Q: Does the new Macbook Pro 15" (late 2013) supports 4K via Thunderbolt/Displayport?

I could live with the 30Hz limitation (it's not that bad for what I use the Macbook for), but I really would love to have the ability to select a 1920x1080 HiDPI mode for the UP2414Q.

Aron77, this link may help you http://www.mactrast.com/2013/01/how-to-enable-retina-graphics-on-a-non-retina-ma c/

Unfortunately I can't currently test it myself but I hope it works for you.

Thanks, but unfortunately it doesn't work. SwitchResX doesn't help either.

jdiamond wrote:

Note that this hack would only benefit the highest end late 2013 Macbook Pros - the ones with the the 750 - and I can't imagine there's a lot of volume on sales of that model. It may well be that NVIDIA simply declined to spend the effort needed to make a short-term Maverick MST hack solution for 4K@60Hz for such a small volume - and this might even be the reason Apple went with AMD/ATI GPUs on the Mac Pro - because they were willing to do the Hack. 

 

 

I don't see any reason why your statements are not applicable to low-end late 2013 rMBPs, including the 13-inch ones using Iris. If, with the word "hack" you are referring to a firmware/driver update, then your statements are equally true for Intel's Iris and Iris Pro cards. Please see my question and NiqueXyZ's response on page 7 of this thread in this regard. In short he agrees that NVIDIA would not deplete its resources to release new drivers, as supported from NVIDIA's previous stance on GTX680. However he seems to be surprised as to why Intel does not release drivers for Iris and Iris Pro. In any case, he seems to agree with me that it is doable to release drivers for not only NVIDIA 750M, but also Iris Pro and even Iris.

I am now looking from another perspective, i.e. not doability, but whether if releasing any or some of these drivers would cause problems on the part of Apple. That is to say, if 4K at 60Hz is going to be output on late 2013 rMBPs running on Mavericks, then there are potential alternatives needed to be evaluated:

1) Both Intel and NVIDIA may release drivers, thereby making all late 2013 rMBPs outputting 4k @ 60Hz on Mavericks: best option for both Apple and its customers, would not cause any problems.

2) Only NVIDIA may release drivers: this alternative will make low-end 15-inch and 13-inch users having Intel Iris and Iris Pro cards make unhappy, but this option might be acceptalbe to some extent. Both Apple and its customers may think that only the customers paying for the best card can benefit from 4K @ 60 Hz on Mavericks. Nonetheless, Apple might not like this option.

3) Intel may release drivers for both Iris and Iris Pro, and NVIDIA may not release any drivers: This option would make high-end 15-inch users furious and, IMO, Apple would not allow this alternative.

4) NVIDIA may release drivers and Intel may release drivers for Iris Pro only: This alternative will upset 13-inch owners only. This alternative might be acceptable to some extent. Both Apple and its customers may think that only the customers paying for the mid-end and high-end cards can benefit from 4K @ 60 Hz on Mavericks. Nonetheless, Apple might not like this option.

5) NVIDIA may release drivers and Intel may release drivers for Iris only: Providing a feature for low- and high-end cards but not for mid-end card does not makes sense. This alternative would make low-end 15-inch owners furious and, IMO, Apple would not allow this alternative.

6) Intel may release drivers for Iris only, and NVIDIA may not release any drivers: Providing a feature for only low-end card and not for upper segment cards does not makes sense. This alternative would make all 15-inch owners furious and, IMO, Apple would not allow this alternative.

As seen, none of the options without NVIDIA releasing drivers are acceptable to Apple. Hence, if NVIDIA will not be allocatinf resources for releasing new drivers for Mavericks (as suggested by you and NiqueXyZ) then we will never see 4k @ 60 Hz output on Mavericks.

mg428 wrote:

I don't see any reason why your statements are not applicable to low-end late 2013 rMBPs, including the 13-inch ones using Iris.

According to http://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/quick-reference-guide-to-intel-processo r-graphics only Intel 5200 (Iris Pro) is cappable of 3840x2160@60Hz

And Intel 5200 Graphics is only available on Intel's Core i7 H-Processors

i am pretty sure that somebody already had a 13" Iris Standard Retina MBP running 4k@60Hz. You can also run two 2560x1440 displays daisy chained plus the retina display on the MBP, so why shouldnt it be able to handle one 4k display instead.

Also i dont believe that apple cares so much about Intel or Nvidia releasing drivers both or only one of them. I actually have a feeling that the notebook markets is loosing weight every day, money is made with tablets and smartphones nowadays. Who cares about a handful of nerds trying to run the first 4k dsiplay via a MST hack.

@Jonniecache "Who cares?" Content makers for one. You do realize that everything that we use on tablets has been created by desktop machines.

Sorry, I just meant because NVIDIA's state of drivers only applies to the laptops with NVIDIA GPUs.  Intel appears to be even farther behind NVIDIA in MST 60Hz support, but it could be possible.  But the other post made a great point - Apple probably would wait until BOTH drivers were capable rather than alienate some of the Macbook Pro line...

I completely agree that if you can do two 2,560 monitors you should be able to do one 4K monitor, and the DisplayPort 1.2 HBR protocol allows it, so I don't understand why MST is required - and that's what needs the special drivers.  Maybe someone with behind the scenes GPU knowledge could explain why MST is needed?

I agree that while laptops are < 10% of revenue, you NEED them - they can't disappear.  And a 2560 display barely has the resolution to display an iPad app -> if a 13" iPad Pro arrives with an even higher desktop resolution, then we'll really need 4K to write apps for them.   I think this is most significant, because it means people inside Apple might start demanding 4K.

IMO 30 Hz shouldn't be so bad, but most people report that they can't see the cursor move, so maybe there's driver issues slowing even 30 Hz down?

jksdfjk wrote:

 

mg428 wrote:

I don't see any reason why your statements are not applicable to low-end late 2013 rMBPs, including the 13-inch ones using Iris.

 

According to http://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/quick-reference-guide-to-intel-processo r-graphics only Intel 5200 (Iris Pro) is cappable of 3840x2160@60Hz

 

And Intel 5200 Graphics is only available on Intel's Core i7 H-Processors

Thanks for pointing this out!

johnniecache wrote:

 

i am pretty sure that somebody already had a 13" Iris Standard Retina MBP running 4k@60Hz. You can also run two 2560x1440 displays daisy chained plus the retina display on the MBP, so why shouldnt it be able to handle one 4k display instead.

 

I don't know how this happens but according to the specs sheet it should not. When you say "pretty sure", are you 100% sure? Would you mind finding and referencing your source?

jdiamond wrote:

 

But the other post made a great point - Apple probably would wait until BOTH drivers were capable rather than alienate some of the Macbook Pro line...

If it turns out that Iris (Standard) cannot output 4k@60Hz (which seems to be the case according to the specs), then Apple would likely wait for a new line of rMBP where all configurations within are capable of outputting 4k@60Hz so that Apple 1) would not alinenate some of its current Haswell rMBP customers; and 2) can market such new line as if it has gained a brand new feature.

mg428 wrote:

 

johnniecache wrote:

 

i am pretty sure that somebody already had a 13" Iris Standard Retina MBP running 4k@60Hz. You can also run two 2560x1440 displays daisy chained plus the retina display on the MBP, so why shouldnt it be able to handle one 4k display instead.

 

I don't know how this happens but according to the specs sheet it should not. When you say "pretty sure", are you 100% sure? Would you mind finding and referencing your source?

I was just thinking if so far any forumite who owns a 13-inch Haswell rMBP (which comes with Iris) has confirmed he can output 4k@60 Hz when running Windows? If so, then it would confirm Iris is also capable of such output, contrary to what the specs sheet says.

mg428 wrote:

 

I was just thinking if so far any forumite who owns a 13-inch Haswell rMBP (which comes with Iris) has confirmed he can output 4k@60 Hz when running Windows? If so, then it would confirm Iris is also capable of such output, contrary to what the specs sheet says.

Everything i found was about an nvidia equipped 15" macbook.

According to Intels Reference Guide linked above, 4k@60 Hz is only available on the Iris Pro 5200, that is only available in i7 quad-core models. Macbook Pro 13" hast Intel Iris 5100 Graphics.

jksdfjk wrote:

 

Everything i found was about an nvidia equipped 15" macbook.

 

According to Intels Reference Guide linked above, 4k@60 Hz is only available on the Iris Pro 5200, that is only available in i7 quad-core models. Macbook Pro 13" hast Intel Iris 5100 Graphics.

Fair enough. But another forumite, johnniecache, says he is "pretty sure that somebody already had a 13" Iris Standard Retina MBP running 4k@60Hz", hence this might be true despite the specs sheet.

NiqueXyZ wrote:

 

Intel Demo'd Iris and yes, it can do 4K @ 60Hz.

Anand Tech did an article about it, IIRC.

NiqueXyZ,

I believe your post is the only one in this thread indicating that Iris -standard- can do 4k @ 60Hz.

Would you mind referring to a source? Because, according to Intel's specs sheet, such output is not possible for Iris, but for Iris Pro.

Please see the below link in this regard:

http://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/quick-reference-guide-to-intel-processo r-graphics

Thanks!