Using an old MBox (by DigiDesign/Avid with USB) as an audio interface.

Question

Level 1

4 points

Using an old MBox (by DigiDesign/Avid with USB) as an audio interface.

Hello,

I've been using my old iMac (2004 vintage, running OS X10.4) for years to make my (guitar) music recordings, using an older version of ProTools as software and an MBox (DigiDesign/Avid) as the audio interface.

Now that I have a new MB Pro running the latest OS X, I'm contemplating upgrading my recording platform to this latest version of Logic Pro X. It seems like the right way to go and the software appears to be loaded with all the right features.

But, I would like to keep my old MBox as the audio interface. It's a very solid, 2 input unit and plenty versatile enough for my guitar recording needs. It also provides phantom power for my condenser mics. (Something that the Symphony I/O unit from Apogee lacks in spite of its high price).

This early version of MBox has a USB 2.0 interface which would be compatible with my Thunderbolt ports, and plenty fast enough for audio transmission.

QUestion:

Do you envision any compatibility issues with this MBox as an Audio Interface unit when working with this latest Logic Pro X software? Anything to watch out for?

Ultimately I want to avoid having to get a new interface just because of the software change from Pro Tools to Logic X, especially since it's been so good and reliable to me, and still works great.

Many thanks in advance for any hints, comments and insights!

Andre

Posted on Aug 2, 2013 10:05 AM

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Answer 1

rocker88

Level 1

8 points

Oct 28, 2017 7:51 PM in response to Andre Guitar

This reply is a bit late, *duh*, and it won't completely resolve your question, but audio drivers aren't necessary if you simply use the Mbox as a 2-channel mic pre/DI with another device. That said, it's likely that the Focusrite Scarlett has mic pres that equal or surpass the Focusrite pre's that were built into the Mbox 1.0.

Still, with its Focusrite mic pre's, the Mbox 1.0 can add 2 more pre's/DIs to your setup, but not as a USB interface. Treating it as a "USB powered" mic/DI preamp (equate that to a "phantom powered" pre), you can plug mics or instruments into it, but still need an A/D-D/A interface to get the sound from the Mbox into Logic or your DAW of choice.

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Answer 2

kcstudio

Level 4

1,808 points

Aug 2, 2013 11:26 AM in response to Andre Guitar

I've tried't last week with no luck at all. The Digi audio driver, previously working in Lion without any problem, just didn't fit the ML OS. And also: any installed Digi midi drivers you have to through out the window straight away! Lack of free time didn't permit me to investigate this further. We'll have to get hold of a Digi audio driver decently programmed for ML and MBox. Maybe I can try the audio driver provided with ProTools 11. Anyways, I will keep you informed if I succeed.

Have a nice day!

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Answer 3

Andre Guitar Author

Level 1

4 points

Aug 2, 2013 12:50 PM in response to kcstudio

Thanks for your info kc. I had a feeling it was wise to proceed with caution. I hope there is a solution. ML OS does seem to make compatability issues harder to resolve.

Anyways, I will keep you informed if I succeed.

Please do. It's much appreciated. 🙂

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Answer 4

Aug 2, 2013 1:30 PM in response to Andre Guitar

The problem really lies with Avid and not ML OS.. They originally wrote poor drivers and they have never really improved them much in regards to compatibiity with CoreAudio..

If this was not the case then companies like Motu would be in the same boat, which they are not...

However, I gather the recent 11.0.x series of Digi drivers does improve matters to a degree... in regards to proper operation with ML OS X.. Still not perfect of course.. because it's Avid/M-Audio/Digi we are talking about.. but somewhat better? yes...

(Just being honest here..) 🙂

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Answer 5

Andre Guitar Author

Level 1

4 points

Aug 2, 2013 3:28 PM in response to The Art Of Sound

Thanks much for your reply and info. You make a good point about the problem most likely residing with Avid. Makes sense.

On the Avid site they are are offering a new set of drivers (updated July 9th):

Drivers for Audio Hardware

Have you or anyone tried these out with ML OS/Logic Pro X and Avid hardware? I don't mind an imperfect setup, as long as there is a workaround.

Many thanks! (and honesty is refreshing! 🙂)

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Answer 6

Aug 2, 2013 3:41 PM in response to Andre Guitar

Personally what I would do in the same situation and if I had a spare Ext HD laying around...

I'd make a clone of my system drive using Carbon Copy Cloner or my personal favorite, SuperDuper! to the ext HD

Then I would install the newest drivers for my Digi Equipment I could find onto my system drive and test

If all is well, then great..... and if not I would simply restore my system drive back from the cloned image I saved to the Ext Drive and i would be back to where i started with no ill effects...

This is a method I often use when testing different updates and upgrades out... as i find it to be the quickest and safest overall...

Hope this helps...

Cheers!

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Answer 7

Andre Guitar Author

Level 1

4 points

Aug 3, 2013 5:03 AM in response to The Art Of Sound

Hi Art Of Sound,

Thanks for your additional info and support.

I did a bit of checking on the Avid site and have come to the conclusion that it's probably a lost cause.

Avid considers my version of the MBox, which was the first one that ever came out, back when they bundled it with ProTools 6, a retired product. My working, and latest, version of ProTools on my iMac is LE 7, and that appears to be one of the last versions with which my original MBox will still function.

Accordong to Avid, once ProTools 8.0.3 came out, it no longer was compatible with the original MBox, and as best as I can determine, recent audio driver packages were not meant or designed to restore functionality of the original MBox with later versions of Pro Tools.

To now expect these drivers to establish functionality of this old MBox with Apple's new Logic Pro X software is a leap of faith bordering on the insane, I'm guessing....😁

I originally had tried to load ProTools LE7 on my new MB Pro, but it was totally incompatible with ML OS. (Not surprising, since I subsequently found out that LE7 won't work on anything later than OS X10.4, which is, thankfully, the OS on my old iMac. So at least that still works.)

So it looks like I'm at best stuck in the past, or, if I go with the new Logic Pro X, will need to also upgrade the audio interface. ( I learned from a friend from my guitar forum that MOTU's hardware is Apple friendlier than Avid, even if it still is not as perfect as it can be, or not as customized for Apple as the Apogee line is. THey may have something cheaper than this Symphony unit).

Oh well, one way or the other, they always get you in the wallet! 😉

Any additional ideas or comments still welcome and appreciated.

Thanks again all!

Reply

Answer 8

kcstudio

Level 4

1,808 points

Aug 4, 2013 7:53 AM in response to Andre Guitar

Here is a little update to to my ongoing Mbox driver quest.

I downloaded the drivers (as stated on the Avid site: Last Updated : July 9, 2013) for my legacy FW interface (Mbox 2 Pro) from here:

http://avid.force.com/pkb/articles/en_US/download/en379411

Installed the drivers, no interface attached to my computer. After the re-start I connected the Mbox and it was recognized in Audio MIDI Setup without any fuzz. Then I started Logic 9 and sure enough after taking a brief moment to evaluate MIDI drivers the whole OS crashed on me in a very severe way:

Interval Since Last Panic Report: 372756 sec

Panics Since Last Report: 1

Anonymous UUID: E6B9E578-0CB1-AAE5-DDF9-9C7DAB71171F

Sat Aug 3 12:47:50 2013

panic(cpu 12 caller 0xffffff8013eb8655): Kernel trap at 0xffffff7f95f6aaf7, type 13=general protection, registers:

CR0: 0x000000008001003b, CR2: 0x00007fd524c07000, CR3: 0x0000000016624000, CR4: 0x0000000000000660

RAX: 0x9718d2aeda090018, RBX: 0xffffff803831b608, RCX: 0x7fffffffffffffff, RDX: 0x0000000000000040

RSP: 0xffffff81753fbfa0, RBP: 0xffffff81753fbfb0, RSI: 0x0000000000000002, RDI: 0xdeadbeefdeadbeef

R8: 0x0000000000000402, R9: 0x0000000000000000, R10: 0xffffff81753fbd20, R11: 0xffffff80141ede50

R12: 0xffffff816c53d000, R13: 0x0000000000000000, R14: 0x0000000000000000, R15: 0xffffff8031fa3c90

RFL: 0x0000000000010282, RIP: 0xffffff7f95f6aaf7, CS: 0x0000000000000008, SS: 0x0000000000000010

Fault CR2: 0x00007fd524c07000, Error code: 0x0000000000000000, Fault CPU: 0xc

Backtrace (CPU 12), Frame : Return Address

0xffffff81753fbc40 : 0xffffff8013e1d626

0xffffff81753fbcb0 : 0xffffff8013eb8655

0xffffff81753fbe80 : 0xffffff8013ece17d

0xffffff81753fbea0 : 0xffffff7f95f6aaf7

0xffffff81753fbfb0 : 0xffffff8013eb3137

Kernel Extensions in backtrace:

com.digidesign.fwfamily.driver(9.0f4)[EA9004EA-D8CD-1CA7-6281-17C82B2AF0EF]@0xf fffff7f95f5c000->0xffffff7f95f7dfff

dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireAVC(4.2.2)[F7D819BB-CD26-352B-BE6A-AB3040A06AEF]@0xff ffff7f952b9000

dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOAudioFamily(1.8.9fc11)[AB8DD2DD-43BD-3B7B-95F7-26E6E0BBF339]@ 0xffffff7f94379000

dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireFamily(4.5.5)[A045A111-194F-3E54-A63E-E015DC69B862]@0 xffffff7f94bd9000

BSD process name corresponding to current thread: kernel_task

Mac OS version:

12E55

Kernel version:

Darwin Kernel Version 12.4.0: Wed May 1 17:57:12 PDT 2013; root:xnu-2050.24.15~1/RELEASE_X86_64

Kernel UUID: 896CB1E3-AB79-3DF1-B595-549DFFDF3D36

Kernel slide: 0x0000000013c00000

Kernel text base: 0xffffff8013e00000

System model name: MacPro4,1 (Mac-F221BEC8)

System uptime in nanoseconds: 225516806351

last loaded kext at 59093531311: com.apple.driver.AppleHWSensor 1.9.5d0 (addr 0xffffff7f95c47000, size 36864)

loaded kexts:

com.hzsystems.terminus.driver 4

net.telestream.driver.TelestreamAudio 1.0.5

com.digidesign.fwfamily.driver 9.0f4

com.paceap.kext.pacesupport.snowleopard 5.9.1

com.digidesign.iokit.DigiDal 9.0.6f4

com.AmbrosiaSW.AudioSupport 4.1.2

com.Logitech.Control Center.HID Driver 3.7.0

at.obdev.nke.LittleSnitch 3876

com.apple.driver.AppleHWSensor 1.9.5d0

com.apple.driver.AppleTyMCEDriver 1.0.2d2

com.apple.driver.AGPM 100.12.87

com.apple.driver.AudioAUUC 1.60

com.apple.iokit.IOUserEthernet 1.0.0d1

com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothSerialManager 4.1.4f2

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBDisplays 357

com.apple.driver.AppleMikeyHIDDriver 122

com.apple.driver.AppleHDAHardwareConfigDriver 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.filesystems.autofs 3.0

com.apple.driver.AppleUpstreamUserClient 3.5.10

com.apple.driver.AppleMCCSControl 1.1.11

com.apple.driver.AppleHDA 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.GeForce 8.1.2

com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothUSBDFU 4.1.4f2

com.apple.driver.AppleLPC 1.6.0

com.apple.iokit.BroadcomBluetoothHCIControllerUSBTransport 4.1.4f2

com.apple.driver.AppleMikeyDriver 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.driver.ACPI_SMC_PlatformPlugin 1.0.0

com.apple.nvidia.NVDAStartup 8.1.2

com.apple.Dont_Steal_Mac_OS_X 7.0.0

com.apple.driver.ApplePolicyControl 3.4.5

com.apple.driver.AppleFireWireStorage 3.1.7

com.apple.driver.initioFWBridge 3.1.7

com.apple.driver.IOFireWireSerialBusProtocolSansPhysicalUnit 3.1.7

com.apple.driver.LSI_FW_500 3.1.7

com.apple.driver.Oxford_Semi 3.1.7

com.apple.driver.StorageLynx 3.1.7

com.apple.iokit.SCSITaskUserClient 3.5.5

com.apple.driver.CoreStorageFsck 296.16.1

com.apple.driver.XsanFilter 404

com.apple.iokit.IOAHCIBlockStorage 2.3.1

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBHub 5.5.5

com.apple.driver.AppleFileSystemDriver 3.0.1

com.apple.AppleFSCompression.AppleFSCompressionTypeDataless 1.0.0d1

com.apple.driver.AppleIntel8254XEthernet 3.1.1b1

com.apple.AppleFSCompression.AppleFSCompressionTypeZlib 1.0.0d1

com.apple.driver.Intel82574L 2.3.0b5

com.apple.BootCache 34

com.apple.driver.AppleAHCIPort 2.5.2

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBEHCI 5.5.0

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBUHCI 5.2.5

com.apple.driver.AppleFWOHCI 4.9.6

com.apple.driver.AppleEFINVRAM 1.7

com.apple.driver.AppleRTC 1.5

com.apple.driver.AppleHPET 1.8

com.apple.driver.AppleACPIButtons 1.7

com.apple.driver.AppleSMBIOS 1.9

com.apple.driver.AppleACPIEC 1.7

com.apple.driver.AppleAPIC 1.6

com.apple.driver.AppleIntelCPUPowerManagementClient 196.0.0

com.apple.nke.applicationfirewall 4.0.39

com.apple.security.quarantine 2.1

com.apple.driver.AppleIntelCPUPowerManagement 196.0.0

com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireAVC 4.2.2

com.apple.iokit.IOSurface 86.0.4

com.apple.iokit.IOSerialFamily 10.0.6

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBAudio 2.9.0f8

com.apple.kext.triggers 1.0

com.apple.driver.DspFuncLib 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.nvidia.nv50hal 8.1.2

com.apple.NVDAResman 8.1.2

com.apple.iokit.AppleBluetoothHCIControllerUSBTransport 4.1.4f2

com.apple.driver.IOPlatformPluginLegacy 1.0.0

com.apple.driver.IOPlatformPluginFamily 5.3.0d51

com.apple.driver.AppleSMBusController 1.0.11d0

com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireIP 2.2.5

com.apple.driver.AppleHDAController 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.iokit.IOHDAFamily 2.3.7fc4

com.apple.driver.AppleSMBusPCI 1.0.11d0

com.apple.driver.AppleSMC 3.1.4d2

com.apple.iokit.IOAudioFamily 1.8.9fc11

com.apple.kext.OSvKernDSPLib 1.6

com.apple.driver.AppleGraphicsControl 3.4.5

com.apple.iokit.IONDRVSupport 2.3.7

com.apple.iokit.IOGraphicsFamily 2.3.7

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBHIDKeyboard 170.2

com.apple.driver.AppleHIDKeyboard 170.2

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBMergeNub 5.5.5

com.apple.driver.IOBluetoothHIDDriver 4.1.4f2

com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothFamily 4.1.4f2

com.apple.iokit.IOUSBHIDDriver 5.2.5

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBComposite 5.2.5

com.apple.iokit.IOSCSIReducedBlockCommandsDevice 3.5.5

com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireSerialBusProtocolTransport 2.1.1

com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireSBP2 4.2.2

com.apple.iokit.IOSCSIMultimediaCommandsDevice 3.5.5

com.apple.iokit.IOBDStorageFamily 1.7

com.apple.iokit.IODVDStorageFamily 1.7.1

com.apple.iokit.IOCDStorageFamily 1.7.1

com.apple.driver.CoreStorage 296.16.1

com.apple.iokit.IOAHCISerialATAPI 2.5.1

com.apple.iokit.IOSCSIArchitectureModelFamily 3.5.5

com.apple.iokit.IOUSBUserClient 5.5.5

com.apple.iokit.IONetworkingFamily 3.0

com.apple.iokit.IOAHCIFamily 2.3.1

com.apple.iokit.IOUSBFamily 5.6.0

com.apple.iokit.IOFireWireFamily 4.5.5

com.apple.driver.AppleEFIRuntime 1.7

com.apple.iokit.IOHIDFamily 1.8.1

com.apple.iokit.IOSMBusFamily 1.1

com.apple.security.sandbox 220.3

com.apple.kext.AppleMatch 1.0.0d1

com.apple.security.TMSafetyNet 7

com.apple.driver.DiskImages 345

com.apple.iokit.IOStorageFamily 1.8

com.apple.driver.AppleKeyStore 28.21

com.apple.driver.AppleACPIPlatform 1.7

com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily 2.7.3

com.apple.iokit.IOACPIFamily 1.4

com.apple.kec.corecrypto 1.0

Model: MacPro4,1, BootROM MP41.0081.B08, 8 processors, Quad-Core Intel Xeon, 2.26 GHz, 12 GB, SMC 1.39f5

Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce GT 120, NVIDIA GeForce GT 120, PCIe, 512 MB

Memory Module: DIMM 1, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Memory Module: DIMM 2, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Memory Module: DIMM 3, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Memory Module: DIMM 5, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Memory Module: DIMM 6, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Memory Module: DIMM 7, 2 GB, DDR3 ECC, 1066 MHz, 0x802C, 0x31384A53463235363732415A2D3147314631

Bluetooth: Version 4.1.4f2 12041, 2 service, 18 devices, 1 incoming serial ports

Network Service: Ethernet 2, Ethernet, en1

PCI Card: NVIDIA GeForce GT 120, sppci_displaycontroller, Slot-1

PCI Card: pci104c,8235, sppci_ieee1394openhci, Slot-2@7,0,0

Serial ATA Device: HL-DT-ST DVD-RW GH41N

Serial ATA Device: M4-CT256M4SSD2, 256,06 GB

Serial ATA Device: Hitachi HDE721064SLA360, 640,14 GB

Serial ATA Device: WDC WD1001FALS-41K1B0, 1 TB

USB Device: hub_device, 0x0409 (NEC Corporation), 0x0050, 0xfa200000 / 2

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa250000 / 8

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa260000 / 7

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa210000 / 6

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa230000 / 5

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa240000 / 4

USB Device: iLok, 0x088e, 0x5036, 0xfa220000 / 3

USB Device: hub_device, apple_vendor_id, 0x9130, 0xfd300000 / 3

USB Device: Keyboard Hub, apple_vendor_id, 0x1006, 0xfd310000 / 7

USB Device: USB Mouse, 0x046d (Logitech Inc.), 0xc00c, 0xfd313000 / 9

USB Device: Apple Keyboard, apple_vendor_id, 0x0221, 0xfd312000 / 8

USB Device: SoundSticks, 0x05fc (Harman International), 0x7849, 0xfd330000 / 6

USB Device: Apple Cinema Display, apple_vendor_id, 0x9222, 0xfd320000 / 5

USB Device: hub_device, 0x050d (Belkin Corporation), 0x0233, 0xfd100000 / 2

USB Device: EPSON Scanner, 0x04b8 (Seiko Epson Corp.), 0x011e, 0xfd130000 / 4

USB Device: BRCM2046 Hub, 0x0a5c (Broadcom Corp.), 0x4500, 0x5a100000 / 2

USB Device: Bluetooth USB Host Controller, apple_vendor_id, 0x8215, 0x5a110000 / 3

FireWire Device: Duende Mini board, Solid State Logic, 400mbit_speed

FireWire Device: LaCie d2 Extreme LUN 0, LaCie Group SA, 800mbit_speed

FireWire Device: Liquid Mix, Focusrite Audio Engineering Ltd (design by Sintefex Audio Lda), 400mbit_speed

FireWire Device: built-in_hub, 800mbit_speed

FireWire Device: Mbox 2 Pro, DIGIDESIGN, 400mbit_speed

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----------

But this was no surprise at all! After rebooting and repairing disk permissions I gave ProTools 9 a try and… in all its glory there it was. Now, encouraged by this success, I firmly double-clicked the LX icon and lo and behold, without a hitch! After that Logic 9 also without any complaints. This has made my day after all!

May I draw your attention to the fact that I didn't took any action to mend anything (except permission repair). So what has happened, I ask myself? Has the ML OS the power to heal itself? I'm truly puzzled.

Until further notice: on this MacPro, this Mbox 2 Pro is supported by ML and LX!

BTW, if you care to choose MOTU hardware to work on, you will not regret it I'm sure. They have never ever left me standing in the cold, driver-wise or support-wise! Two things I can not say about Apogee, Avid/Digi and some more starting with the letter A ……

Good luck!

Reply

Answer 9

Feb 28, 2015 1:20 PM in response to Andre Guitar

I have found a solution for anyone having audio issues (mainly sound deterioration in all music related applications/software). After troubleshooting for a month (and getting mad), I found something. When I upgraded to Mavericks thats when the issue arose. I managed to downgrade to Mountain Lion (since my new Mac shipped with Mountain Lion) although Im not sure its necessary to downgrade once you do what I did to fix the noise issue. This is more for Pro-Tools users and those who use Digidesign interfaces (I have an Mbox 2 Mini). I have Pro-Tools 8.03, but I uploaded a newer driver update for Pro-Tools 9, and everything is fixed now. There are certainly compatibility issues with OSX and third party software and devices, and both Apple and Avid (Digidesign) don't want to deal with anyone that does'nt want to upgrade to the newest stuff, but for those of us that cannot afford to upgrade and need to work, this is a solution.

Check your drivers!

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