Q: 2011 MacBook Pro and Discrete Graphics Card

Atheryl wrote:

 

That's very true. Meanwhile thousands of others device also follow this law and works great. I think the solder type is a wrong debate. I mean, solder type induct other way to deal with constraints ... What is our problem.

It may or may not be causal, but it does not matter. Use of it is required by law (and so it should be).

Lead free solder is now required by law, debating that is a waste of energy.

I know, I totally agree with that, that's why I say, it's not the problem, others device works well with.

Ps3specialist what is the cause in your opinion then ? Because the first picture somehow show the consequences of something ( but we'll the cause of the user observation )

It would be great if you can bring more details, the conversation become more interesting now

Thanks in advance

Csound1 wrote:

 

Disagree about what. Lead free solder is required by law, it's not a debate.

Not a single answer pseudo expert cos you've never physically fixed Macintosh kit.  If you truly knew what you were talking about you would know that only applies to newly manufactured equipment and not repairing components such as reballing the AMD BGA GPU MBP 2011.

Please refrain from discussing technical issues that you have no physical experience of on this thread.  I only really post on this topic on the whole of the Apple site because:

I own a late 2011

Engineering guidelines are wrong. Too much paste, rough and sometimes slightly bent heatsink assembly. That along with lead free solder issues in 2011 industry wide and the largest amount of heat of all the chips in these chassis means they overheat and break.

I find it very unfair that Apple for this particular model are leaving the customers to pay for work instead of changing guidelines and at least partially admitting liability to a design flaw. I realise they are in a rock and a hard place as the refurb boards are poor and will cost them a bomb.

The cheapest way is to rebate customers for their own reball which I what I will do when mine fails by emailing the chairman of a certain fruit firm with my invoice else I'm off to the small claims court.

I'm sure there's thousands of other topics on these forums who will appreciate your expert opinion of a product you have never physically taken apart. Plenty of points to be earned on these threads.  Or if you're in London I will happily show you how to take a MBP 2011 apart for some real life experience.

What did you use to clean it?  Is there a process to follow online?

I added to the discussion, but nobody answered.  I own an early 2011 15" MBP with the IntelHD3000/AMD1GB dual graphics, Hi-Res Anti-Glare screen, 2.3 i7.

It hasn't failed, yet.  All I've done is replaced the fans because they looked dirty upon casual inspection after replacing the hard drive (1TB 7200) and adding RAM.  Replacing the dirty fans with new fans seemed easier that cleaning.  Thought about replacing the heat sink, but decided to hold off.

Is one particular model/CPU affected more than the others?  Has anyone narrowed down the serial number range?

Is this a heat issue which exposes a design flaw in the cooling process?  Or is it a manufacturing/materiel failure?  Or, is it something in the OS that was an oversight for this hardware? 

It seems like a lot of complaints from frustrated folks, but rather than gathering facts in this forum, we're gathering rants.

If you gather enough facts, we'll have pinpointed the area, and give Apple something to work with which might benefit future owners should Apple choose to try the same method on future models.

Mine hasn't failed - yet.  I'd like to know why.

And if it does fail, I'd like to know why - then?

The first picture show how dirty the area under the graphics chip is, that dirt is not just around the solder , it goes under the solder and that over time causes bad connection on some of the soldering points between the graphics chip and the logic board, the second picture show how clean those soldering pads have to be before soldering the reballed chip again and that is how we achieve a real good soldering , actually as good as it was the day you bought the computer and that is the only real repair , in some cases the same problems appear under the CPU and in this case you will see in the system logs that there is a kernel problem caused by one or more of the CPU cores and in this case the CPU will also need to be reballed , I attached couple pictures for that as well to make things very clear.

There was a problem with early intel Sata3 chipsets. Some pc/laptops suffered from it too.

And as Apples use the same standard components as all other manufacturers, they probably had (a) bad batch(es) too.

Somd firewire (via), usb2, usb3 etc had their share too.

Faults coming up sometimes only in certain combinations, reason they might be know of only later.

ps3specialist wrote:

 

You don't need to apologies to a stupid guy that doesn't understand anything and argue to be right , The main problem in this thread is the graphics problem and I am showing with pictures that no one can argue their reality why it happens and how to fix it and I am showing that probably for the tenth time, the first picture show the area of the logic board under the graphics chip that show clearly the reason for the graphics failure  the second picture show the same logic board after removing the solder, clean the dirt and refresh all the soldering pads , only the blinds don't see the reality and understand that it is not a design or manufacturing issue or a defective graphics chip, you can deny it but that doesn't put you in the right side of the problem, I am showing this for the people who wants to know what is the reason for the graphics problem and how to fix it right not to argue with any one. This logic board is now working as good as new.

 

 

Indeed - you are a far better reballer than I and we only disagree on the type of solder.  I just diagnose them and if broke being in the UK I usually assemble them back to the client and give them bga-repairs ebay link to get them done.  None so far have broken again.

Along with the bad condition underneath the package which I don't normally see I also believe the points I just described to our fellow 'expert' about the rough and sometimes twisted heatsink, over pasting etc also contribute to them failing and consequently giving you more work lol

One of the reasons I will never buy an Apple computer or whatever.

Been using computers over 30 years now.

Apple seems the only one having so much issues or refusing support with "non standard" is Apple.

Other manfucaturers often at least try to help or fix it.

Not saying they allways do or have success but almost every computer part is "standard".

There are execeptions of course, like the overrated and overprice "Golden Cages" most Apple stuff is.

@ps3specialist

Thanks for pics and precision, really appreciated. So far ... for those would like to give a shot ... we would have to carefully inspect the rear of the motherboard and clean it periodically ? Without what the problem would be back right ?

@Rob K.1

Right

MacBook Pro

15-inch, Early 2011

Processor  2.2 GHz Intel Core i7

Memory  8 GB 1333 MHz DDR3

Graphics  AMD Radeon HD 6750M 1024 MB

Serial Number  C02G4053****

Software  OS X 10.9.4 (13E28) - For now

Screen Anti-Glare screen Hi-Res

Is that ok to provide serial number publicly ? (Csound1 ?)

That is a wrong conclusion also, all peripherals including hard drive, DVD drive, sata ports, usb ports ...etc. are controlled by the Southbridge chip and when there is a malfunction in one or more of them then the Southbridge chip  has to be reballed, there is nothing called bad patch of chips.

D3us wrote:

 

One of the reasons I will never buy an Apple computer or whatever.

Been using computers over 30 years now.

Only one having issues with "non standard" is apple.

Plenty of Apple's out there working fine for a very long time.  Generally across the range it's mostly heat and fan blockages that break them.

This particular model though does have a problem which Apple won't even partially admit to which is why I keep posting. I'd be gone forever if they offered the equivalent of iTunes store credit as a rebate for a users fresh GPU competently fitted and the thermal system optimised properly!

Removing the old solder and cleaning and refreshing the soldering pads on both the graphics chip and the logic board has to be done manually and that is why I have said multiple times that experience is very important, what you see in my pictures comes after thousands of reballing of many and every kind of chips , there is nothing you can do at home or follow online guides for, this is a very advanced repair and has to be done by a real expert, that is why they call it a specialty repair.

Atheryl wrote:

 

@ps3specialist

Thanks for pics and precision, really appreciated. So far ... for those would like to give a shot ... we would have to carefully inspect the rear of the motherboard and clean it periodically ? Without what the problem would be back right ?

 

 

@Rob K.1

Right

MacBook Pro

15-inch, Early 2011

Processor  2.2 GHz Intel Core i7

Memory  8 GB 1333 MHz DDR3

Graphics  AMD Radeon HD 6750M 1024 MB

Serial Number  C02G4053****

Software  OS X 10.9.4 (13E28) - For now

Screen Anti-Glare screen Hi-Res

Is that ok to provide serial number publicly ? (Csound1 ?)

Search youtube for "how to stop your macbook pro overheating" by user "uberdoward" for what I thinks the best video out there to repaste a 2011 properly.  You will find huge idle temperature drops.  It's for a 17 but they are pretty much identical. He shows you how to polish the heatsink plate too.

If you want to clean underneath the GPU you will need to bathe it in denatured isopropyl so it cleans the gunk out.  Not for the novice it's highly flammable!

We don't disagree on the material because at the end the material is just one factor in the success of the process but the more important thing for me is that I do this process at least ten times a day everyday so using leaded solder means that I will die with cancer and I am not willing to end my life that way.

Atheryl wrote:

Is that ok to provide serial number publicly ? (Csound1 ?)

Not advisable, edit it out (or I will ask for it to be removed if it's too late to edit it)