Previous 1 90 91 92 93 94 Next 1,534 Replies Latest reply: Jan 31, 2015 11:34 AM by Kurt Weber Go to original post Branched to a new discussion.
  • PeterBreis0807 Level 7 Level 7 (33,560 points)

    The ad hominem attacks were started by you to avoid or deny the long list of reported problems in Pages 5.

     

    The 10,000% certainty rubbish was all yours. Which you are attributing to everyone else.

     

    You couldn't have been more crystal clear in what you said, repeating it over and over again.

     

    You created it, but have been trying to belatedly make out it is everyone else's call.

     

    You have a problem with me calling a spade a spade, and continually attribute to me all the base attitudes you seem to be suffering from.

     

    We have been asking for forever for you to provide evidence of why you are so certain that Apple isn't knowingly, intentionally hurting its customers.

     

    Are you saying they are stupid, incompetent, and inadvertantly inflicting constant blunders? If that is their excuse, how on the other hand can you tell everyone to put their work, livelihood and total faith in Apple to do the right thing?

     

    Peter

  • PeterBreis0807 Level 7 Level 7 (33,560 points)

    In other words is Apple All-knowing, All-loving, or more likely merely mortal, concerned with itself and with feet of clay?

     

    Peter

  • robogobo Level 2 Level 2 (290 points)

    This is all an illusion. You're confused. Anger does that.  I never called you names, or attributed your opinion to religious beliefs.  That was you.  I just asked you to stop being rude, keep calm and mature.  You couldn't do that and this thread devolved to a flame session.  Your fault, 10,000%.  Yours.

     

    I have a problem with you bluffing for your own benefit, when nobody showed their hand.  You call the unknown a spade.  You don't know any more than I do, yet somehow I need to provide the evidence.  And you keep coming back to this.  It's crazy making.

     

    I don't need to provide any more evidence than you, which is zero.  My claims, all certain, are based on my past experience and common sense, simply, why any company would intentionally hurt its customers.  It's just a really ridiculous premise.  It just is.  And it's just not true.  You're the only one that benefits from it, which is why you carry it on, all without any evidence of your own.

     

    But I understand now, that you were the fanboy who drank the kool aid and got burned for over trusting, and now you need to point fingers at everyone else who was more careful, call them worshippers, stooges, fanboys, whatever, just to make yourself feel better.  It's all standard defensive angry behavior.  You can't help it.  You're just angry.

  • PeterBreis0807 Level 7 Level 7 (33,560 points)

    Therein lies the problem with talking to a denialist and apologist, they also deny they are both.

     

    Why would any company intentionally hurt its customers?

     

    As we have pointed out, an enormous number of times, It just has!

     

    This tedious tit-for-tat argument with you has been going on for so long, I couldn't even remember how it all started, so I searched back to where you first chimed in with your:

     

    "No representation, With or Without taxation. / None if by land. None if by sea. / Send the King a nice letter."

     

    I didn't even respond to you even after you started arguing with one of the other posters. It was you who started the mud flying by calling the posters here "spoiled children", then escalated from there.

     

    The word "angry" has been used at length by just about everyone here but directed at what Apple has done to them and their work.

     

    Hard to be grateful when you get king hit from out of the nowhere.

     

    "That one was for free!"

     

    Finally, do I also need to point out that your notion of "everyone else" is pretty much just you.

     

    Peter

  • israfelli Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I read a story about Microsoft in The Register and saw a sentence where replacing a few words would fit this situation perfectly:

     

    Irrational as it might seem, users will gleefully accept a glitch or a loss in productivity if the new version is to supplement, not supplant our existing tool. Apple chose instead to attempt to leverage the Pages brand name to drive buy-in of Pages 5 without acknowledging that the brand also brings with it expectations.

     

    The result was the opposite of desired: Pages 5 has instead damaged the Pages brand name.

  • Hirschkorn Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    The ArsTechnica review: "Overall, the new Pages looks pretty good at first glance. But once you start to look for problems, you find them everywhere."

  • Tom Farrell Level 1 Level 1 (25 points)

    Still waiting to upgrade to Mavericks due to these Pages issues (not so much Keynote and Numbers), and the USB sync situation.

     

    God did not intend reasonably sophisticated desktop/mouse software and reasonably sophisticated tablet/touch software to be essentially identical. How has Apple mis-understood this?

     

    Would a maker of woodworking table saws come out with a new model that was limited to the capabilities of a hand saw?

     

    Do we expect that Adobe will dumb down Photoshop so that it can be feature matched to the capabilities of its iPad software?

     

    This seems, at a very basic level, to be insane behavior.

     

    Still hoping for the best, but then again remembering "Apple II Forever".

     

         Tom

  • israfelli Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Tom,

     

    It's fantastic that you alone of all humans on the earth have a unique insight into what God's intentions are, and moreso for informing us unwashed masses. Perhaps you're correct and the reason for war, starvation, sickness, corruption, plague, global warming, nuclear fallout, mass extinction, genocide, and the Ice Capades ...is all because God is too busy worrying about the lack of features in the latest iWork.

     

    He was probably editing his list of upcoming calamities to remediate, and wanted to change all instances of a style, he found he couldn't do it anymore, and that Pages 5 had corrupted his table images.

     

    He's now sidetracked trying to fix ruined Pages documents, and has no time for anything else.

     

    Thanks for the insight.

     

    -Israfelli

     

    11. "Thou shalt not Pages 5"

  • mayavirupa333 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)

    Having endorsed an earlier post of yours, I was disappointed at your heavy sarcastic response to Tom's rather witty and insightful post. I guess humour doesn't always translate.

  • israfelli Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Toms post was spot on. I agree with his point 100%. Leveraging God as he did, even dressed as wit was a poor idea.  I found it offensive. I don't want to dwell on it further. I'd rather get back to the topic of this thread: Pages

  • robogobo Level 2 Level 2 (290 points)

    Permission to treat the witness as hostile - granted!

     

    Your pattern continues, Peter. It's two days of calm, one day ranting, raving lunacy.

     

    At last we see your standard of evidence for your claims though:  Why? It just is! 

     

    Wow, if only I had known that, think of all the trouble I could have avoided.  How do I know that Apple wouldn't intentionally hurt its customers?  They just don't!  I can do it too! 

     

    It's also amusing how you go to quote me, quotation marks and all, and then within them is something I never said.  You do know what quotation marks are for, right?  Really, though, your logic is intoxicating.  Or intoxicated, more to the point.  I'm not sure if your point is lost in the attempt at sarcastic humor.  But I have no idea what those last lines of your post mean.  I guess that doesn't matter though, as long as you're talking.  It's like a Republican filibuster over there.

     

    I'm no denialist or apologist.

     

    It's ok though.  You just keep on believing what you want to believe.  That seems to work for you in spite of any little bit of reason. 

     

    Spoiled children.  Yeah, that sounds about right.  This thread would never be taken seriously with the way you're acting.  It reminds me of my five year old son complaining about the food on his plate.  The only difference is that he can't choose what's for dinner, which is why he's acting out.  But you can.  So there's no justification for your attitude.  If my son politely and calmly asked if he could eat his carrots uncooked and less gravy on his potatoes, I'd be so darn impressed that I'd listen up.  But he whines and cries and that gets him nowhere.  I try to teach him respect, and he's getting better.  I told him today that he's much more well mannered than many adults I know. Can you guess who I was thinking of? 

     

    Just go eat somewhere else if you hate it so much. I have no idea why you hang around here, just trolling about hating on everything.  You're so done with Apple but you won't leave the restaurant.

     

     

    PeterBreis0807 wrote:

     

    Therein lies the problem with talking to a denialist and apologist, they also deny they are both.

     

    Why would any company intentionally hurt its customers?

     

    As we have pointed out, an enormous number of times, It just has!

     

    This tedious tit-for-tat argument with you has been going on for so long, I couldn't even remember how it all started, so I searched back to where you first chimed in with your:

     

    "No representation, With or Without taxation. / None if by land. None if by sea. / Send the King a nice letter."

     

    I didn't even respond to you even after you started arguing with one of the other posters. It was you who started the mud flying by calling the posters here "spoiled children", then escalated from there.

     

    The word "angry" has been used at length by just about everyone here but directed at what Apple has done to them and their work.

     

    Hard to be grateful when you get king hit from out of the nowhere.

     

    "That one was for free!"

     

    Finally, do I also need to point out that your notion of "everyone else" is pretty much just you.

     

    Peter

  • robogobo Level 2 Level 2 (290 points)

    Hmm.  this made me think a lot.  It isn't God that's involved here, in the spiritual or physical sense.  But on a certain level, it's a sort of early stage in evolution - or creation - that we're witness to.  And perhaps there's an insight into the overlap of the two in the creation/evolution of the virtual world of computer software, machines, systems.

     

    It's certainly "intelligent" design (the degree of intelligence is certainly the point of debate here).  And with the push and pull of developer and user, there's a certain evolution that appears as a consequence.

     

    On that level, do we have any idea who we're dealing with here?  This company, extended to an industry, is making policy we don't see, but certainly feel, that determines the paradigms of the future. Some here will so flippantly bash these "creators" without a thought as to what they've bought into, of their own free will.  You are free to go write your own software, develop your own hardware that's fit to you and only you.  Go ahead.  See how far you get. But Apple, MS, Google, Samsung, Intel, Adobe, Nikon, Canon, etc etc, they're writing policy.  They aren't just making tools for you.  They're evolving technology in a very specific direction, whether it fits you or not. That means making mistakes along the way, correcting, guessing, throwing ideas at the wall to see what sticks. Natural selection, if you will.

     

    So I guess evoking the idea of God isn't quite so far off, and we might learn a thing or two about the philosophy of it all in the process.  Evolution occurs through feedback and selection.  We have my preferred approach to feedback, which is like the development of opposable digits and standing upright out of necessity, and Peter's form of feedback which is along the lines of one animal eating another that was too slow or weak. That's being mighty generous though, since it's really more like one animal screaming as loud as it can that it can't run fast enough, hoping someone will be so annoyed by the complaining that they'll give him longer legs. Who knows, maybe that's how God makes decisions for the next version.

    Tom Farrell wrote:

     

    Still waiting to upgrade to Mavericks due to these Pages issues (not so much Keynote and Numbers), and the USB sync situation.

     

    God did not intend reasonably sophisticated desktop/mouse software and reasonably sophisticated tablet/touch software to be essentially identical. How has Apple mis-understood this?

     

    Would a maker of woodworking table saws come out with a new model that was limited to the capabilities of a hand saw?

     

    Do we expect that Adobe will dumb down Photoshop so that it can be feature matched to the capabilities of its iPad software?

     

    This seems, at a very basic level, to be insane behavior.

     

    Still hoping for the best, but then again remembering "Apple II Forever".

     

         Tom

  • mayavirupa333 Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)

    Thanks israfelli, it really helps to know that you agreed with Tom's point despite being personally offended by his language. So, yes, back to topic.

     

    Clearly one of the challenges of this thread is that the "topic" is not straightforward. It is, as you rightly say, Pages, but it includes a powerful subtext about Apple's overall strategy and corporate "attitude" - which is off-topic to some, over-reaction to those less affected, and critically relevant to others.

     

    Tolerance is the only way through here, which is why I endorsed your earlier attempt

    Nov 18, 2013 1:46 PM (in response to j kfrommorgantown) to mediate between peter and robogobo.

     

    Just as I typed those words, in comes the latest installment from robogobo... Oh dear. Now I'm offended by robo's description of his parenting! Where will this end?!

     

    And now... news just in! robo on God, evolution, natural selection et al

     

    Tolerance! Pages Features Checklist! Let's get back to the real nitty-gritty, like, er, linked text boxes.

  • PeterBreis0807 Level 7 Level 7 (33,560 points)

    robogobo wrote:

     

    I'm no denialist or apologist.

     

    I'm sorry I nodded off through all the rest, but that made me laugh. You take so long to say nothing, all wrapped around the apologies and denying anything has happened.

     

    Peter

     

    PS Unlike you I am actually giving others support, which is why I don't bother replying to you incessantly.

  • israfelli Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    @mayavirupa: Well you remind us of an important point. The name of this thread is Pages 5 Features Checklist, not Predictions of Apple's philosophies and Strategies for Future Software Updates. Nor is it How I feel About Apple. If this thread was simply limited to what the title indicates, namely the features lost and found (the facts), then I suppose the thread could be only a dozen replies long, appended only when a new feature is found missing, not 1200 replies or whatever it's at now. But having fleshed out the simple facts early on, we have moved to speculation, emotion, religion, and discussion about Apple's intentions and other semi-related topics. That's why I made that reply you linked to, I wanted to bring the conversation back to the facts, especially for those new to the thread. Nobody new is going to slog through 1200 replies. The facts once stated offer little more to discuss. It's a waiting game now. There is little of importance to now discuss, So lacking anything else, we seem to be substituting other semi-related issues and our own emotions about those facts

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