Q: 2011 MacBook Pro and Discrete Graphics Card

CindyBruce wrote:

 

For example, Apple has unofficially stated what they think the problem is but not everyone at Apple will admit this.  But if that was the problem, then those replacing their logic boards should never encounter the issue again.  Yet, we know that within days or weeks the problem returns.  Yes, some say Apple is using recycled logic boards but that's probably folklore.

I think the problem here is that it doesn't affect all MBPs that fit the description. It's too early to say for sure because devices are continuing to break but just from looking at the devices I personally know my affected MBP is in a small minority.

Apple using refurbished/recycled logic boards is not folklore but a fact acknowledged by Apple and legally taken care of in various disclaimers.

Since there is so much money and reputations down the drain, it certainly does not make any sense to recklessly induce further damages.

One would think but your guess is as good as my as to why Apple is going down that road. To me is seems like a balance of PR desaster and replacement costs. For some reason the press is really keeping that widespread problem somewhat under the carpet, there was some initial reporting that there might be a problem but despite lots of people chiming in there hasn't been any followup that is worth mentioning...

If the problem was here at the soldering joints, then Apple's behavior and the results of those replacing their logic boards makes no sense.

The only reason why "baking", reflowing and GPU replacements work is because the soldering is problem. There's no other explanation for that.

Apples behaviour makes total sense because by replacing the boards they actually make a lot of money at the cost of losing loyal customers instead of having to pay up big even for the people who are rather buying a new notebook than having it repaired for a good fraction of a new one or those who think it's their own fault and are simply paying for the "repair".

There is no reason for hypothetical questions or conclusions, the real issue was explained too many times with supporting pictures and also the way to fix it has also been explained too many times also with supporting pictures, many members of this discussion decided to take the issue in their hands and send their computers for repair mostly by third party and I don't think any of them regret that , others decided to wait for a free repair by Apple regardless if that will ever even happen so its a personal decision, a Graphics problem means a bad connection between the graphics chip and the logic board, simple and straight, the replacement boards that Apple uses are known to be used logic boards not refurbished and that is why they don't last , I think that simplifies the problem and the solution is simply one of three, wait for Apple patiently and expect that you might wait for ever, pay Apple to replace the broken logic board and put another used logic board that might fail at any time unless you are very lucky, or find a trustworthy third party that can give you a long term fix , some people will find their way into a free logic board replacement from Apple but that is the exception, everyone can take his own decision and doesn't blame anybody else for it, one last thing for people who want to do their repair themselves using a heat gun or put their logic boards in an oven, people who want to do that say goodbye to your computer first because its a death sentence.

Wow. Why are people's computers breaking again after a logic board replacement? Because Apple uses refurbished logic boards. Apple using refurbished logic boards is not folklore. I again tell you, the laptop works just fine on integrated graphics but crashes when on dGPU. The only thing that seems to be fixing the issue is reballs and reflows for temporary fixes. What else could explain this? Go on. Tell me. I dont know what other evidence you want.

So your questions are hypothetical after all.

Just one idea... as I don't care so much the use of the problematic dGPU... what do you think if we simply take out the chip instead to reballing it? In this way, in your opinions, the Mac could be forced to use the only HD3000 or it would freeze?

Has someone tried this?

It will not power on. the GPU chip controls the behavior of the computer in every way , removing it means a total dysfunctional

computer.

Yes, at 99% you have right... :-)

But I would like to give it a try...

What???

This...

"Just one idea... as I don't care so much the use of the problematic dGPU... what do you think if we simply take out the chip instead to reballing it? In this way, in your opinions, the Mac could be forced to use the only HD3000 or it would freeze?

Has someone tried this?"

BTW, not everybody is going to Apple for the fix and when they do, there's nothing wrong with using recycled logic boards (assuming of course the solder isn't also recycled) so if this were the problem, then surely the suggested replacement should be the cure.

So let me ask this question.

Imagine for a moment that Apple actually did not know what the problem was for the past few years.  Would the situation be any different than what you see in these many forums?

Wait what? What fix? Yes, everyone that is getting logic board replacements is getting them by Apple or an AASP, which use the same parts apple does. I never said there's anything wrong with using recycled boards. The problem with the ones apple is using is that they are refurbished with the same manufacture defect with which the original boards were made. So let's just say that the problem in the original boards is the use of lead free solder. The boards apple is using as replacements also contain lead free solder, therefore the issue persists as apple is not changing to a lead solder.

i don't know if I'm responding correctly to the first part of your post as I did not fully understand what you were saying.

Why do you keep asking questions like these? The problem has been identified by Apple, engineers with no ties with apple, and service providers who have been fixing computers for decades such as ps3specialist.

The defective part is the GPU, not the CPU, not the MagSafe board, not the speakers. The only thing which causes graphic issues such as tearing is, you guessed it, the graphics chip.

let's make this interesting... as far as I know lead was introducted in 1940's also to limit the issue of the so called "tin whiskers" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whisker_(metallurgy). In 2006 it was removed again "for the sake of the environment" (if you wish to believe it).

how the new lead-free solder alloy prevent this from happening? I searched the net without success about this, so it would be nice to know something about it by someone expert on the subject like you.

For everyone: I'm NOT saying THIS is the issue. Just suspicious...

without getting into the reason, take it as a reality, leadfree is simply gives longer lasting result , that is why I can give a much longer warranty than any one that uses leaded solder.

ps3specialist wrote:

 

without getting into the reason, take it as a reality, leadfree is simply gives longer lasting result , that is why I can give a much longer warranty than any one that uses leaded solder.

WRONG! Stop making claims that the evidence contradicts. I've asked you previously to provide evidence to support your claims, and I'm still waiting...

However there is plenty of evidence to show that Leaded solder is better, and the introduction for lead free solder is for environmental considerations. Hence why the Military and Aerospace industries have exceptions from having to use lead free solder.

Guys, stop the dogfight and bring your attention and energy back to the actual issue. Don't divert away from the actual topic. Lead or Lead free solders could rather be discussed on a dedicated forum instead of diverting this important topic to an unrelated subject.

Next thing you'll notice is that "they" will be wanting to put fluoride in our drinking water!

Clinton