Does the new Macbook Pro 15" (late 2013) supports 4K via Thunderbolt/Displayport?

Guys, I've finally pieced together something about the 30/60 Hz problem that many of you probably already knew: the reason for the MST hack is on the monitor's side! This also explains why a Macbook Pro can support two 2,560 monitors @ 60Hz but not one 4K monitor at 60Hz.

The current generation of 4K monitors weren't able to update every chip in their pipelines to support the bandwidth needed to support 60Hz 4K, so THEY created the MST hack solution. I noticed in Tom's Hardware review of the ASUS 4K monitor that, even with the MST hack supporting 60Hz, the actual screen response was only 40 Hz. Which gives Apple even less reason to support it - it's tied to a few hardware models.

I'm assuming this is the same reason Displayport 1.3 introduced that god-awful compression mode where your color comes through at 1,920x1,080 resolution -> it's not (as they advertise) so you don't have to buy a new $30 HDMI cable to go with your new $3,000 monitor - it's so the monitor manufacturers don't have to update all their components to support higher bandwidth.

I sincerely hope that branding and terminology will become much more explicit in the future, and people will use some term like "FULL-4K" to indicate that you are really actually getting that.

I've tried to follow the conversation and maybe I'm not understanding something, but I have the sharp 4k monitor and my macbook pro (15" latest edition) seems to drive it adequetly (through the display port or hdmi), the problem for me and what makes it unusable is that for some reason browser pages load very slowly while surfing the internet. Surfing the internet is 5X slower on the sharp monitor than it is on my macbook pro. I run a lot of other apps (terminal/coding type) and they seem to load/refresh fine, its just the internet is slow. I've been keeping the macbook monitor open to run the browser and doing everything else on the external monitor. It didn't do this on the apple hd monitors. Does anyone know why the internet is slow on the 4k monitor? Any solution?

UPDATE:

After doing some tests I found that the internet using firefox funtions normally. It is only chrome that is running slow over the 4k monitor/macbook pro using 3840 X 2160 reosolution at 30 Hertz refresh rate. I really depend on chrome though, does anyone know why this is or a possible solution?

What do "1 chip" and "2 chip" refer to in the attached photo?

Whether it's the version of Haswell that's two chips in a multi chip module (MCM) or not. However, even the single chip version seems capable of advanced graphics, so that doesn't tell you much. But if it's a quad core chip, it's definitely two chips in a package:

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/5078/184629v689919ice34j9c3_575px.jpeg

Given that eDP is embedded displayport, they must be imagining some really high end tablets. 🙂

jimmal2nw wrote:

I've tried to follow the conversation and maybe I'm not understanding something, but I have the sharp 4k monitor and my macbook pro (15" latest edition) seems to drive it adequetly

That is extremely good news. I haven't seen this myself, but everyone posting on using 30 Hz 4K displays reports that they can't be productive because they can't see the mouse when it moves and there's issues with Window tearing, etc. IMO, 30 Hz in theory should be usable if there's no visible flicker.

jdiamond wrote:

Whether it's the version of Haswell that's two chips in a multi chip module (MCM) or not. However, even the single chip version seems capable of advanced graphics, so that doesn't tell you much. But if it's a quad core chip, it's definitely two chips in a package:

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/5078/184629v689919ice34j9c3_575px.jpeg

Given that eDP is embedded displayport, they must be imagining some really high end tablets. 🙂

Thank you. I gather even the lowest configured 13-inch rMBP's processor, i.e. i5 4258U, is a multi chip processor. Therefore, in light of the info available in the photo I attached in my previous post, this processor is capable of 4k @ 60Hz via DP regardless of display number.

IMO this is significant in respect of Iris -standard-. Because according to a specs sheet previously posted in this thread, Iris is capable of outputting 4k only @ 30Hz.

Now it seems that there are two pieces of contradictory information. Do you agree?

I agree it does seem contradictory. But on the other hand, nothing would stop Intel from creating variations on the chips that might limit some of their abilities, even if it's artifical. So it's hard to say which statement would hold more weight.

But if someone tries it on a low end Macbook Pro, that would seem to be the most definitive answer. 🙂

I definetely agree. I asked a forumite in another thread who owns a 13inch Haswell rMBP to try on Windows because it is likely he might have tried only on Mavericks:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5648156?answerId=24404984022#24404984022

BTW, in that thread another forumite refers to a link regarding the specifications of i5-4250U and i3-4010U according to which those processors are capable of 4k @60 Hz but with 24-bit color depth. As a matter of fact says he believes the "i5 in the 13" Retina MacBook Pro can support 4k@60Hz at 24 bpp but not 32 bpp".

This might be true but those processors include HD 5000 and 4400 GPUs respectively, whereas the i5s in the Haswell 13'' rMBPs include a better GPU, namely HD 5100, a.k.a Iris. I would assume, if they those lower GPUs can output 4k@60Hz, then Iris should be able to do so, but it may not do it nonetheless. Regarding the color depth I have no idea.

So the issues pertaining to Iris's capability of max. resolution that can be output are twofold:

1) What is the max. refresh rate? 30Hz vs 60Hz?

2) What is the color depth? 24 vs 32-bit?

Could someone who owns a 13'' Haswell rMBP running Windows and have access to a 4k with 60 Hz monitor please answer these questions?

(As a side note, according to the following link Iris Pro is capable of 4k @ 60Hz with 32-bit. We know 60 Hz is possible with Nvidia 750M based on the confirmations of the people in this thread, but I am not sure about the color depth. http://9to5mac.com/2013/12/23/new-retina-macbook-pros-can-drive-4k-displays-at-6 0hz-when-running-windows-mac-os-needs-new-drivers/)

there seems to be a new released driver for mac pros from nvidia:

http://www.nvidia.com/download/driverResults.aspx/73628/

unfortunately not for macbooks?

also no infos on MST Support yet...

I'm just going to leave two random links here:

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/06/apple-seeds-first-os-x-10-9-3-build-to-devel opers/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/x5aol4fe6vjzcqq/2014-03-06%2017.56.32.jpg

kogir wrote:

I'm just going to leave two random links here:

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/06/apple-seeds-first-os-x-10-9-3-build-to-devel opers/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/x5aol4fe6vjzcqq/2014-03-06%2017.56.32.jpg

Very nice.

Was this performed using a MacBook Pro 15" (late 2013) -- which is the original them of this thread (since hijacked by everyone) -- or was this on some other machine?

Any special magic needed to achieve this, or did it "just work"?

Yes, according to:

http://arstechnica.com/apple/2014/03/first-os-x-10-9-3-beta-comes-with-improved- 4k-display-support/

http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/03/07/apple-enables-pixel-doubled-retina-mod e-for-4k-monitors-in-os-x-1093

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/07/os-x-10-9-3-retina-option-4k-displays/

The brand new just released MacOSX 10.9.3 Beta allows for 4K60Hz on 2013 Macbook Pro's! Whether or not it's just the 15 inch or it also includes the 13 inch model I'm not 100% sure yet but this looks like great news so far.

Thanks for the links guys. I've gone through all of them and it seems the models of the Haswell rMBP subjected to this test have not been indicated in those links.

Confirmations from Haswell rMBP owners who happen to have 4k 60Hz monitors would be greatly appreciated. Please kindly indicate which particular Haswell rMBP you own.

Oh finally!!! I hope we will see a new 4k Thunderbolt Display soon with usb 3.0 ports