looks a reasonable spec for the cost. Before purchassing I have a couple of questions to ensure the HDD is compatibile with an iMac.


(1) Are all 3.5 inch drives generally built to the same dimensions? Sounds obvious but perhaps there are height options to consider.

(2) I believe the current drive is SATAII, am I okay upgrading to SATAIII?


Assuming a green light on the above points it sounds safe enough to order this HDD and crack on with the installation.


http://www.amazon.co.uk/Seagate-7200RPM-Cache-SATA3-Drive/dp/B006KCX0UE/ref=dp_c p_ob_computers_title_1

Jun 24, 2012 12:20 PM in response to ryanwelmans

(1) Are all 3.5 inch drives generally built to the same dimensions? Sounds obvious but perhaps there are height options to consider.


The height of some old ones varied considerably but most newer ones are similar but it is best to check the specification yourself. The Seagate site has very full specifications.


(2) I believe the current drive is SATAII, am I okay upgrading to SATAIII?


Yes but data will only transfer at the lower SATA 2 rate.


Assuming a green light on the above points it sounds safe enough to order this HDD and crack on with the installation.


I would not buy this one unless I could establish it is an enterprise drive with a Seagate 5 year guarantee - this appears unlikely.


From a quick look at the Seagate site it appears that they may have changed the names of their enterprise drives. In particular it appears that the Barracuda name is now used for desktop drives with shorter guarantees. I advise going to their site and examining their enterprise drives which used to have, and hopefully still do have, 5 year guarantees. They will certainly cost more and may not be available in such high capacities.


Everybody should note that Seagate took over Maxtor makers of some of the cheapest and most unreliable drives. Not all Seagate drives can expected to be very high quality - take care - guarantee length is the best guide.

Jun 24, 2012 2:38 PM in response to Neville Hillyer

Okay good logic, I browsed the review centre and feedback on the low end Seagate models seems consistently negative. Enterprise models are twice the price so it's going to mean a compromise on capacity. 2TB should be sufficient and still provide a decent step change from 320GB. So here's the current plan:


http://www.provantage.com/seagate-st32000645ns~7SEGS2CQ.htm


3 Yrs warranty is fine with me. Assuming no further advice against this HDD model I'll get it ordered and look forward to disassembling fort knox over the next day or so.


Once installed I'll still need an OS X disk but I'm thinking I might as well go for Lion now, rather than routing out an old v5.8 Leopard.


Thanks for the advice!

Jun 24, 2012 3:26 PM in response to ryanwelmans

Good luck - please say how you get on. I had a quick look and found:


Nearline products shipped on or after December 31 2011 have a 3-year limited warranty. Nearline products shipped before December 31 2011 have a 5-year limited warranty.


This is a pity. After the demise of MTBF (by silly exaggeration based upon bad engineering assumptions) in the disk industry a 5 year guarantee was, for many years, the best way to judge quality and probable life. In my experience lesser periods historically resulted in average life being reduced to about a third.


All OSs after Leopard require Intel which I assume you have. Snow Leopard should run well and is inexpensive. Lion appears to have more problems than most Apple OSs but many people like it.

Jun 28, 2012 5:34 AM in response to Neville Hillyer

Good question,


The HDD replacement is ordered now anyway so I'll take a look inside once I have the unit open. Obviously we haven't ruled out the possibility the incumbent HDD failed due to a broken fan...


From brief research iMacs contain three fans (CPU, HDD and ODD).


Once the new HDD is in (and OS installed), assuming I can boot, I'll run diagnostics on the fan speed and replace if necessary.

Oct 19, 2012 2:06 PM in response to ryanwelmans

UPDATE - Problem Resolved


New 2TB HDD (Seagate ST32000645NS) installed as per instructions here. This was easier than expected and just took a few minutes to complete.


I have installed Mountain Lion 10.7.4 and restored from a Time Machine back up. I always use Time Machine with an external drive for this reason. Machine is now fully functional with negligible data loss.


Thanks for the help internet!

iMac won't boot, GSOD with Flashing Question Mark, safe/verbose mode not possible

Welcome to Apple Support Community
A forum where Apple customers help each other with their products. Get started with your Apple ID.