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No DVD drive in new iMac ???

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  • indigopete Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 1:36 AM (in response to grandfield)

    Look you guys, I seem to be banging my head against a brick wall here but I'll have another go at getting the message across.

     

    From Apple's point of view (and mine as it happens) a DvD drive is an outdated, oversized piece of junk with moving parts that break down half the time and simply no longer belongs in a modern machine (as an integral component that is).

     

    Furthermore, it's a 3rd party component over which Apple have little control but still get all the flak when it fails.

     

    I have a 3 year old solid body Macbook Pro which is the most reliable and robust machine I've ever used over a period of 25 years, EXCEPT for the DvD drive which is a complete P.I.T.A. I am so pleased to be shot of these things even though I do need them from time to time.

     

    To the DvD "power users" on this thread who keep complaining that they use them all the time and can't live without them - do yourselves a favour and just go with the flow and get an external. You'll have a far more reliable machine plus a much more powerful DvD drive that's easily replaceable when it breaks down.

     

    Far from 'making their biggest mistake', Apple probably know exactly what they are doing. DvD use is vastly diminished compared to 10 years ago and is only going in one direction. (See for example . . . http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1270704/DVD-sales-decline-likely- die-internet-Digiboxes-over.html).

     

    As for those that are throwing their toys out of the pram with the "I'm never buying another Mac" line - don't worry, you'll already have been factored in to their sales projections so off you go and get your Dell tin can that's big enough to fit around both the motherboard and the "internal" peripherals.

     

    This happens every time Apple make any change like this - a whole lot of users start kicking and screaming, but a couple of years down the line it becomes clear as day that it was the obvious decision to make.

  • david125 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 1:42 AM (in response to indigopete)

    It's not that I don't get the fact that I can add an external drive... It's the fact that I DON'T WANT TO.  I don't want a thinner lighter iMac which serves me no purpose whatsoever. I would much prefer an inbuilt optical drive for convenience and apple TELLING me that I can't have one because THEY think it's obsolescent I find patronising . 

     

    I also think it suits their agenda - just like it suits them to tell us that iMacs older than 2011 won't support mirroring because of inferior hardware (they will) so encouraging people to upgrade a perfectly adequate machine.

     

    I am not saying I won't buy another iMac in the future because I almost certainly will butbI will put it off for a lot longer than I normally would, to see how this situation develops.

  • david125 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 1:53 AM (in response to grandfield)

    And the sd card slot on the back just adds insult to injury.  You've got to swing the whole thing round to simply insert an sd card... Ahh now I see why they made it lighter!

  • indigopete Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 2:16 AM (in response to david125)

    david125 wrote:

    much prefer an inbuilt optical drive for convenience and apple TELLING me that I can't have one because THEY think it's obsolescent I find patronising

     

    Wow, they can't win.

     

    If they follow comsumer trends rather than lead them they get accused of not being innovative.

     

    If they make bold design priorities based on their projection of where technology is moving they get accused of being patronising.

     

    I'm sure glad the contrinbutors to this thread aren't running Apple.

  • killhippie Level 3 Level 3 (580 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 2:24 AM (in response to indigopete)

    Considering PC's are still built with Optical drives I think Apple are premature on this, having seen a 21.5" iMac its form over function, no Optical drive, and as a wheelchair user trying to stick my Cameras SD card in the back is impossible, the screen is not hugely better, Apple seem to be going sadly in ever decreasing circles with old products and not actually innovating anymore, and this comes from an Apple user with a 2011 iMac, a 4th Generation iPad and an iPhone 5. If Apple don't realy pull the rabbit out of the hat in 2013 I might look at new platforms, and that's something I don't want to do. I wont however pay more for less, while Apple makes even more cash off the designs, the 2012 iMac is more about shaving the manufacturing price down and shipping costs than function as I see it, far to much glue used, and ram can go bad, so good luck with a 2012 21.5" if that happens.

  • BDAqua Level 10 Level 10 (114,755 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 3:07 AM (in response to seventy one)

    I suspect it'll give birth to a Finger Painting interface... oh wait...

  • david125 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 9:36 AM (in response to indigopete)

    indigopete wrote:

     

    david125 wrote:

    much prefer an inbuilt optical drive for convenience and apple TELLING me that I can't have one because THEY think it's obsolescent I find patronising

     

    Wow, they can't win.

     

    If they follow comsumer trends rather than lead them they get accused of not being innovative.

     

    If they make bold design priorities based on their projection of where technology is moving they get accused of being patronising.

     

    I'm sure glad the contrinbutors to this thread aren't running Apple.

      I really hate it when people get personal.  That's how it makes ME feel - I have a right to express my opinion without someone taking umbridge with it.  By all means post your views on the topic but please don't quote me and express your opinion on MY view!

     

    How would you like it if I started with the fan boy stuff and how in some peoples eyes Apple "can do no wrong"?

    I really like Apple stuff but I do think this move is premature - I guess only time will tell.

  • Creeper523 Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 10:01 AM (in response to indigopete)

    Well Indiogpete just because you think it's okay for Apple to drive people to have to purchase content from them or force them to use the cloud for profits, we all don't have to think your way.

     

    The new imac fails for more then just the lack of DVD drive.   They sacrificed fucntion for form.  Again, who cares how thin a desktop is, I'm not carrying it on the train.

     

    Placing the SD card slot on the back makes it a pain for inserting the card. Why should I reach around the back of the machine or have to turn the case to insert the card?

     

    They removed the option for user installation of  memory.  They did this just to force people to buy overpriced apple Memory.  If you ever used Appl'e Aperture program the thing runs like a slug without gobs of memory.

     

    Then of course they raised the price while removing options and some people here are giving  apple a pass and telling us to buy a third party DVD drive. Well then apple should be promoting the imac as an all in one computer then, becuase clearly it is not.

     

    They also made the hard drive no longer user replacable.  Thus, driving more repair costs to apple. I've replaced a hard drive in EVERY mac I've owned.  When the hard drive dies I'm out of business for only a matter of hours. With these new iMacs you'll be out of business for days if not weeks as you send the computer back to apple.  Where your old hard drive goes with all your personal information on it after they replace it, who knows.   My old hard drives stay with me and gets the sledge hammer disposale.

     

    They sacraficed all that was good about the imac just to make the edges thinner.  WHO CARES if the edges are thinnier. This is now IMHO the ugliest iMac to date.

     

    Apple is attempting to drive more profits into your their pockets, yet they are offering a far inferior machine then the previous model.   I would have upgraded, but now I'll just hang onto my current machine as it's far superior.

  • indigopete Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 11:15 AM (in response to Creeper523)

    Creeper523 wrote:

    just because you think it's okay for Apple to drive people to have to purchase content from them or force them to use the cloud for profits, we all don't have to think your way

     

    What has this got to do with the discussion about internal vs external drives ? I've just documented a whole pile of reasons why they are heading for obsolescence. None of them had anything to do with content marketing.

     

    Apple is only one of a number of online content providers.

     

    Again, who cares how thin a desktop is, I'm not carrying it on the train.

     

    It's not a question of a "thin" desktop but a "thick" monitor. As I previously stated, the desktop element of the computer is gone insofar as it was a separate item. It's reasonable to make space for components which deliver performance and capacity in proportion to their size, however (again as already stated) the DvD drive has dropped right out of the race in this respect. It's legacy technology and just not a sensible design decision to carry them in the monitor anymore.

     

     

    Why should I reach around the back of the machine or have to turn the case to insert the card?

     

    Because it's something you spend about 0.001 % of time doing in comparison to actually looking at content on the monitor. I realise it's (marginally) handier to have it at the front, but if you're a designer looking to make compromises where possible it's a no brainer to put stuff your not looking at out of sight in and give preference to improved display area.

     

    They removed the option for user installation of  memory.  They did this just to force people to buy overpriced apple Memory

     

    I seriously doubt it. For a start they're not that desperate. Secondly you could make that same cynical remark about any modern motherboards which come with integrated features that were previously moduler such as soundcards, video boards etc.

     

    There are plenty of things to gripe about re. Macs and Apple and I've done my fair share of griping don't worry. It's just that I think it's a bit ridiculous to moan about things that are clearly logical and well thought out design decisions just because they force us to adapt a bit for a while.

  • Poikkeus Level 4 Level 4 (2,775 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 12:37 PM (in response to indigopete)

    The DVD technology isn't obsolete quite yet, but - in their current lineup - the MacBook Pro and MacPro are the only machines left that has a built-in optical drive. They're gone from the current MB Air, Retina and iMac.

     

    I think it's going to be a while before the Superdrive goes the way of the floppy, but Mac users still have several viable choices.

  • zBernie2 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 5:51 PM (in response to indigopete)

    Dude, you didn't drink the koolaid, you're showering in it.

     

    90% of the people in this thread believe it was premature of Apple to ax the optical drive.  It's part of a larger plan to make you dependent on apple store downloads, while inconveniencing the vast majority of people who still use an optical drive.  And you get no user upgradable RAM, and a camera card inconveiently located on the back of the thing.

     

    I won't be buying one of these -- Ever!

  • BDAqua Level 10 Level 10 (114,755 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 8:52 PM (in response to zBernie2)

    Looking at my old eMac again... lean a foot to the left I see no sides, lean a foot to the right & I still see no sides... talk about thin!

     

    Lo & behold, there's a danged CD/DVD drive right on the front!???

     

    Seen Apple's stock lately?

  • Creeper523 Level 1 Level 1 (5 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 9:10 PM (in response to indigopete)

    indigopete wrote:

     

    Creeper523 wrote:

    just because you think it's okay for Apple to drive people to have to purchase content from them or force them to use the cloud for profits, we all don't have to think your way

     

    What has this got to do with the discussion about internal vs external drives ? I've just documented a whole pile of reasons why they are heading for obsolescence. None of them had anything to do with content marketing.

     

     

    You truly can't be this clueless can you?  It has everything to do with removing the internal drive.  Their goal is to drive you to itunes and the cloud. How could you possbibly miss that obvious move?

     

     

     

     

    indigopete wrote:

     

     

    Why should I reach around the back of the machine or have to turn the case to insert the card?

     

    Because it's something you spend about 0.001 % of time doing in comparison to actually looking at content on the monitor. I realise it's (marginally) handier to have it at the front, but if you're a designer looking to make compromises where possible it's a no brainer to put stuff your not looking at out of sight in and give preference to improved display area.

     

     

     

    Maybe that's you.  I can rotate a half dozen different SD cards while working on a project.  My cameras shoot dual cards, one with jpgs and one with Raw for each camera's photos and it's a complete pain to keep turning the whole computer to insert a card.  It's really stuopd that a $300 computer can have slots slots with easy access, but a premium computer you have to turn around to get a card in.  You are wallowing in the koolaid. 

     

     

     

    They removed the option for user installation of  memory.  They did this just to force people to buy overpriced apple Memory

     

    I seriously doubt it. For a start they're not that desperate. Secondly you could make that same cynical remark about any modern motherboards which come with integrated features that were previously moduler such as soundcards, video boards etc.

     

    There are plenty of things to gripe about re. Macs and Apple and I've done my fair share of griping don't worry. It's just that I think it's a bit ridiculous to moan about things that are clearly logical and well thought out design decisions just because they force us to adapt a bit for a while.

     

    You doubt it? Then why on earth would they solder the memory to the board and seal up the computer?  There is no reason to solder and  seal it up and prevent the user to make repairs and or upgrades.  The don't offer a sound card upgrade, they don't offer a video card upgrade, but the offer a memory upgrade at a VERY HEFTY price. Why did they glue the glass on the front when they could have used magnets like they did on the previous version.   This computer can not be repaired by the user anymore, thus forcing you to sent it off to apple for a week or so for repair.  This computer makes NO sense other then drive dollars to Apple. For a premium computer this is a piece of garbage and lack features you can get in a $400 computer.

  • BDAqua Level 10 Level 10 (114,755 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 17, 2012 11:01 PM (in response to Creeper523)

    Hey, I'm with you all the way, but I too thought te 21.5 iMac might have soldered in RAM from several early inklings, turns out it isn't, but may as well be in 99.99% of the cases...

     

    http://blog.macsales.com/16104-owc-announces-memory-upgrade-diy-kit-for-2012-21- 5-apple-imac

     

    Silly Apple... have you seen their stock go up or down lately???

  • indigopete Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 18, 2012 1:27 AM (in response to zBernie2)

    zBernie2 wrote:

     

    Dude, you didn't drink the koolaid, you're showering in it.

     

    Yes - I've drunk the Apple koolaid for about 25 years - long enough to know that they don't hold onto technologies past their sell by dates at which point they drop them like hot bricks.

     

    So, unlike most of the posters on this thread, I won't go into a complete tail spin when a technology that's getting on for 20 years old and who's performance / capacity has barely changed in all that time starts to disappear from their products.

     

    zBernie2 wrote:

     

    90% of the people in this thread believe it was premature of Apple to ax the optical drive.

     

    I thought Apple were supposed to be leading technology trends, not following them.

     

    It's not a question of popularity contests - clunky plastic junk disc technology will still be supported - just not as the PRIMARY media.

     

    Big difference.

     

    I won't be buying one of these -- Ever!

     

    Well make sure you come back and tell us what you will be buying so we can see how it should be done

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