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  • gumsie Level 4 Level 4 (2,150 points)

    Trust me that headline figure will always be spouted by those ignorant zealots that don't understand figures and statistics. iCloud does not have and never has had 320 million users. They need to get their facts straight and stop trolling.

  • Chris CA Level 9 Level 9 (77,695 points)

    "Trust me"

    Why should we?

  • Csound1 Level 8 Level 8 (42,305 points)

    gumsie wrote:

     

    Trust me that headline figure will always be spouted by those ignorant zealots that don't understand figures and statistics. iCloud does not have and never has had 320 million users. They need to get their facts straight and stop trolling.

    So, please tell us these 'facts'

     

    How many users does iCloud have?

  • petermac87 Level 5 Level 5 (6,115 points)

    Looking forward to you supplying the correct figures then, or are you speculating again?

     

    Thanks

     

    Pete

  • TopSteve Level 1 Level 1 (65 points)

    Chris CA wrote:

     

    "Trust me"

    Why should we?

    Why should we not?  (there's not anoth trust in the would as it is)

  • snozdop Level 5 Level 5 (5,800 points)

    May be there are some Mac programmers here who could work on a 3rd party answer to the problem of Sync without iCloud (on topic).

     

    This is to all the people here who are holding out for a third-party local direct USB sync solution:

     

    I've been reading the iOS Developer Documentation over the last few days, looking for the public APIs that a third-party developer could use to enable direct syncing of contacts and calendars via USB.

     

    The bad news is, there are none. Apple does not appear to allow direct communication over USB with an iOS device, except for certain external accessories (MIDI instruments for example). There are also no APIs that allow communication over USB directly with the iOS contact and calendar databases.

     

    A third-party iOS app can request access to a users contacts and calendars and perform add, delete or modify actions on them. So this means any potential third-party solution would have to have an iOS counterpart app installed to manage the data via the APIs Apple provides. So, contact data would have to be transferred into the iOS app, and then the app modifies the contact records as required.

     

    However, as far as I can tell, the only way to get data into an iOS app via USB, is through the iTunes File Sharing feature. Whereby you manually drag and drop files into the specific app via the File Sharing section of the iTunes Apps tab. So this would not provide anything like a seamless, automatic sync via USB.

     

    Apple doesn't appear to allow third-party developers direct access to the device via public APIs outside of iTunes. I believe programs like PhoneView do this via undocumented methods, but I've contacted them and they have no plans to investigate whether contact and calendar syncing is a possibility (I doubt it).

     

    So, basically, as far as I can tell, it is not currently technically possible for any third-party developer to create a seamless, direct, local contacts and calendars sync over USB with an iOS device.

     

    Anyone waiting for one, might want to re-consider their options.

  • snozdop Level 5 Level 5 (5,800 points)

    Bob,

     

    Can you not simply export a vCard from the Contacts app on your Mac (drag and drop a group to the desktop) and then send that via Bluetooth to the phone?

     

    That's what I've done with many other phones unsupported by iSync in the past.

  • peter_watt Level 3 Level 3 (905 points)

    TopSteve wrote:

     

    peter_watt wrote:

     

    .....[snip]

    As for registered with ICO yes your right and if I need to I will I will also have to check what the situation is in Greece "for example"  As for Apples iCloud data center   One is in "Maiden, North Carolina" and I would be supprised if there are any outside the US but I will check just out of intrest.

     

    Finlay data-encryption  :-) This is something that intrests me gratley and I experment/program diffent forms.

    I have done some more research  on ICO data protection principles, and whereas I can only speak entirely for UK, most of the regulatons are governed by the European Commission and should cover all countries in Europe. For the time being Greece and UK are both in EU (who knows for how long...).

    There is a small list of "safe" countries outside the EU which it is considered safe to transfer data. USA is not on the list but the European Commission considers it safe to send data (which you have registered with the ICO of course) to USA companies if they are signed up to the "Safe Harbor Scheme". Apple inc is signed up to it. That means even if you sent actual data to Apple for processing it complies with the safety requirements of the European Commission.

    Remember this is not even sent for processing, it is transmitted (encrypted) for storage (encrypted) to servers in a company signed up to the Safe Harbor Scheme.

    I would be VERY surprised if data cannot legally be stored on Apple icloud servers for any European users, even business users with sensitive data, provided all 8 of the data safety principles are followed, as any good business would do anyway.

    If your data is too low level to register with ICO it woud not be restricted anyway provided it is not abused.

     

    The above does not constitute legal advice, do your own research.  

    my refs.

    http://ico.org.uk/for_organisations/data_protection/the_guide/principle_8

    http://support.apple.com/kb/HT4865?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US

  • Drew Reece Level 5 Level 5 (5,000 points)

    BobinStanmore, can't you go back to 10.8 & setup your iSync workaround again?

     

    I understand it's not great to be an OS behind, however 10.8 will have support for a few more years (at least for security fixes).

     

    It gives you the features you need and allows developers time to make a solution for syncing (or it gives you time to look at other OS's & options).

     

    Yes it's a bit difficult to revert, but so is allowing data to go out of sync & trying to remember which end you added a new contact or event etc… Manually managing this data is a pain (by exporting & importing everything).

     

    Is there really anything on 10.9 that you simply can't be without? Is your Mac 10.9 only?

  • TopSteve Level 1 Level 1 (65 points)

    "This is to all the people here who are holding out for a third-party local direct USB sync solution:

     

    I've been reading the iOS Developer Documentation over the last few days, looking for the public APIs that a third-party developer could use to enable direct syncing of contacts and calendars via USB."

     

    Thank you for that headsup and I asome the same go's for Notes? (evey one is talking about Contacts and Calinders) but no one on Notes.

     

    I have been trying OS X Leopard server(this is the version I had laying around I'll try a newer version latter) and I have some sucksess I  setup the DNS to give mapping to the local network on 192.168.1.n and gave this privat network a domain.home name then setup the e-mail server to be a imap server for "Localdomain" and "domain.home" (you dont need the "domain.home" but I'm doing other tests at the same time. Then I added a user "sync" and enabled the email account for that user "sync@localdomain"  I added this user in the "Internet Accounts" panel as "other" mail account. I could not add as a OSX server account because that nead server version 7 or higher.  Ther account I setup allows for mail and notes (I'll come back to this)  but I had to use the IP address not the name (mostprobly because I have not set the right DNS lookups).

     

    Now what is the outcome of all this? Well when I load the Notes program on OSX 10.9 it uploads new notes to the server and when I open the mail program on my iPhone it finds the notes in a folder in mail called notes.  But the notes do not appear in the Notes app on the iPhone.  Now for iPhone to Mac sync It dose not! what I can do is e-mail notes in the Notes app to my self "sync@localdomain" and thay apper in the OSX 10.9 mail program in the inbox.  There is no direct Notes app to Notes app sync.

     

    So will this change when I upgrade the server.

     

    Please not my setup is with three laptops and one iPhone with one of the laptops (old powerbook G4) as the server but this laptop can not run 10.9 I will have to run the 10.9 server on my main laptop and this might use up to meany resorces of the Core 2 Duo 2.6Ghz 4Gb ram.  But we will see

  • TopSteve Level 1 Level 1 (65 points)

    Peter

     

    :-) thanks for the heads up. yes I have looked this up myself as well but it's a lote of resarch for a hypothetical situation.  I feel that a indepth exporlation of the legal is not right for this forum.  I uderstand that some people esp Apple want to point out that it is perfecley propper and legal to use iCloud in this way and it is. 

     

    However even though something may be legal, hypotheticaly there may be other resions(good/bad/evlivent or other) why it should/can be done.  I belive that if a persion states/says that data can not be sync'ed by iCould even if that is not technal true it should be aceped as a truth of there situation and this is why I put forword the hypothetical situation. 

     

    Apart from the hypothetical situation there may be protacals, procedures, contracts, terms and conditions that do not alow for data to be moved in this way.

     

    Even if all of this can be over come and I salue your determation to clear them away there are still hardware problem as in 3G iPhone dose not suport iCloud.

  • Csound1 Level 8 Level 8 (42,305 points)

    TopSteve wrote:

     

    Peter

     

    I belive that if a persion states/says that data can not be sync'ed by iCould even if that is not technal true it should be aceped as a truth

    That's absurd.

     

    No assistance can be given without knowing the problem, and the causes of that problem. This isn't magic.

  • Drew Reece Level 5 Level 5 (5,000 points)

    Snozdrop,

    I'm hoping it is possible for developers to access iOS data via USB. I'd expect it not to be listed in the iOS developer info, but perhaps in the Mac developer info?

     

    I think libimobiledevice & usbmuxd allows communication with a phone (even on stock iOS), but it's unclear on which parts are Apple's code & which parts are reverse engineered parts that have to catch up to Apple's API whims . http://www.libimobiledevice.org/

     

    Those tools allow Linux users to manage an iOS device, since Apple don't care about those users (why would Apple, they only brought an iOS device, not a Mac).

     

    I also wonder if this is a feature that will be allowed in the App store. It strikes me as a lot of work for a developer with little support from Apple, especially if Apple don't condone this sort of app in their store.

     

    It doesn't seem likely to me that this will be a 'plugin' for iTunes that reinstates the two checkboxes for contacts & calendar (& possibly notes) syncing. I suspect it will be another app that needs to be opened to sync.

     

    I hope I am wrong, since Mac & iOS should really be integrated via Apples own solution, a.k.a iTunes (or even resurrect iSync with a 'bring your own sync services' backend).

  • peter_watt Level 3 Level 3 (905 points)

    TopSteve, occasionally my Csound1 and I agree.

     

    If all you are contributing is hypotheticals, mysterious truths and maybes, one might conclude you are just arguing for argument's sake. 

     

    If you have a real problem, state it here please and someone can help you solve it. 

     

    We have addressed several technical non-cloud options, at least five to my reckoning,  and tried to bust the myth of your hypothetical European legal issues, what more can we do?

  • gumsie Level 4 Level 4 (2,150 points)

    They can't accept that 320 million accounts is not the same as 320 million users. I alone have 3 iCloud accounts. That's the power of statistics and presenting data in a favourable manner.