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  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    geedubya wrote:

    . . .

    It's just that the latest one is renamed Library HD 1' whereas all the original backups are named 'Library HD'.  And my new drive is named Library HD of course.

    Sorry, you lost me.  If both new and old drives are named "Library HD," WHAT is named "Library HD 1"? 

     

    And how did it get that name?

     

     

    But I am confused by the fact you say I could associate the old backups with the new drive under Lion.  How can I if I delete them all?  Are we talking at cross purposes?

    No, that's either-or.  If you don't delete them, you can "associate" them later.

     

     

    Also, why do you think the permissions would be messed up?

    The problem you had trying to restore seems to be related to the permissions.  That's what Linc has been helping you with.  

     

    In an earlier post, I mentioned that there was a problem in Leopard when you restored the backups of a data-only drive to another drive with the same name. That's why I suggested trying a slightly different name.  That doesn't seem to be an issue on recent versions of OSX, but I'm not sure when it was changed. 

     

    And what is the solution to this whole issue then?

    Perhaps the issue is, there are really two problems:

     

     

    First is not being able to restore properly.  That seems to be caused by the permissions issue, and Linc's suggestion to restore to a volume that ignores ownership would probably work.  However, then the files on that drive would be available to everyone.  If that's a problem, it can be fixed going forward, but the permissions on the older backups probably can't be fixed -- if you need anything from them, you'll likley have trouble restoring from them.  There are workarounds, but it will still be a problem.

     

     

    Second is the problem of how the backups of the two disks appear in Time Machine's TimeLine, and needing the workaround in #E3 of the Troubleshooting article to see the old ones.  That can be fixed once you're on Lion, per #B6 in the Troubleshooting article.

     

    I'd also suggested that, if you need to save space on the backup drive, you could delete the backups of the old drive, if you want to (keeping the backups of the new one).  Since the old ones would be gone, you'd no longer have the second problem.

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Pondini wrote:

     

    geedubya wrote:

    . . .

    It's just that the latest one is renamed Library HD 1' whereas all the original backups are named 'Library HD'.  And my new drive is named Library HD of course.

    Sorry, you lost me.  If both new and old drives are named "Library HD," WHAT is named "Library HD 1"? 

     

    And how did it get that name?

     

    As I said, I did a TM backup to my second TM drive after I copied all the data over and the new drive appears as Library HD, which is because I named it the same as the original. Library 1 HD appears to be what the Mac has renamed the original Library HD drive, going by 'Get Info' dates.

    But I am confused by the fact you say I could associate the old backups with the new drive under Lion.  How can I if I delete them all?  Are we talking at cross purposes?

    No, that's either-or.  If you don't delete them, you can "associate" them later.

     

    OK.

    Also, why do you think the permissions would be messed up?

    The problem you had trying to restore seems to be related to the permissions.  That's what Linc has been helping you with.  

     

    In an earlier post, I mentioned that there was a problem in Leopard when you restored the backups of a data-only drive to another drive with the same name. That's why I suggested trying a slightly different name.  That doesn't seem to be an issue on recent versions of OSX, but I'm not sure when it was changed. 

     

    Well, that is something I could try this time (to another replacement drive), but I'm getting the impression you don't think that would work because of permissions probs.

    And what is the solution to this whole issue then?

    Perhaps the issue is, there are really two problems:

     

     

    First is not being able to restore properly.  That seems to be caused by the permissions issue, and Linc's suggestion to restore to a volume that ignores ownership would probably work.  However, then the files on that drive would be available to everyone.  If that's a problem, it can be fixed going forward, but the permissions on the older backups probably can't be fixed -- if you need anything from them, you'll likley have trouble restoring from them.  There are workarounds, but it will still be a problem.

     

    Firstly, I am the only person using the machine, so I think the 'ignore ownership' option might not be a prob - unless you mean available over the internet maybe.  Secondly, I'm not sure I need the older backups.  This drive just stores sample libraries and as long as the latest version is there and working (and restorable), I am unlikely to need to go back to previous versions.

     

    Second is the problem of how the backups of the two disks appear in Time Machine's TimeLine, and needing the workaround in #E3 of the Troubleshooting article to see the old ones.  That can be fixed once you're on Lion, per #B6 in the Troubleshooting article.

     

    I'd also suggested that, if you need to save space on the backup drive, you could delete the backups of the old drive, if you want to (keeping the backups of the new one).  Since the old ones would be gone, you'd no longer have the second problem.

     

    Again, as long as there is a current backup containing restorable data of all samples libaries, I don't think I really need the old backups.

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    geedubya wrote:

     

    Pondini wrote:

     

    geedubya wrote:

    . . .

    It's just that the latest one is renamed Library HD 1' whereas all the original backups are named 'Library HD'.  And my new drive is named Library HD of course.

    Sorry, you lost me.  If both new and old drives are named "Library HD," WHAT is named "Library HD 1"? 

     

    And how did it get that name?

     

    As I said, I did a TM backup to my second TM drive after I copied all the data over and the new drive appears as Library HD, which is because I named it the same as the original. Library 1 HD appears to be what the MAc has renamed the original Library HD drive, going by 'Get Info' dates.

    Sorry, I still don't understand WHERE you're seeing "Library HD 1"

     

    That drive failed and no longer appears anywhere on your Mac, right? 

     

    Are you seeing that somewhere on your backups?

     

    Perhaps posting a screenshot would clarify it.

     

     

    Also, why do you think the permissions would be messed up?

    The problem you had trying to restore seems to be related to the permissions.  That's what Linc has been helping you with. 

     

    In an earlier post, I mentioned that there was a problem in Leopard when you restored the backups of a data-only drive to another drive with the same name. That's why I suggested trying a slightly different name.  That doesn't seem to be an issue on recent versions of OSX, but I'm not sure when it was changed.

     

    Well, that is something I could try this time (to another replacement drive), but I'm getting the impression you don't think that would work because of permissions probs.

    Correct.  I doubt the name is the issue.  

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Pondini wrote:

     

    geedubya wrote:

     

    Pondini wrote:

     

    geedubya wrote:

    . . .

    It's just that the latest one is renamed Library HD 1' whereas all the original backups are named 'Library HD'.  And my new drive is named Library HD of course.

    Sorry, you lost me.  If both new and old drives are named "Library HD," WHAT is named "Library HD 1"? 

     

    And how did it get that name?

     

    As I said, I did a TM backup to my second TM drive after I copied all the data over and the new drive appears as Library HD, which is because I named it the same as the original. Library 1 HD appears to be what the MAc has renamed the original Library HD drive, going by 'Get Info' dates.

    Sorry, I still don't understand WHERE you're seeing "Library HD 1"

     

    That drive failed and no longer appears anywhere on your Mac, right?

     

    The drive that failed was called Library HD.  I then named the replacement drive the same.

     

    Are you seeing that somewhere on your backups?

     

    Yes, one of the backups is called 'Library 1 HD' and the other is called 'Library HD'

     

    Perhaps posting a screenshot would clarify it.

     

    Screen shot 2013-03-11 at 18.24.35.jpg

    Also, why do you think the permissions would be messed up?

    The problem you had trying to restore seems to be related to the permissions.  That's what Linc has been helping you with. 

     

    In an earlier post, I mentioned that there was a problem in Leopard when you restored the backups of a data-only drive to another drive with the same name. That's why I suggested trying a slightly different name.  That doesn't seem to be an issue on recent versions of OSX, but I'm not sure when it was changed.

     

    Well, that is something I could try this time (to another replacement drive), but I'm getting the impression you don't think that would work because of permissions probs.

    Correct.  I doubt the name is the issue. 

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    <deleted>

     

    Message was edited by: Pondini

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Yup, i figured that.

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    There are 5 volumes on that backup.  See what's inside the two in question.

     

    Somewhere, you had a separate volume named "Library HD 1" that was backed-up, along with "Library HD," on the latest backup.

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    They both have the same content and are the same size, but Library 1 HD has a modification date of 3 January 2013 as opposed to Library HD having 6 March 2013.  Not sure if that's significant.

     

    When I made my first attempt to restore, I hit the Restore button instead of right clicking.  I checked to see if there was a hidden volume and didn't find one, but I guess it could be more hidden than I realise.

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    You must have had another copy of it on another drive or partition at the time of the backup.

     

    If you don't see two now, either on your desktop or Finder sidebar, then whatever it was is now gone, so not a problem.

     

    You might want to run another backup and see what it shows.

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Very odd. There wasn't another copy - there wouldn't have been enough space and none of the drives are partitioned.  Library 1 HD is not on my desktop or sidebar.  I'll try another backup and see what happens.

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    OK new backup is the same, so Library 1 HD is still in the backup although doesn't appear anywhere on desktop or sidebar.

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    I'll bet it's a "false volume."   When you first tried to restore, did you get this prompt?

     

    shapeimage_5.png

     

    If so, and if you selected Recreate Enclosing Folders, a folder was created in the hidden /Volumes folder and the data was put there.   Since there was already a "real" volume with the same name, OSX appended the -1.

     

     

    From a Finder menubar, click Go > Go to Folder, then type  /Volumes in the prompt.

     

    On Snow Leopard (Lion and later are different), they should all be aliases.

     

    If there's a "Library HD 1" item there, it's probably an actual folder, not an alias.  Display it to be sure.

     

    Eject the real volume just in case, then delete the false one and empty the trash.  

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I don't remember getting that prompt, but in any case I wouldn't have chosen Recreate Enclosing Folders as I'd already read your guide re this.  As I said, I checked for false volumes already this way.  I just checked again and it doesn't appear in the Volumes list at all.

  • Pondini Level 8 Level 8 (38,720 points)

    geedubya wrote:

     

    I don't remember getting that prompt, but in any case I wouldn't have chosen Recreate Enclosing Folders as I'd already read your guide re this. 

     

     

    As I said, I checked for false volumes already this way.  I just checked again and it doesn't appear in the Volumes list at all.

    Weird.  It's there, somewhere. 

     

    Does it appear on a Spotlight or Finder search? 

     

    Look at all your drives with Disk Utility -- if the "hidden" flag has gotten set on a volume, it won't show up most places, but will appear in DU's sidebar.

     

    Could it be an alias, hard link, or symbolic link to the normal volume?   I've not fooled with any of those much, and never for a volume, so don't know what Time Machine would do with one.

  • geedubya Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Library 1 HD doesn't appear in Spotlight search or in Disk Utility.  I did notice my Library 2 HD doesn't show up in Spotlight either, although all 3 other drives do.  It appears as expected anywhere else it should though.