Q: Hard Drive

We should also consider that some quantum physics theories suggest that when the consumer is not directly observing this product, it may cease to exist or will exist only in a vague and undetermined state.

Yes, especially at Best Buy!

Save money and invest in a bare hard drive backup and redundancy plan

Its cheaper

less fuss

more reiable, removes the nasty failure point of SATA card interfaces.

takes up lot less space.

Bare hard drives and docks. The most reliable and cheapest method of hard drive data storage, archives, and redundancies

The best method for your data archives and redundancies, which is also the least expensive, the most reliable, and the most compact option is the purchase of naked hard drives and at least one USB 3.0 HD dock ($40 roughly).

While regarding Time Machine and your Macbook or desktop, your primary backup is best saved to a conventional USB (or Firewire / thunderbolt) hard drive inside an enclosure, the most important part of your data protection begins after your 1st / primary Time Machine / backup; and these are your secondary (most important) data storage devices, archives and their redundancies.

However bare hard drives and docks (below) also work perfectly as a Time Machine backup, this is for home use, since the docking station is certainly not very portable as a notebook Time Machine backup device should be; nor should bare HD be packed around with a notebook, rather remain at home or office.

Six terabytes of 2.5" HD pictured below in a very compact space.

Bare hard drives and docks have the lowest cost, the highest reliability, and take up the smallest storage space

Drawbacks:

1. Care and knowledge in general handling of naked hard drives (how not to shock a bare HD, and how to hold them properly). Not a genuine drawback.

Advantages:

1. By far the least expensive method of mass HD storage on a personal basis. Highest quality naked HD can be purchased in bulk very cheap.

2. Eliminates the horrible failure point of SATA bridges and interfaces between external drives and the computer.

3. Per square foot you can store more terabytes of data this way than any other.

4. Fast, easy, no fuss and most simplex method of data storage on hard drives.

To all posters in this thread:

This is probably one of the most useful threads I've seen on this site. I have a friend that's taking his critical data off his system, putting it on a 2.5" portable drive, and then putting that in a safe deposit box. I'm not joking. It's stuff like tax returns, pdfs of his home and mortgage payments, etc. etc. He got the idea because he visited one of those data recovery sites and they went over things that can happen to a drive, like head crashes, but then they also went into data loss caused by other events, like a house or business catching on fire, a flood, etc.

I think he's convinced that if he has the drive in a minimal state of use and then secures it away it will be safe. Apparently it won't. It will eventually give up the ghost anyway.

Would I be safe in assuming magnetic tapes are no more reliable than hard drives?

ThomasB2010 wrote:

 

He got the idea because he visited one of those data recovery sites and they went over things that can happen to a drive, like head crashes, but then they also went into data loss caused by other events, like a house or business catching on fire, a flood, etc.

 

I think he's convinced that if he has the drive in a minimal state of use and then secures it away it will be safe. Apparently it won't. It will eventually give up the ghost anyway.

 

Would I be safe in assuming magnetic tapes are no more reliable than hard drives?

Tape requires serious concerns for temp. and humidity,  its about the equivalent of taking care of a living plant. And that cannot be done sitting in bank vault.

You are assuming wrong, tape is a LOT more reliable than HD long term, but its a pain to mess with and it has to be cared for just right.  and its insanely slow to write to.

Yes, your friends notion of squirreling away a HD will lead to that datas dismal failure eventually.  Data depolarization will creep in and corrupt the data like a slow-melting popsicle over time.

It's stuff like tax returns, pdfs of his home and mortgage payments, etc. etc

That means its SMALL DATA that can fit on archival DVDs,  tell your buddy to buy a 100 pack of archival DVD+R  Taiyo Yuden for $40 and burn the data to it.      Such blank media is rated for 100 years and will certainly at the very minimum last 60+.    For archival of data, there is optical and nothing else for very long term.

As said, TAPE requires a lot to baby it to a long life.

ThomasB2010 wrote:

 

He got the idea because he visited one of those data recovery sites and they went over things that can happen to a drive,

People have a dual near delusional lack of knowledge as to both A: HD corruptibility and  B: the nature / existence of archival optical storage.

Obviously and logically at 4.7GB per layer, (bluray is too unstable and not available in long term archival) you're not putting a ton of data into long term storage.

However at 10, 20, 30 DVD,    47GB, up to say 30DVD at 140GB.....   that will cover all the documents, PDF, insurance, etc. etc.  anyone could have and then some.

Documents take up extremely little space.  Most people aren't worried about long term data storage of movies / pics / music.

Rather deeds, taxes, documents etc.

RE: Magnetic Tape

When I was working with magnetic tape in the banking industry, they took great pains to rewind each tape in their huge library at least annually. They told me that if you did not take pains to do that, you risked having the magnetic oxide coating on the tape substrate "forget" which layer it was supposed to be attached to.

The counterexample: Take out an old tape (that had not been rewound annually) place it in the drive, start to read it, and the oxide coating would come off in flakes inside the drive as you tried to read it.

nasty stuff isnt it?  Gotta baby it.

heat will cause rapid data depolarization

heat will cause rapid degradation of the substrate

cold will cause shrink and buildup of humidity and mold

stays rolled up too long, it will stick

Tape:  plastic rolls covered in magnetized rust.   Needs just the right temp and humidity, and low UV exposure.

"awesome" .

Grant Bennet-Alder wrote:

 

Take out an old tape (that had not been rewound annually) place it in the drive, start to read it, and the oxide coating would come off in flakes inside the drive as you tried to read it.

Ohh I know, Ive seen a lot of badly stored tape at university,  the rust will drop off it if you look at it sideways.   

You guys are getting a little too extreme at this point. Where in God's name can you even find a tape backup unit anymore? The used section of ebay? I haven't seen a tape unit in 10 years, and they were old and being taken out of systems at that time.

The same fate might be true for optical drives. If everyone stops putting them in systems, which is certainly the trend, if you go into a computer store 10 years from now to get an OD to read your archived tax returns or whatever, what good is the worlds greated optical data if you can't read it with anything?

This leads me to favor online backups for sure.

R.K.Orion wrote:

 

This leads me to favor online backups for sure.

Then you put your faith in your backup provider that not only will his equipment be up and running when you need it but that he also will be in business.  If you do not have a fast Internet connection, large backups can become time consuming propositions.

Local storage in one form or another will be present for the foreseeable future.

Ciao.

There is a viable use for online backup as a part of a larger backup strategy, as a sole backup it leaves a lot to be desired.

I admit that I am influenced by my own situation where my Internet service is 100% wireless.  The data speeds I experience are slow, slower and slower still, thus online backup is of a limited attraction at best.  Even if I had a fast connection, intuitively I do not favor that as a backup option. 

My position is best expressed by my having made USB installers for the three newest OSX's even though online recovery may be available.  There once was an occasion where Apple servers were down and the USB drive 'saved the day'.  I get 'warm fuzzies' with USB drives/HHD's in my possession, but not so with online alternatives.

At any rate, my point really was to express that there is no perfect backup strategy.  They all have weaknesses and some are better than others.

Ciao.

There is no ONE right way.

The most survivable Backup strategies use multiple methods, with Backups spread across multiple physical locations.

OGELTHORPE wrote:

 

I admit that I am influenced by my own situation where my Internet service is 100% wireless.  The data speeds I experience are slow, slower and slower still, thus online backup is of a limited attraction at best.  Even if I had a fast connection, intuitively I do not favor that as a backup option. 

Yup, my situation allows it, but it's only one third of my backup strategy.

At any rate, my point really was to express that there is no perfect backup strategy.  They all have weaknesses and some are better than others.

 

Ciao.

And more are better than less.

R.K.Orion wrote:

 

   You guys are getting a little too extreme at this point. Where in God's name can you even find a tape backup unit anymore?

You dont know apparently.

However, some companies still have a big business in TAPE BACKUP

http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/tape-backup-products

Suggest further education on this topic here:

http://www.storagenewsletter.com/category/rubriques/tapes/

And,  ....new TAPE technology is STILL being developed

2010 IBM: Linear Tape File System (LTFS), which allows accessing files on tape in the same way as on a disk filesystem

2011 Fujitsu and IBM announced that they had managed to record 29.5 billion bits per square inch with magnetic tape media developed using the BaFe particles and nanotechnologies allowing for an uncompressed tape drive of 35TB.  The technology is not expected to be commercially available for at least another decade.

Grant Bennet-Alder West of Boston, USA 

The most survivable Backup strategies use multiple methods, with Backups spread across multiple physical locations.

Absolutely.

OGELTHORPE wrote:

 

R.K.Orion wrote:

 

This leads me to favor online backups for sure.

Then you put your faith in your backup provider that not only will his equipment be up and running when you need it but that he also will be in business.  If you do not have a fast Internet connection, large backups can become time consuming propositions.

 

Local storage in one form or another will be present for the foreseeable future.

 

Ciao.

Not to mention the possibility of being hacked or stolen. How many times do intruders get on sites undetected. You only hear about them if they get caught.

ThomasB2010 wrote:

 

Not to mention the possibility of being hacked or stolen. How many times do intruders get on sites undetected. You only hear about them if they get caught.

Purchase a private website and encrypt your data if you need to.

Its as easy as ABC.

Online data backups are for mostly (on a personal level)  convenience,  necessitated other-platform redundancy

Online data backups

Drawbacks:

1. Subject to server failure or due to non-payment of your hosting account, it can be suspended.

2. Subject, due to lack of security on your part, to being attacked and hacked/erased.

Advantages:

1. In case of house fire, etc. your data is safe.

2. In travels, and propagating files to friends and likewise, a mere link by email is all that is needed and no large media needs to be sent across the net.

3. Online archives are the perfect and best-idealized 3^rd platform redundancy for data protection.

4. Supremely useful in data isolation from backups and local archives in being online and offsite for long-distance security in isolation.