Q: 2011 MacBook Pro and Discrete Graphics Card

I have just had a similar problem with my late 2011 MacBook pro, bought in September 2012, grey screening and refusing to start up beyond entering my password. I took my laptop into Greycom Ltd, the authorised Apple repairer in Cyprus. They said that video card fault had caused the logic board to fail. Apple replaced the logic board, free of charge under their Quality Programme. *;-)))

i have problem too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzPbVsCEgl

<Image Edited by Host to Remove Personal Information>

PainNTheMac wrote:

 

Apple actually repaired my 2011 MBP. The power was out at the store, so I couldn't get detailed info on what they actually did. I put my SSD back in the MBK and inspected the Logic board. It was dirty from a hack solder job, so I decided to take a close look with some macro video. It looks horrible. This looks like a second hand logic board that has been butchered by an ammeter tech.

 

Take a look: https://youtu.be/MpWFUj2_3Ik

Have done GPU repairs on 2011MBPs.

If I would get one of these back and the pcb looks like that I doubt I would accept it in  warranty.

I mean, if I rework a pcb and put it back in, it surely doesn't look like that.

Would let me think someone else raped it...

It's not really clear on the vid, but see some suspicious solder connections and/or pads that might give probs later.

But like I said, can be the video giving wrong impression.

Not sure about Apple's policy on this but I would check it out first should you ever need another repair on it.

My MacBook Pro Late 2011 17" was "repaired" using the Apple Store Depot Repair option in late December 2014.

I ran several GPU intense tasks for 2 weeks after it was returned. It worked perfectly fine.

The repair was later refunded under  "MacBook Pro Repair Extension Program for Video Issues".

Yesterday, I decided to try out some GPU intense tasks again. They all worked fine.

However, last night, the computer randomly shutdown at 3am (while not being used.) Allegedly it was a "clean" shutdown.

The computer powered up in the morning just fine.

This afternoon, when a GPU intense program started up, the computer froze, rebooted, and now has permanent purple/blue vertical stripes on the screen.

Are people been having repeat failures after having repairs done since December 2014?

Is the Repair Extension program just giving people 3-6 months more life before they fail again?

Thanks!

Steven Bytnar wrote:

 

My MacBook Pro Late 2011 17" was "repaired" using the Apple Store Depot Repair option in late December 2014.

I ran several GPU intense tasks for 2 weeks after it was returned. It worked perfectly fine.

The repair was later refunded under  "MacBook Pro Repair Extension Program for Video Issues".

Yesterday, I decided to try out some GPU intense tasks again. They all worked fine.

However, last night, the computer randomly shutdown at 3am (while not being used.) Allegedly it was a "clean" shutdown.

The computer powered up in the morning just fine.

This afternoon, when a GPU intense program started up, the computer froze, rebooted, and now has permanent purple/blue vertical stripes on the screen.

 

Are people been having repeat failures after having repairs done since December 2014?

Is the Repair Extension program just giving people 3-6 months more life before they fail again?

 

Thanks!

Hi Steve,

Your question about repeat offenders after the extension program fix has been mentioned before in this light.  Prior to the extension repair program there were several who mentioned having their machine repaired multiple times.  A few reached a threshold that caused Apple to upgrade their machine to the latest production product.

So Apple's initial repair efforts were suspect.

Then in a sudden shift in policy Apple announced the warranty extension program.  Rumors begin about the warranty extension repairs being accomplished with a "special" or "revised" motherboard, although no one has yet fould a new part number.  Also no one has mentioned that Apple has publish a report describing the problem and their solution.

Anadotal evidence suggests that the problem centers around the GPU solder joints.  Some have reported long term success after having a third party "reflow the GPU solder joints".  My personal solution, 5 months ago, was having a third party replace the GPU at one half the cost Apple quoted. Have not experienced a problem since.

What seems difficult to understand is how Apple could have flushed its entire supply system, worldwide, of old motherboards and fill the supply system with new motherboard in 24 hours.  Further how Apple can distinguish between old and new boards when both are using the same part number.

There are lots of questions about the sincerity of Apple warranty extension program.  Soon the offending machines will approaching retirement and the requests for repair will trail off accordingly.   My concern is that Apple has not demonstrated they understand the cause of the problem or that they can put a fix into production.   Will the next MBP suffer a like problem a couple years down the line?

Thanks for the summary of the most recent discussions.

After a depot repair that replaces the motherboard, the "Serial Number (system)" stays the same, but a few other hardware inventory related numbers changed. The most obvious change was "Hardware UUID" and MAC address, which *****, because there's a bunch of software (Parallels, MacPaw, others) that store preferences based on Hardware UUID or MAC address as an attempt to prevent copying. MacPaw is the worst because it requires contacting the company to get a new Internet validated/delivered license!

I'm going to go the route of the Apple Store Depot Repair until they stop providing "free" "repairs". ;-/ When that fails, I'll try a BGA repair vendor.

This past iteration, I used my computer like I always have: on 24/7, no Energy Saver sleep. This next iteration, I'll see if I can make it fail sooner with a GPU intensive task for 30 minutes followed by a 4 hour sleep/wakeup cycle added in every night.

This past iteration, I used my computer like I always have: on 24/7, no Energy Saver sleep. This next iteration, I'll see if I can make it fail sooner with a GPU intensive task for 30 minutes followed by a 4 hour sleep/wakeup cycle added in every night.

I see only one small problem with this strategy.  The board used to repair your MBP in December 2014 was very probably not the same as the one that will be installed in it under the repair extension program.  So how do you know that it will fail?  If you are determined to make it fail, you will undoubtedly succeed, if not with the regime that you describe, then perhaps with other methods that have been suggested in this thread (e.g., wrapping the machine in a blanket while stress testing the GPU).  As long as you don't succeed, you will have the insecure feeling that failure is just around the corner, will not feel comfortable using your machine, and will probably redouble your efforts to accelerate (or provoke?) it.  This consideration and the fact that, after all, my MBP had failed while I was using it in a way that I considered normal, motivated my decision to use the machine after repair no differently than before.  I guess I just did not wish to stress myself in the process of stress testing the repaired machine.

I do not mean this as criticism of those who think otherwise.  If you feel stress testing will put your mind at ease, decide first the criteria for passing the test, then stick to them.

Just a short remark about judging

the sincerity of Apple warranty extension program

Sincerity or the lack thereof is not a virtue that I would apply to a program or even  to an international company valued at $700 billion and employing 98,000 permanent full-time employees according to Wikipedia.   However, based on reports in this discussion the program seems to come as close to guaranteeing satisfaction as I would reasonably expect.  The cost of repairs performed prior to the program are being reimbursed, and a machine accepted into the program will either be successfully repaired or replaced.

Richard Liu wrote:

 

Just a short remark about judging

the sincerity of Apple warranty extension program

Sincerity or the lack thereof is not a virtue that I would apply to a program or even  to an international company valued at $700 billion and employing 98,000 permanent full-time employees according to Wikipedia.   However, based on reports in this discussion the program seems to come as close to guaranteeing satisfaction as I would reasonably expect.  The cost of repairs performed prior to the program are being reimbursed, and a machine accepted into the program will either be successfully repaired or replaced.

Sincerity is probably measured in very personal ways.  For me its not a majoriity opinion, it's my opinion based on comparisons to my principals for sincerity.

Apple has not demonstrated that they understand the root cause of the failing GPU problem with a published report or with their actions (boards they use for repairs).  What they have done can be likened to their first round repair efforts when the firmware was changed in an effort to delay the appearance of the problem by reducing the number of heat cycles.  That effort resulted in a mass grouping of the same problem months later.   This warranty extension fix solution is fixing the problem by not charging for the same repair scheme that has been used since motherboards begin failing, replace the motherboard.  Only this time at no charge to the customer.

There is no evidence that Apple has improved their manufacturing process as a result of discovering the cause of this problem, there have still been repeat failures.  I suspect that the rate of repeat failures is about the same as prior to the warranty extension program.  No one has reported a failing component as the cause.  Many have reported failing solder joints as the cause.  That is a manufactuing process problem.  All Apple products solder components in place.  Why did the solder joints for this particular GPU fail?

Apple can be assured that in a very short time from now the 2011 MBPs with this problem will be phasing out of service and the problem will disappear with them.  The troubling part is that we have no evidence that Apple can identify and fix the manufacturing problem that caused the need for a warranty extension program in the first place.  Therefore the problem can reappear in anyone's next Apple purchase.

There is nothing to suggest that if Apple hires a thousand more employees or put a million more dollars in the bank that will fix this problem and insure it never happens again to any future products.  Those kinds of stats, number of employees and money in the bank, are meaningless when it comes to making a faithful product.  Results are the best indicator.  So far the reported results are less than distinguishing.  I have experience at getting production to reach 99.6% plug and play, its a difficult process and not done by accident.  Every problem and solution is well documented.

For that reason I doubt Apple's sincerity.

Richard Liu wrote:

 

This past iteration, I used my computer like I always have: on 24/7, no Energy Saver sleep. This next iteration, I'll see if I can make it fail sooner with a GPU intensive task for 30 minutes followed by a 4 hour sleep/wakeup cycle added in every night.

I see only one small problem with this strategy.  The board used to repair your MBP in December 2014 was very probably not the same as the one that will be installed in it under the repair extension program.  So how do you know that it will fail?    ..........

Assumption about the board used for repair may be assuming facts not yet in evidence.  Is the new board different from the original board?  If so identify the differences.  In manufacturing that is done with part number or revision number changes.  So far no one has reported such identifying changes.

We can assume, because it's Apple, they are using a better board.  As yet we have no verifiable evidence to support that assumption.  That is unfortunate.  We are left with plug and pray.

Hi all, looking for some much needed advice.

Purchased my 15 inch MacBook Pro 2011 in March 2011. Started having unexpected restarts and shutdowns in April 2012, just a month outside of my one year AppleCare. I would hear three beeps and the MacBook would just shut down by itself. It only happened once or twice the entire month of April and become more frequent throughout the following months. So frequent that I was not able to use it reliably to do any school work. There was no rhyme or reason some days it would work the entire day just fine. Some days I could not even turn it on after the shutdown. I took it into a local computer shop in August (there were no Apple Stores near me at the time) to get it fixed before the fall semester began. They said the RAM needed to be replaced, charged me $50. I believed they only replaced one RAM card, I have since lost the receipt but I remember the amount. My MacBook worked fine for about a week but then the same problem occurred. Took it to a different computer shop, they said the same thing that the RAM needed to be replaced. They replaced the other RAM card but this cost was $95 for next day service.

Moved to Chicago for school, still had the same problems even after replacing the RAM. I took it into Lapin Systems in September 2012 since it was near my school. This MacBook was my first big Apple purchase, I did not know about the Genius Bar or the services they provided. If I knew back then the logic board replacement fee was only $310 I probably would have repaired my MacBook then and there. Lapin Systems, however, did say my entire logic board needed to be replaced since there were bad RAM slots on the logic board, quoting me a flat rate of $739.40. I declined repair since I thought that was a ridiculous amount of money for a computer that was only a year and half old. I did have to pay $29 for a diagnostic charge.

I needed a laptop for school so I started using my Dad's Sony Vaio and put the MacBook away in my closet where it has been sitting since September 2012. I found out about the repair extension program in March this year and was excited at the prospect that my MacBook would be usable again. Took it into the Apple Store where the Genius ran the video test but said no repairs would be made until my battery replaced. Apparently since I did not use it for 2+ years the battery goes bad and it swelled up. I paid for a replacement battery which was $140.93. I am a little angry that I had to pay since seeing others here who have had their batteries replaced on the house while their logic boards were replaced. But my MacBook Pro is out of warranty so it's a small price to pay to have it working again.

After having my battery replaced, however, I was told multiple times by different Geniuses that while my MacBook serial was one of the models covered by the ERP, my MacBook Pro was not failing the required tests. I have not seen any video distortions or lines on the screen on my MacBook that other people have shown here but I do have unexpected restarts and shutdowns. I have multiple videos showing my MacBook will not turn on but will instead beep three times and shut down. I also have video of my MacBook running but then shutting down with three beeps while just using Safari. One Genius was not even interested in seeing these videos since I could not replicate the problem in store. I have made 5 Genius Reservations since April 30th and have had to make an extra trip back to the Apple store 4 out of the 5 Reservations to pick up my MacBook since they kept it overnight to run additional testing. The one Reservation I did not check my MacBook in overnight was because the Genius who assisted me was really dismissive and said there was nothing wrong with my computer. He said he was reset the entire hard drive and it would be "like a new computer." The reset did not change anything.

After my last visit the Genius finally saw that my computer was not turning on. He suggested keeping it overnight and running more tests. The next day instead of receiving an email saying my product is ready for pickup like I normally have (without any explanation if I had passed the test or not, just that it was ready for pickup), I received a phone call saying that my logic board needs to be replaced (which was no news to me, Lapin told me that September 2012) and the cost would be $310. I was utterly confused why I was being charged anything since on the ERP page Apple has it says the repair charge is free. The technician said since my video card did not fail their tests I was not covered underneath the ERP. He offered to rerun the tests one more time to see if anything would change, which I agreed to. He called again later to say that I did not fail the test and again the fee would be $310. I went down to the store and spoke with the technician asking him IF I did fail the tests and IF I did qualify for the ERP, what would be the course of action? His answer: LOGIC BOARD REPLACEMENT

I have been trying these last two months since beginning this whole debacle to use my MacBook but the longest I have used it was three hours before it shut down on me. One week I tried every day to turn it on but it would not. This MacBook is not reliable or usuable, it has not been since I gave up on it September 2012. I have spent a total of $314.93 for RAM cards, service charges, and a battery replacement in the last three years for the MacBook. I am not willing to spend another $310 to fix a 4+ year old computer. I have already checked the serial number, it is the right model and my MacBook does have one of the three symptoms they list. I need a logic board replacement yet Apple refuses to repair it.

Is there any more that I can do? Should I just keep bringing it in and run the video tests until it fails? Or am I operating on a loss here. I am extremely frustrated at the amount of money and time I have wasted on a computer I used for a year and a one month.

Is there any more that I can do? Should I just keep bringing it in and run the video tests until it fails? Or am I operating on a loss here. I am extremely frustrated at the amount of money and time I have wasted on a computer I used for a year and a one month.

Yes.  Take pictures and/or videos of the laptop experiencing the problems that qualify it for the repair extension program, then take them along when you take the machine to the Apple Store or Apple Service Provider.  There are many reports in this discussion about photos and videos being accepted as evidence of the problems when machines passed the tests.  Refer the technician to those reports or, better, print them and take them along, too.

Good luck!

Hey it’s me again… sorry in advance that this might be long.

Yay! It turns out that it was my graphics card so I have had a new logic board installed... Today before I left the Apple Store I had a discussion with two of the Apple employees about this issue, so while it is fresh in my mind I am going to mention what we talked about.

As I pointed out in my previous post, the video test (part of the Apple Service Toolkit… the Ethernet cord) that the Genius runs at the Bar does not stress test the graphics card. So like me, if your MacBook has/had just started to show these issues, the Apple Service Diagnostic software will need to be run instead.

Our video issues are directly related to the poor design of the cooling and the solder that Apple used on our MacBook’s. Apple has attempted to remedy this issue by using solder that can withstand these higher temperatures on newer logic boards (and that firmware update). The trouble is that Apple did not recall the old logic boards, so it’s all luck of the draw when you get yours repaired. As pointed out from other uses there is sadly no way to tell.

For all intensive purposes the logic boards that shipped with everyone’s MacBook can be referred as “mark 1” and the ‘fixed’/‘newer’ ones as “mark 2”. Again pointed out by other users, some people have ended up with refurbished logic boards (mark 1) that have been ‘reballed’ with either the old or new solder.

ALL Early 2011 and Late 2011 MacBook Pros are affected. As long as the GPU/Graphics Card kicks in (you hear the fan rev up) all mark 1 logic boards have a high chance of failing.

Over the next couple of weeks I am going to try and get in contact with Apple about their extension program. For me, the end date seems a bit unfair. Here in Australia it ends on the 27^th of February 2016. So (even though you could of brought your Mac’s at a later date) Early 2011 models (February, 2011 to February, 2016) have a 5 year warranty while Late 2011 models (October, 2011 to February, 2016) have a 4 ½ year warranty. So a tad bit unfair (not to mention that the 2012 and 2013 models have less).

For Australians: As long as you can get your logic board replaced before the deadline (27^th of February) the board that they install will come with a 2 year warranty (thanks to our consumer law). So mine is good until June, 2017 (yay).

Anyway thanks for reading,
Kind Regards,
David

IF I were apple, I will ask AMD to make new GPU that cooler and stronger than the old and replace for free.

Manthou Khorn wrote:

 

IF I were apple, I will ask AMD to make new GPU that cooler and stronger than the old and replace for free.

Prior to the Apple Extended Warranty program, when people were using third party shops to make repairs or making repairs at home the fix was re-soldering the GPU connections.  Strongly indicating the GPU had not failed, instead it was Apple's solder joints that were failing.

Apple's first "repair" reaction to the spike in operational problems with the 2011 MBP was a firmware change which had the effect to limit the number of heat cycle changes (turning the GPU on and off in rapid succession).  For several months that seemed to be a good "fix" because the number of reported failures dropped.  We know now that was effectively a method to shift the failure to a later time because eventually the GPU would be heat cycle sufficient numbers of times for the soldered connection to fracture and become intermittent before becoming completely fractured and a constant failure.

Those that did reflows of the solder joint reported success and regained useful operation.  Those who had Apple replace their motherboards had problems similar to the original problem, some failed in a short period of use while others worked for months.  The Apple replacement motherboards were likely from the same production period as those used in the original MBPs sold to the public.  Logically they would have the same faults and that appears to be true from reports made during this discussion.

When the Extended Warranty program was announced it was not proceeded by revelation that Apple had discovered the manufacturing process problem and devised a fix.  All that is known to have changed is Apple was footing the bill, paying the costs for repair.  Apple has shown no evidence that they are not building this same kind of problem into their current production of any product.  Newer production may have less micro-movement as the result of heat cycling and the faulty production process is being masked by accident or a new wave of faulty products is moving closer to failure as we speak.

Bottom line... Functionally, no one has reported a failing GPU chip.  Many have reported a failing GPU in an Apple assembly.  Other manufacures use this chip and from my research have not experienced a similar spike in failed operation.

I think this is an Apple manufacturing process problem.  If anyone has information to the contrary please share it.