Mavericks corrupts external hard drive

Tried booting in Windows7 and using MacDrive but with no luck. 😟

Rogerout, Thanks for the life lesson mate. I'll say it again, I take full responsibility for not diligently backing up my work. FYI I had most of what was on that drive backed up. FYI I ran Mavericks on a laptop for a week to test it before installing it on my iMac. I just never plugged in a RAID drive to that laptop. My mistake, but then I did test it with various other hard drives. I did a bit or research on compatibilty but didn't come across this thread until after it happened to me. When I installed Mavericks on my iMac the RAID drive I use attached to that machine worked fine for the first day, it's only, bizarrely, on the second day of having the OS installed that the issue occured.

All of that does not in any way shape or form take away from the fact that Apple had this OS in Beta for half of this year and somehow this issue managed to get overlooked, which I cannot believe, especially as I can now see that reports of this issue occuring began as soon as the OS was released officially. That is what makes me mad, not the fact that I lost data, frustrating though that is.

Again, let me be clear, I am not blaming Apple for my lack of a complete back up, I'm blaming Apple for not informing users of this major issue as soon as it was discovered, and for missing it (if they did miss it) during Beta testing. Are you seriously telling me that during the whole Beta testing period not one person plugged in a RAID drive? I don't need a lecture on data security, I need an explanation from Apple, but thanks anyway.

By the way, on the phone to Apple tech suppport yesterday I basically got the told they were aware of the issue but they were 'still collecting data' (oh the irony of that phrase) and were working on how to fix it. The advice I was given was 'don't plug in any external drives to a Mac running Mavericks until we can resolve this issue'. That's the kind of thing I needed to be told a week ago.

May I also add, Rogerout, that one of my students had this issue with their RAID drive (A WD MyBook of course) and asked me for help as they had no idea what was going on. Imagine if I'd replied to them the way you've been replying here. Just think how that would have come across.

Third email update I received (just now, Nov. 6) from Western Digital:

Dear WD Registered Customer,

On October 30th, 2013 Western Digital informed registered customers of affected products via E-mail regarding reports of Western Digital and other external HDD products experiencing data loss when updating to OS X Mavericks (10.9). Our investigation to date has found that for a small percentage of customers that have the WD Drive Manager, WD Raid Manager and/or WD SmartWare software applications installed on their Mac, there can be cases of a repartition and reformat of their Direct Attached Storage (DAS) devices without customer acknowledgement which can result in data loss.

WD has been tracking this issue closely through our WD Forum and through our Technical Support hotline and the occurrence rate of this event has been very low. A specific set of conditions and timing sequences between the OS and the WD software utilities has to occur to cause this issue. Should this event occur, the data on the product can likely be recovered with a third party software utility if the customer stops using the device immediately after the OS X Mavericks (10.9) upgrade. WD will be issuing updated versions of these software applications that resolve this issue.

WD strongly urges our customers to uninstall these software applications before updating to OS X Mavericks (10.9), or delay upgrading until we provide an update to the applications. If you have already upgraded to Mavericks, WD recommends that you remove these applications and restart your computer. If you have already upgraded to Mavericks and are experiencing difficulty in accessing your external hard drive, please do not save anything to the drive, disconnect the drive from your computer, and contact Western Digital Customer Service at http://support.wd.com/country/.

chattphotos wrote:

No grasshopper, not everyone knows,

Especially when you can't anticipate Mavericks wiping out the primary backup disk/system/raid.

Sure, but you can anticipate that the first Marvericks release is going to have some issues. Rushing to install the initial release is not a smart thing to do and people have been warned for decades against installing a first version of anything.

When I bought a Mac Mini early this year I gave a lot of thought about how to set up the disks. I've built and managed large Windows web and SQL servers in a 1,200 PC network, so I have some experience with disk systems. I spent the better part of a day reading the latest in RAID setups and decided that the only RAID worth running might be RAID 1. RAID 5 and some of the other new many-disk setups, especially with large capacity drives, is just not worth it. Spend some time with Google in this subject, read the white papers on the problems with 2TB drives used in a RAID system. It's all out there, for free. There's no excuse to be ignorant on this.

The main lesson, however, is to never install version 1 of anything, especially an OS. What does Mavericks have that ML doesn't that one just MUST have? Nothing. So why install it?

You guys running RAID might want to study up on how Google manages their data. See if you can dump your RAID for a more simple setup. I'd be happy to explain how mine is set up if anyone is interested.

Lastly, I've been into computers since 1980. That makes me an old guy who's been around the block a few times with little patience for people who are too lazy to manage their computer properly and then complain that it's someone else's fault for their troubles. And I'm sure Apple has grown weary of my feedback submissions. Like many of you, I'm tired of being used for beta testing Apple software without being paid...

Oy, someone hasn't used a striped R100 SSD SAS array yet, think what it's like to have a seek time that is nearly impossible to measure because it's so small.

For personal reference (big hint), Forum Etiquitte (you've been reported fyi)

We all have our own areas of expertise, and should your calling in life be to tell the world how to run RAID, more power to you sweetie.

On here, it's like telling everyone what makes you qualified to talk all of this fluff about RAID/Backups is like saying you got your drivers license on a day when the DMV staff was smiling/amazing and so sunny out and others who had to wait for 4 hours on a miserably cold and rainy day don't qualify.

A Drivers License is that, it doesn't matter how the experience was when you got it, its the fact that you have one is all that matters.

You aren't the only one qualified to answer authoritatively to answer how RAID works, how backups should work, nor how one should use their computer, etc.

Alot of us in IT upgrade early to evaluate what bugs come across so that it can be fixed for everyone and generate a use-base and to see the latest and greatest technology apple has to offer so that others can enjoy it too.

Think before you reply again Roger, stay on-topic, and if you're going to be non-contributive, I will not hesitate to escalate the severity of the next report.

chattphotos wrote:

Alot of us in IT upgrade early to evaluate what bugs come across so that it can be fixed for everyone and generate a use-base and to see the latest and greatest technology apple has to offer so that others can enjoy it too.

Your egalitarian testing efforts deserve a bowing emoticon but I'm afraid there isn't one.

I did beta testing for companies in the 80's and 90's and I won't do it now unless I'm paid to do it. Do you install the latest and greatest from Apple on a production machine? I didn't think so.

There are many lessons to learn with this latest disk problem. And, like everything else in life, I certainly don't have all the answers - we all have an opinion. I've been successful with computers mainly because I KISS everything I can. I suspect many people running RAID really don't need it. How what I've written is off-topic is beyond me. Can you imagine the nonsense Apple support has to put up with? Users seem to be dumb and dumber with each passing day.

And may I suggest you stop taking what I say personally. My style is direct and to the point. How you process it is not my problem.

blindeyetom wrote:

Rogerout, Thanks for the life lesson mate. I'll say it again, I take full responsibility for not diligently backing up my work.

I know you do. You're ok, mate - thank you for your grace. Your experience with this whole debacle (gee, it sounds a lot like healthcare.gov) will help you manage your data stuff better than ever. Be skeptical and act accordingly.

RogerOut wrote:

Rushing to install the initial release is not a smart thing to do and people have been warned for decades against installing a first version of anything.

Rubbish. I have always installed first releases. Never had an issue! If you wish to do a little research and not make assumptions,then you will find that Mountain Lion was the most downloaded OSX in history. Now Mavericks is being downloaded at five times that rate! And only a few issues cropping up. WD is totally at fault here and have admitted the fact. Other software developers who had access to the Developers releases of 10.9 have simply been too slow off the mark to update or simply can't keep up. There are a lot less problems being reported than were being reported in the 10.6 10.7 and 10.8 AFTER updates had been released.

Cheers

Pete

All of that does not in any way shape or form take away from the fact that Apple had this OS in Beta for half of this year and somehow this issue managed to get overlooked, which I cannot believe, especially as I can now see that reports of this issue occuring began as soon as the OS was released officially. That is what makes me mad, not the fact that I lost data, frustrating though that is.

Again, let me be clear, I am not blaming Apple for my lack of a complete back up, I'm blaming Apple for not informing users of this major issue as soon as it was discovered, and for missing it (if they did miss it) during Beta testing. Are you seriously telling me that during the whole Beta testing period not one person plugged in a RAID drive? I don't need a lecture on data security, I need an explanation from Apple, but thanks anyway.

Perhaps all of the people Apple selected to beta test would never install a drive manufacturer's software. I certainly wouldn't. I have never seen any bundled, consumer-device software that I would consider well-made or necessary.

I've got a couple of consumer Seagate drives and a WD in a G-Drive enclosure.

WD should have been testing their software with the Developer Previews. They are the ones who should have found the problem. They know all of their code paths. They already have test suites developed from when the created the software. They would have a much higher probability of finding a problem. However, based on the emails that have been posted, it appears to be a very odd set of circumstances.

Rogerout, the really helpful thing to do would be to engage in this forum not to bash those who you regard as dumb fools for installing the OS too early (did I mention it was an official release that had been in Beta for a while and that I tested it out on one computer first - granted perhaps not fully enough - before installing it on the other)?

I am not a computer expert, I am a photographer. I have had to learn a lot about computers 'on the job' as it were. I don't have time to read every single tech white paper, test every single system, and explore every single option before doing something. I have to work on a certain level of trust with the equipment I'm using. I get that any OS release will have some bugs - not just the first version - but this is not a minor issue, this is entire hard drives getting wiped when you plug them into a computer! Either you're not getting the point or you don't care. My issue is that I want some information on how and why this is happening and how was this missed in Beta testing (if indeed it was missed)!

Look, I do have some competence with computers, I'm not afraid of the command line, I can do a good deal of troubleshooting myself when I have problems with software and hardware, I use Mac OS, Windows OS, Linux distros, and I do my best to educate myself. But there are many many gaps in my knowledge. To say everyone should know this stuff as if it's the most basic, simple accesible stuff in the world is nonsense.

I teach photography, including digital workflow and a lot of people are really not at all tech savvy. I don't stand around going 'How can you not know that?' I help them find ways to educate themselves and give them what advice I can. Perhaps if you want to engage in this forum you could contibute something positive. You suggest sharing how you go about organising your archives and backups, well, then I'm sure that would help a lot more people than running around here basically telling us all how stupid and foolish we are. So please, go ahead and share your knowledge. That would actually be helpful.

petermac87 wrote:

RogerOut wrote:

Rushing to install the initial release is not a smart thing to do and people have been warned for decades against installing a first version of anything.

Rubbish. I have always installed first releases. Never had an issue!

So John Donne was wrong. Who wudda thought.

lindeyetom suggest sharing how you go about organising your archives and backups,

http://mac-recovery.blogspot.com/2010/05/hfs-file-system-corruption-and-recover y.html

HFS+ File System Corruption and Recovery

Mac OS X has a number file types like HFS, HFS+, and HFSX, among all HFS+ is the improved version of Mac OS Standard, HFS. HFS Plus volumes are comprised of different metadata structure information like Volume Header, Catalog File, and Allocation File etc., defined on their various sectors. Volume Header is the replacement of Master Directory Block of HFS volumes and stores volume metadata.

But due to corruption or inconsistencies in one or more metadata information, HFS+ volumes may get damaged. In such cases, data gets inaccessible and hence users may require HFS Data Recovery tools to recover (if data backup is unavailable, incomplete or damaged). As a scenario, when Mac OS X users attempt to boot the system or access one of the HFS Plus partition, an error is encountered:

“HFS+ partition Error”

This error is generally observed on dual-boot systems, more often with GRUB. System fails to boot when the affected volume is startup volume.

To solve this partition error, users can follow up given solutions:

User can use fsck and Disk Utility to repair the damaged volume

If GRUB is creating issue, user can check for its correct installation

If problem persists, partitioning scheme can be the concern. HFS Plus partitions use APM (Apple Partition Map) as their partitioning scheme. Particularly, incorrect starting sector number (odd number) of partition can create such errors.

Thus, it is required to repartition the disk and restore data from recent backup. If data backup is unavailable or incomplete, HFS Recovery applications come as rescue to recover lost information.

These applications search the affected drive for lost data and restore it securely. Mac Recovery software are the specialized tools to scan the drives and recover lost information. These applications make file system and operating system level scanning. Upon finding lost files, these solutions recover them.

Most of these applications come with interactive user interface, enriched with graphic tools and options. Hence, irrespective of any level of technical background, users can use them quite easily. These software products are safe to be used because of read-only design they possess.

HFS (Mac OSX ext. journ.) Data Recovery

http://www.macintosh-data-recovery.com/hfs-data-recovery.php

I was one of those "fools" or noobs that installed the WD that shipping with the MyBook drive I bought at Costco. I tried to use it in OS 10.8x and had nothing but flakey behavior from both the apps and drive. Finally this summer I uninstalled the WD, OWC and LaCie apps and decided to stick with Apple's Disk Utility and Carbon Copy Cloner. I had no clue what I was doing but felt like all those drive management apps were poorly designed and implemented. So I dogded a big bullet because I'm one of the few responders on this forum that upgraded to 10.9 without a single drive problem, and my OWC, LaCie and G-Drive have been humming along 24/7 for two weeks now.

As for blame, I have to point a big finger at WD. Afterall, we can't expect Apple to test all 3rd party software and hardware for compatibility. That would be an endless and nearly impossible task. It's the responsibility of the developers to test their apps with new OS updates and update as needed. I have lots of "legacy" audio apps, Office 2008 and CS5 and every single one worked perfectly after the update. Even Quicken 2007 works! I suspect WD took a programing shortcut and their apps/drives went haywire...

Gochugogi wrote:

As for blame, I have to point a big finger at WD. Afterall, we can't expect Apple to test all 3rd party software and hardware for compatibility.

I agree with you on this issue. With the best of intentions, WD ships their drives with software to help people have a good experience with their products. Instead, it gets in the way. WD is another company that really doesn't understand what people really want and need. KISS works with computers. But people don't seem to want KISS. They want everything on a silver platter.

Then again consumers are finiky. As a company, one day you're the windshield, the next you're the bug.