Adding Firewire to Lombard?

Question

Level 2

331 points

Adding Firewire to Lombard?

I tried an Iogear 3 port Firewire card on 10.2.8 and it worked great. But not in OS 9.2.2 So I got this Startech one instead cuz it says OS 8.6 or later on their site.

http://www.startech.com/ststore/ItemDetail.cfm?ProductID=CB1394&tab=b&mt=

But in 9.2.2 it doesn't work either. It doesn't even say firewire. Just a blank card with no name and picture. So tried this driver intead and no luck either.

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macos/10842&vid=45709&mode=info

It now says firewire and shows the orange firewire symbol. Butg my Lacie firewire drive still doesn't show.

What am I doing wrong. Or is this too new to work on my Lombard.

http://www.compusa.com/products/productinfo.asp?productcode=310236&pfp=cat3

It was formatted in OS 10.4 on a G5. No PC partitions. All mac.

Thanks,
ivnj

15 inch black keyboard, Mac OS X (10.2.x)

Posted on Mar 23, 2006 5:29 PM

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Answer 1

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 23, 2006 8:07 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan,

A FireWire PC card will work just fine in OS 8.6 > 9.2.2 with the correct drivers; OSX has native support with no additional drivers.

These are the three FireWire extensions required for a FireWire PC card:

FireWire Support
FireWire Enabler
FireWire CardBus Enabler

Because the Lombard does not have built-in FireWire, a standard install of OS 9.x will not install these extensions. However, since you are running 9.2.2, you should be able to re-run the MacOS 9.2.2 Update on top of your installed 9.2.2 and have the extensions installed.

- First, go to your System Folder > Extensions folder and drag any FireWire extensions with the same name as the three listed above to your desktop •EXCEPT• the 'FireWire cardbus enabler - 1.1' by Shining. Now close all windows.

- Next, insert your FireWire PC Card and then restart. You should get a message that the necessary drivers to support that card are not installed...just dismiss the message and continue. When you reach the desktop, you should have a generic PC card icon or if you have left the FireWire CardBus Enabler in the Extensions folder, you will probably see a specific FireWire icon.

- Now run the MacOS 9.2.2 Update again. By having the FireWire PC card installed, the Updater installer will see the FireWire hardware and should install the other two extensions I mentioned.

If you still have problems, check your Control Panels > Extensions Manager and make sure the three FireWire extensions are present and enabled; also make sure there are no duplicates.

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Answer 2

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 23, 2006 9:35 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

This is weird. I have 3 things. FireWire Authoring Support, Firewire Enabler, and Firewire Support. And the Cardbuss support Enabler by Jeff Chandock and Associates, in my second link above. The Cardbuss Enabler by apple did nothing. With Jeff c it showed firewire name at leaset.

I removed everything except the Jeff Chandock one. It says firewire but it does not say you do not have the drivers... No message comes up. I reinstalled 9.2.2 update and nothing firewire installed.

I removed everyting and tried again and no luck. Reinstalled 9.2.2. Nothing firwe got installed.

9.2.2 update is doing no good.

Arrg.

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 3

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 24, 2006 8:30 AM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan,

In my Wallstreet/9.2.2, I have these three extensions:

FireWire CardBus Enabler v1.0.1
FireWire Enabler v2.8.5
FireWire Support v2.8.5

These are the only three extensions required for the FireWire PC card. I would go to your Extensions Manager and uncheck all other FireWire extensions except those three.

Also, if by chance you happen to be running Toast v4.1.2, uncheck the Toast CD Reader extension in the Extensions Manager and restart; it can cause a conflict with PC cards.

After the above, I would restart and rebuild the desktop file:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=10182

The MacOS 9.2.2 Update does have the two FireWire extensions, so if your FireWire PC card is installed before running the Update, I don't know why they are not being installed. However, you did state you had the FireWire Support and FireWire Enabler extensions in your Extensions folder so they were installed somewhere along the line.

If still having problems, go to your Extensions Manager and select the MacOS 9.2.2 BASE extension set > duplicate it from the File menu > name it 'test' > make sure just the three FireWire extensions are enabled > restart and test.

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Answer 4

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 24, 2006 1:37 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Here's the wierd thing. If I goto Extensions Manager and select BASE it says Firewire Authoring Support for base and I can't deselect it unless I say duplicate.

But I called Startech who makes the card and he said try Apple system Profiler. It's not listed there. Firewire or PCMCIA doesn't show.

I have a Wallstreet 250mhz/96mb/6gb/ I'm trying to sell also. Apple System Profiler doesn't say anything there either. And same 4 extensions except the Jeff C thing.

But the weird thing is the firewire card doesn't say firewire and it doesn't show my external drive.

But if I restart the machine it boots fine and I finally see the external firewire drive and all my backup data.

So it won't show on the fly but if I restart my machine leaving the card in the slot it boots up and finally works.

But if I use my Lombard I can't leave the card in.

Forget about all the extensdions, base, all, etc.

But the Lombard freezes and won't boot if I leave the card in.

I see the green light on the card. The grey screen when I restart. But no happy icon or welcome MAC OS 9 logo or splash screen before I even get to the desktop.

It just freezes. But my Wallstreet lets me boot all the way with the card in the slot and green light on.

Have I got a bad Lombard? Or Lombard won't ever boot all the way with card in and light on.

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 5

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 24, 2006 2:47 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

kavan,

My Wallstreet also requires a cold start or restart with the FireWire PC card in the slot or it will not work; I also have a generic, no-name PC card icon on the desktop; I have no report on my FireWire PC card in the System Profiler; my FireWire HD is hot-swappable as long as the PC card has properly mounted on the desktop, but the PC card itself is not hot-swappable.

If I understand your Lombard, it will not cold start with the PC card in the slot, but if the 'book is running, you can insert the card, restart, and then have a usable card.

I don't think anything is wrong with your Lombard, but FireWire PC cards may behave differently with FireWire chipsets from various manufacturers. I don't believe a FireWire PC card will mount properly unless it is present at startup, but I don't know that for a fact. You do, in fact, have a usable FireWire interface...it is just not as convenient to use as you had hoped. My only suggestion would be to try a different PC card like the Iogear to see if there is any difference.

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Answer 6

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 24, 2006 3:05 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

No, the Wallstreet works with a cold reboot and card in. Or card in and boot.

The Lombard does't work at all. It won't boot with card in. Or cold reboot with card in.

The Wallstreet is the only that works. The Lombard NEVER works. No matter what I do the external HD won't show on my desktop. And I like the Lombard better. So I haver to figure out why it won't work.

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 7

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 25, 2006 9:03 AM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan,

I am sorry...for some reason I confused your Wallstreet and Lombard...I just did not thoroughly read your last post.

You asked the question if something was wrong with your Lombard; since the Iogear PC card worked normally when running 10.x, I would have to say your Lombard is OK, at least when running 10.x.

A few questions...

- Did you ever try cold starting the Lombard/10.2.8 with the Iogear card installed or was the 'book running, you installed the card, and everything worked? The reason I ask is because my Wallstreet, when booted into 10.4.4 (I am using XPostFacto), will initialize/mount the FireWire card and work properly without a cold start or restart...in other words the card is hot-swappable under 10.x but not 9.x.

- When you tried the Iogear card under 9.x, did it exhibit the same problem as the Startech card, meaning the Lombard refused to start with the card in the slot? Possibly you did not try a restart with the card present because of your success in 10.x with a hot-swap.

- The failure to complete a startup with the card present does suggest some hardware issue. After the startup chime, the firmware runs into a problem with the FireWire PC card and stalls at that point, refusing to continue the boot.

- Does the Startech card work in the Wallstreet or are you using a different card?

If the Lombard refuses to boot with a FireWire PC card in the card slot, try resetting the PRAM, although I have little hope for any change.
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=2238

My only other suggestion would be to try another card. If, however, your Lombard refuses to cold start or restart with a FireWire PC card present (I think the same issue is probably present when running 10.x), I don't know the solution or have a workaround.

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Answer 8

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 25, 2006 12:13 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

I returned the Iogear one. But yes same symptons. But the 6gb HD wasn't cutting it. So I upgraded to a WD 400 Scorpio 8mb cache 40gb ata5 2.5/9.5mm probably 5400rpm.

So now I have OS 9 only and no X. So I really need OS 9 to work.

But there must be a reason for the freezing. Why WSallstreet can cold reboot or hard reeboot and not freeze with anything in the PCMCIA slot and the lombard does freeze.

Also if put in a USB card it does the same thing. The Lombard must not like something about PCMCIA cards on boot weaqther COLD or HARD.

Reseting PRAM no good either.

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 9

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 25, 2006 12:26 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan

Interestingly my Macally USB 1.1 PC card is hot-swappable under 9.2.2. I can insert the card after my Wallstreet is running, it mounts properly (takes about 20 seconds), and I can then connect my USB HD and it works fine. As I said earlier, my FireWire PC card requires a restart.

If you have the correct USB extensions installed, and the Lombard is running, can you successfully insert a USB PC card and have it mount properly? The five USB extensions are these:

USB Device Extension
USB Mass Storage Extension
USB Mass Storage Support
USB Software Locator
USB Support

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Answer 10

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 25, 2006 1:48 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

This is the card I have.

http://www.compusa.com/products/productinfo.asp?productcode=293596&pfp=srch1

I can't remeber which extensions were needed but more were needed. Something like USB Cardbuss something or the other. Since the HD swap my USB mouse doesn't even load on my Wallstreet.

I have USB Authoring Support, USB Device Extension, USB Printer Sharing Extension, USB Softwae Locator, and USBAppleMonitorModule.

I don't have the opthers you mentioned.

But regardless, even if I tried it on my lombard that still doesn't explain how the lombard freezes and won't let me cold or hard boot any PCMCIA mass storage cards.

I also heard XPOSTFACTO allows you to boot firewire pcmcia with use of helpers. But I downloaded 4.0 and it says restart and select OS or X not installed. But the Helper tab is empty. No helpers listed. ??

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 11

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 26, 2006 11:02 AM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan,

I believe the XPostFacto helper to boot an external FireWire drive is OSX-only.

I don't know what else to suggest at this point since you cannot boot with a PC card in the slot. It is odd that a FW PC card would work under 10.x but you still cannot boot the Lombard with a PC card loaded.

Although I expect no change, I would try an Open Firmware reset after disconnecting all peripherals:

Boot into Open Firmware by holding down the 'Command-Option-O-F' keys from a cold start while the chime is being played. You will see a command-line screen...enter these commands:

1. At the Open Firmware prompt, type: reset-nvram
2. Press Return.
3. At the Open Firmware prompt, type: reset-all
4. Press Return.
Example:
0 > reset-nvram
Press Return
0 > reset-all
Press Return

The reset-all command should cause the computer to restart. If this occurs, you have successfully reset the Open Firmware settings.

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Answer 12

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 26, 2006 7:41 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Sadly no. I reset everything but it makes no difference.

Looks like I just have to buy a used Pismo or something with built-in Firewire, but not sure how much is too much for one. I go with a ibook but after all the logic board issues maybe not.

So I'll just sell or scrap the lombard.

Thanks anyway,
ivnj

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Answer 13

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 27, 2006 12:33 AM in response to Kavan Sidhu

I fixed the Lombard problem. Well kinda. I booted to the OS 9 CD I got in 1999. I kept the card in and booted without freezing. I reinstalled the OS and did a clean install. It now boots with out freezing. Card in the slot and boot right up with no freezing or need to remove the card before booting.

I even rand the update to make it from 9.0 to 9.1 and still no freezing.

But then I ran the 9.2.1 update and not it won't boot. Have to remove the firewire card first. Can't boot all the way untill I do so.

So it's definately not hardware related, few.

But why 9.2.1? Why does 9.2.1 have to do with it? And why can my Wallstreet handel 9.2.2 and not my Lombard?

And what was different in 9.2.1 and 9.2.2? Is 9.1 good enough for most things? Or was 9.2.1 and 9.2.2 really adding anything important?

Thanks,
ivnj

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Answer 14

jpl

Level 7

28,285 points

Mar 27, 2006 10:08 AM in response to Kavan Sidhu

Kavan,

Very, very interesting...I have never heard of such a conflict. Good decision on your part to try a clean install. Why the conflict on the Lombard...I haven't a clue.

Can you describe exactly where it stalls in the startup: You first have the little Mac Plus icon, then the big happy Mac face with the '9', then the march of the extensions across the bottom, etc.

Also try this: Try a cold start with the card in the slot while pressing the shift key (extensions off). This may not apply if it stalls before the OS begins to load but since it is apparently OS-related, either the Finder or System file is probably the devil. If it is an extension on the other hand causing the problem, there may be a workaround.

The two main components of this OS are the Finder and System file (suitcase). I am running 9.2.2 and the a Get Info on the Finder reports it as MacOS 9.2.1 so no changes were made to it in 9.2.2. The System file is reported as MacOS 9.2.2, so some changes were made there. What changes were made from 9.1 > 9.2.1, I just don't know.

If there is no resolution to this conflict, MacOS 9.1 is still an excellent version. OS 9.2.x added a few bells and whistles but I doubt there is anything you will miss. In addition, 9.2.2 supposedly runs better in Classic under OSX.

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Answer 15

Kavan Sidhu Author

Level 2

331 points

Mar 27, 2006 12:10 PM in response to Kavan Sidhu

X is a little confusing, but OS 9 is pretty straight forward. I'm an old pro but I still couldn't turn off extensions. The freezing is 3 seconds after boot wheather cold or hard. I don't even see any happy face or anything. Just a grey frozen screen. Weird.

Anyway, I will miss one thing. Airport. I have a Proxim

http://www.proxim.com/products/wifi/client/goldpccard/index.html

Same card just different label. But that is the card.

Most people say different drivers were needed. True for OS X. But for OS 9 I just downloaded Airport 2.0.4 from Apple or Verisontracker.com

And I say turn on Airport from Apple menu and the internet is there.

But 2.0.4 says 9.2.1 I believe, must be installed.

Unless something for 9.1 exists.

And I'll reply again in a few when I figure out the other stuff.

Thanks,
ivnj

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