Q: Your System has Run out of Application memory

The CPU & memory indicate part of what is going on…

1st report:

Top Processes by CPU:

    2% WindowServer

    1% EtreCheck

Top Processes by Memory:

344 MB   mds_stores

213 MB   Safari

Virtual Memory Statistics:

0 B      Page-outs

2nd report:

Top Processes by CPU:

    98% mds_stores

    31% Mail

Top Processes by Memory:

9.67 GB  mds_stores

262 MB   Mail

Virtual Memory Statistics:

0 B      Page-outs

mds_stores is Spotlight indexing. Has your disk finished indexing? If not allow it to complete before opening Mail.

It could be Mail that is requesting the new email to be indexed for searching, I wonder if an old Spotlight importer could be causing Spotlight to leak memory?

I find it odd that you have not gone into paging memory to disk, it's almost like that feature is turned off.

You have items installed that I think are questionable, but you should probably try the regular troubleshooting steps first.

Also look in the 'all messages' section of Console (in the /Applications/Utilities folder) as mds_stores is gobbling up RAM. See if there are any messages that appear, & post a few examples here (not the entire log ).

Boot into 'Safe mode' (hold shift after the chime until the spinning 'cog' appears). Ensure the login window says 'safe mode'.

https://support.apple.com/kb/HT1455

It will disable all third party extensions & startup items.

If the Mac is better in safe mode it is time to look at the third party items.

Be aware that some features will be disabled like wifi on some models, graphics drivers will be in a reduced mode - this is normal in safe mode. Reboot to go back to normal.

The items that concern me are:

Startup Items:

HP IO - Path: /Library/StartupItems/HP IO

Launch Agents:

[failed] com.displaylink.useragent.plist

User Launch Agents:

[loaded] com.zeobit.MacKeeper.Helper.plist

Startup Items: Stored in /Library/StartupItems/

Startup Items have been discontinued by Apple since Mac OS 10.4. They are responsible for making changes at a system level. Remove them all or spend time ensuring ALL related software is up to date. You need a very good reason to have anything installed in here. The developers are ignoring Apple guidelines by installing these - not a good sign.

Launchd jobs: several types

LaunchAgents           - Stored in /Library/LaunchAgents

LaunchDaemons        - Stored in /Library/LaunchDaemons

User LaunchAgents    - Stored in ~/Library/LaunchAgents

These are all background jobs, they are not necessarily bad, but if they are loading old code it could be doing untold damage to the performance & stability of the entire OS. Focus on the System level jobs (the ones inside /Library - the system level) also remove ['failed'], non-system jobs.

EtreCheck gives a status on launchd jobs…

[loaded]                  - a running job

[not loaded]            - jobs that are set not to run, basically harmless, remove them unless you plan to use the associated software (if it is up to date)

[failed]                    - jobs in a crashed or unknown state, it could be forking processes or using all the system resources, remove these.

MacKeeper has a bad reputation on these forums, it's up to you if you want to use it, personally I think it adds unnecessary tasks to the OS and encourages you to delete system files.

All the usual caveats apply, backup before you modify the system, if you choose to remove items look for uninstall instructions so you remove all the relevant parts.

I'm not sure that the problem is so easily identified as systemic.  I've been following this discussion just purely out of general interest and the hope that I can help once in a while, but I don't suffer from the condition.  I use almost all of the applications listed here (with the exception of Aperture, I use Lightroom) and I've not had this error even once.  My current uptime is 18 days since the last reboot.  The reason I am posting this is to say that waiting on Apple to fix something wrong with your system may be waiting in vain.  Specific conditions with Apple applications may or may not be addressed and third part apps are always the responsibility of the developer, common or not. 

I'm not convinced that this is purely a bug in Mavericks "memory management tricks" as you say.  I'm running Mail, Safari and more on both a Macbook Air (8GB Ram) and iMac (32GB Ram) without any memory errors or reboots.  I would suggest that you proactively pursue a solution to your problem by posting a new thread with a report from EtreCheck and let the knowledgeable folks here have a look at it.  I'll be happy to try to help you as well.

Kenneth Collins1 wrote:

 

I joined this discussion because I wanted to know if this problem was specific to me and if there was a fix. The anwer is that it is a bug and the fix is to wait for Apple to fix it. The problem is in the new method of managing memory, not with anything a user does. Apple will fix it as soon as they can.

 

No, the testing manager should not be fired. The first version of any software has bugs, sometimes conspicuous ones, either because they only become apparent after the software is released, or because the software was deliberatly released with the bug, if it is cosmetic, does not harm anything, or is just an inconvenience.

 

I found out what I needed to know, and I'll wait.

Thank you Drew!

There is no problem if I start in safe mode, so it must be a third party application.

Were you able to open Mail in safe mode & let it run for a while?

mds_stores didn't eat all the memory?

I wonder if you can let it run in safe mode then try again in normal mode, if you are lucky maybe the items worn't try to reindex?

Check the logs too, it would be best to isolate it to a specific app or spotlight plugin.

You can also logout completely & log back in but hold shift as you click the login button, that will disable just the user login items, it can indicate issues inside your account.

If it's any consolation to you, since I originally posted my experience with this annoying OS X memory leak (adopting the label of others), it has not reared it's ugly head. Hopefully I didn't just jinx myself.

Whatever the cause ... it has worked itself out without the need to uninstall/reinstall, download and run 3rd party software, or run through an endless list of troubleshooting tasks that could possibly give me an answer as to why it happened.

I hope that everyone else encountering the issue is as lucky as me *crossing fingers*.

You probably waited long enough for the indexing to finish, which is not a bug, it is required for Spotlight to work.

bigd_pdx wrote:

 

I'm not sure that the problem is so easily identified as systemic.

Nortons and MacKeeper certainly do the OSX absolutely no favors, as you can see from these Forums over the past few years, and more times than not, their proper removal appears to instanstanly alleviate the problems that a lot of users have. Sure, in some cases it is a Hardware issue, but is Nortons or MacKeeper are identified as being on a system, then the first step, IMHO, is to uninstall them first and then move onto other troubleshooting tips if it has not fixed the issue.

Pete

Indexing probably causes macs to stop responding, pause all applications, and give the ominous message: your system has run out of application memory? Yikes.

I should add that between my original post and now I have actually had to re-index (http://support.apple.com/kb/ht2409) because I needed to flush out a bunch of Outlook messages that were inaccessible because they were not associated with the default identity, or some stupid like reason, and were cluttering my search results. And during that re-indexing I had ZERO problems with my machine, even while running all my usual apps/software (avg. 16+).

My point being, maybe it was indexing; maybe it was a BUG that exists in Mavericks. Maybe.

Out of curiosity, why did you feel the need to reply to my message? I understand the drive to troubleshoot and good will to help others, which you and others have (read Drew), but why is it that some of your replies border on being a defensive post of how Mavericks itself cannot be the source of the issue? Just curious.

This is slightly off-topic, but I always tell newcomers to the Mac not to buy the Mac version of a Windows program. In such a case, the company's main business is developing for Windows and the Mac is a sideline. Since the program is designed for Windows and adapted to the Mac, it may have performance and quality issues, UI weirdities, and a smaller feature set. Instead, look for a functionally equivalent program from a company whose main business is developing software for the Mac. It's often better and less expensive. Windows freeware is generally poor quality, while Mac freeware can be better than commercial software; such as Titanium Software's utilties.

So ditch Norton Anything. You probably don't need it anyway.

It's a possible explanation, not a defense.

If Spotlight is still performing its initial indexing it should be allowed to finish, it consumes resources to the point that other processes may be affected. It has been that way at least since SL (10.6) so this is in no way limited to Mavericks, any new install of OSX will trigger it.

Reindexing uses far less resources usually (much of the system will be unchanged)

But as you have no more issues (except maybe with the 3rd party stuff) I have nothing more to offer.

Bye.

Kenneth Collins1 wrote:

 

This is slightly off-topic, but I always tell newcomers to the Mac not to buy the Mac version of a Windows program.

Totally agree there, Office for Mac is (at best) mediocre in comparison to the Windows version, it is also incompatible with many of Apples services.

And to charge the amount that MS do for it is almost larceny

Unfortunately, you guys aren't reading the whole thread. Here's some confirmed facts about this one from last week:

A) It's a confirmed apple bug and they seem to be working on a fix.

B) It happens in safe mode with only apple software.

C) There is no known workaround (other than using webmail.)

D) It's not the fault of the user. It's apple's fault and it a horrendous bug.

I have tried since day one to allow Mail to finish indexing (if that's what it's doing) but no amount of time seems to let it finish. The bug also seems to get much worse over time. Mail will now fill my hard disk with swap files and fill my ram in under five minutes so no indexing is going to get done. I'm still rebooting multiple times a day although I've used ssh to kill email from another computer successfully, if I catch it in time.

AlexPower1 wrote:

 

Unfortunately, you guys aren't reading the whole thread. Here's some confirmed facts about this one from last week:

 

A) It's a confirmed apple bug and they seem to be working on a fix.

 

B) It happens in safe mode with only apple software.

 

C) There is no known workaround (other than using webmail.)

 

D) It's not the fault of the user. It's apple's fault and it a horrendous bug.

 

I have tried since day one to allow Mail to finish indexing (if that's what it's doing) but no amount of time seems to let it finish. The bug also seems to get much worse over time. Mail will now fill my hard disk with swap files and fill my ram in under five minutes so no indexing is going to get done. I'm still rebooting multiple times a day although I've used ssh to kill email from another computer successfully, if I catch it in time.

Can you give us links to these facts please. Not just the link to a couple of posts, official links would be best.

Thank You

Pete

Well, even though I don't think it's a very good guess, thanks  for offering your possible explanation.

I don't think it's a very good guess for all of the following reasons:

1) I installed Mavericks c. Oct. 28, 2013;

2) I encountered my "run out of application memory" messasge on Nov. 12, 2013 (around 2 weeks later);

3) I imagine indexing was occuring during those 3 weeks and didn't just happen to commence on Nov. 12th.

So, perhaps it's time to add bug in OS X (Mavericks) to your universe of possible explanations. That is, if it's your intent to reply to posts with no query and offer possible explanations.

Indexing was or should have been completed by then, but if mds is still running then indexing is taking place. But you know that already.