Previous 1 2 3 4 Next 54 Replies Latest reply: Jul 1, 2015 8:36 PM by Jon Walker Go to original post Branched to a new discussion.
  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,155 points)

    Clearly I can still view my movies in different ways, but that doesn't quell my frustration after the Mavericks upgrade.

    To each his (or her) own. As previously noted, no matter what Apple does, someone is going to compain. I personally have (as of this writing) 1358 movies and 124 TV shows containing from a minimum of 1 to a maximum of 26 seasons of from 3 to 39 individual season episodes stored on a single iTunes managed 12 TB RAID. Since these files (collected over the last eight years) are all compatible with QL, QT X, QT 7, iTunes, and 720p IOS mobile devices, I had virtually none of the Maverics associated problems of which you (and others) currently complain. Clearly, if Mavericks is so frustrating for you, then you should probably revert to an older operating system as many other users (including myself but for a system corruption reason) have done.

     

     

    While I respect the need to keep current, the Finder's Quick Look feature is hobbled and of little use to me under Mavericks, and nothing you wrote makes me believe that I will be able to use the feature for the large legacy of movies I have on my hard drive.

    Since QL is limited to the preview of single file at time and I am in the habit of previewing and/or comparing multiple files simultaneously, this feature is of little or no use to me whereas I can scan, preview and/or compare multiple files simultaneously using the mutithreaded capbilities of the QT 7 player.

     

     

    In particular, your statement "(I.e., if you wish to continue viewing legacy files, then download and use the QT 7 (v7.6.6) media player which is still available from Apple for use on QT X capable systems and which still works with both legacy and third-party codecs even under Mavericks.)" reminds me that Apple has indeed taken something away from me, and complicated my and other customer's lives because of the changes in Mavericks.

    I fail to understand your logic here. Mavericks employs a totally new (i.e., different) support structure for QT X. To me your logic is the equivalent of saying, "I bought a new car with a diesel engine in addition to my old gasoline powered car and now have lost the ability to run the new vehicle on gasoline." Which, in fact, is a capability the new vehicle never had and completely overlooks the fact that the older car still runs on gasoline.

     

     

    Most of the videos I'm viewing are from a GE camera that generated Quicktime Movies, I had no choice in the codec they chose.

    Unfortunately, as always, it is difficult to make any definitive comment here without actually knowing what specific codecs are involved. A quick look at a number of sample GE cameras seems to indicate that most current models employ either MPEG-4 AVC (H.264) or Motion JPEG video in the MOV file container—both of which should remain QT X and QT 7 compatible. However, under Mavericks, an unexpected audio compression format can trigger QT X v10.3 to convert the file whether the video track is converted or is simply "passed through" in its current compression format. (Strangely enough MJPEG video with Integer audio AVI files remain QT X v10.3 player and QL compatible under Mavericks.)

     

     

    In any event, as previously stated, if QT X and QL compatibility is most important to your workflow, then your best option would be to revert to a previous OS like Mountain Lion. If you can live without QL and prefer the Mavericks OS for everything else, then use an alternative player for your GE camera videos and/or QT 7 for Apple proprietary (and/or "legacy") codecs no longer supported by the QT X v10.3 player.

     

    SJAUG.png

  • zampino Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Honestly I'm not trying to argue with you, my point in participating in this thread is that Mavericks has taken something simple away from the OS, and it seems like Apple should be able to put it back.  Your engine analogy doesn't really apply here, the old "car" had an engine that would take me on  roads in my neighborhood, and the new car should too.  And seriously, I would know up front that my new car ran on diesel and not gas, but I had no way of knowing that Apple would take away this codec from Quick Look.

     

    Telling me to go back to Mountain Lion isn't an option and is quite a snitty comment -  there's no reason for me to become stuck in time because of this small problem.  I'm getting around it with VLC, but Apple has failed to support the codecs it once knew how to display in Quick Look, it's really that simple.   I'm still waiting for Apple to put back scroll arrows, but I didn't stay on Leopard because of that poor choice on Apple's part.

  • Got2BMac Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)

    Apple has crippled a previously wonderful feature of the OSX.  After the “Downgrade” to Mavericks, Quicklook does NOT WORK for a majority of my video files. I have been a loyal Mac user for twenty years.  I have thousands of videos of various formats.  I previously used Quicklook extensively and its loss is a tremendous downgrade to my workflow and an extreme disservice to many. 

     

    Other threads (https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5471254?start=60&tstart=0 ) have talked about numerous potential fixes and I have tried them all.  (ProApps QuickTime Codecs, Perian, removed cashes, reinstalled OSX, etc.) and nothing works.  I have spent hours and hours researching and trying everything I can find to no avail. The typically wonderful Applecare was useless and acted like I was the only person in the world with this unique problem.  They had me do a full reinstall of Mavericks.  More hours wasted.

     

    “Converting” hundreds of hours of existing files with QuickTime Player is not an option as it takes an extremely long time to convert each file and the file sizes increase by four to five times.  It would take years to convert all of my files.

     

    Make whatever technical or visionary excuses you wish, but Apple has done an extreme disservice to many, many users and completely abandoned the customer experience and service they were once known for.  You can sure bet Steve Jobs would never have allowed this to happen.  Apple are you listening and do you still give a darn?  (Yes I have submitted the issue to Apple.)  Please step up to correct this complete loss of functionality in Mavericks.

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,155 points)

    It's useless to try to explain what is going on here because most users simply don't care. They only want Apple to stop the currect process of modernizing and streamlining this rewritten version of Apple's multimedia software which has been in planning for 9-10 years and actually, based on observed facts, been in the emplementation stage for at least 5 years.

     

     

    Apple has crippled a previously wonderful feature of the OSX.  After the “Downgrade” to Mavericks, Quicklook does NOT WORK for a majority of my video files. I have been a loyal Mac user for twenty years.  I have thousands of videos of various formats.  I previously used Quicklook extensively and its loss is a tremendous downgrade to my workflow and an extreme disservice to many.

    If you must access to the QL feature, there are only two options for use:

     

    1) Use a file type/compression format combination that is supported by Mavericks' AVFoundation which contols what can be played in the QT X Player and QL

     

    or

     

    2) Revert to an older Mac OS X version under which the QL feature was supported by the older 32-bit QT embedded structure.

     

    The main problem here is that Apple has streamlined the new QT X support by making the AVFoudation, Modernizer, and Convert structures a global part of the Mavericks OS (e.g., conversion routines are now accessible at the Finder level) rather than part of the individual QT based applications or unified QT structure embedded in the OS. Further, Apple is rapidly moving toward the use of a single, multipurpose natively supported MPEG-4 AVC (H.264) codec which can be used for everything from cellphone video conferencing to UHD (4K and 8K Ultra-High Definition) video and a single, natively supported intermediate video editing format (ProRes). Thus, anyone who ignored this obvious "handwriting on the wall" in late 2005 with the adoption/introduction of H.264 media content as the "preferred" default video format for the 5th Generation iPod, probably continued to ignore this trend in the various Mac OS X revisions and with the iPod Touch, iPhone, iPad, and TV devices since that time. Basically, the latest Mavericks system has reached a point where QL/QT X no longer supports most third-party or legacy codecs and even some Apple proprietary codecs for playback expecting users to rely on QT 7 and its 32-bit open architecture/legacy support routines for continued compatibility (while it lasts).

     

     

    Other threads (https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5471254?start=60&tstart=0 ) have talked about numerous potential fixes and I have tried them all.  (ProApps QuickTime Codecs, Perian, removed cashes, reinstalled OSX, etc.) and nothing works.  I have spent hours and hours researching and trying everything I can find to no avail. The typically wonderful Applecare was useless and acted like I was the only person in the world with this unique problem.  They had me do a full reinstall of Mavericks.  More hours wasted.

    As stated above, your options are clear. If neither option is acceptable, then you will have to live with the consequences unless or until Apple decides to change the current direction of QT X product development—which I doubt is going to happen any time in the near future. As to Applecare, I am surprised they could not be more helpful since this problem is an obvious consequence of the software changes made as part of the Mavericks release. Fortunately, these problems only affect users who have not adopted the H.264 video codec for default use. For instance, users who rely on iTunes multimedia content on a regular basis and/or users who use the default export options of the various Mac OS X versions would likely not be affected by your problem. Thus, it is possible that the issue is less widespread than you think—even though I find this somewhat hard to believe.

     

     

    “Converting” hundreds of hours of existing files with QuickTime Player is not an option as it takes an extremely long time to convert each file and the file sizes increase by four to five times.  It would take years to convert all of my files.

    While I agree the conversion process can be time consuming, I do not find it a problem to periodically convert or reconvert thousands of hours of content as may be needed to increase file resolution and/or decrease file storage space. For me it is merely a matter of priorities and a willingness to expend the effort. However, many users have stated the time and effort required to do this is more than they are willing to invest. Thus, the question of whether or not to convert files is one of personal preference and is up to the individual user. As to resulting file size, you may have a workflow problem here. Any increase in relative file size of your content is determined by the compression formats and relative data rates used for the source and output files. Without more information, it would be impossible to determine if your results are reasonable or a matter a proorly chosen workflow. (My results typically result in a 50% to 75% drop in file size when converting DVD sourced content to SD H.264/AAC/AC3/Chaptered M4V files and an 80% to 90% reduction in file sized when converting BD content to 720p HD H.264/AAC/AC3/Chaptered M4V files using custom anamorphic CABAC Main Profile, Level 3.1 conversion settings.) As to taking thousands of years to perform conversions, that would depend on the settings, workflow, and platform used. (I normally batch process multiple files overnight as I sleep using the settings referenced above on a relatively recent platform and can usually manage to convert up to 6-8 movies or 1-2 seasons of TV shows per night depending on display resolution.)

     

     

    Make whatever technical or visionary excuses you wish, but Apple has done an extreme disservice to many, many users and completely abandoned the customer experience and service they were once known for.  You can sure bet Steve Jobs would never have allowed this to happen.  Apple are you listening and do you still give a darn?  (Yes I have submitted the issue to Apple.)  Please step up to correct this complete loss of functionality in Mavericks.

    I assume the comments above were prompted by your frustrations since you state you have already made your disatisfaction known to Apple. Further, I'm not trying to make "technical or visionary excuses" here for Apple by responding. I would, however, point out that the development direction taken by Apple has roots pre-dating the release of QT 7 and likely implies that Jobs was aware of/had a hand in the "decision making process." (Whether or not his untimely demise hastened this process would be another matter as I personally feel the release of Mavericks may have been somewhat premature.) Unfortunately, dispite the "wishful thinking" and/or optimism of other posters, I doubt the current momentum of the QT X "modernization" program can/will be easily/quickly halted/made to change/reverse its direction. In any case, at the risk of again having my workaround being called "snitty," this is my "2¢."

     

    SJAUG.png

  • maxblast Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    *sigh*

  • Got2BMac Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)

    Thanks Jon. As to the conversion process, any advise would be appreciated as I just don't know how to start.  I normally use QT Pro-7, but to convert I simply opened in Mavericks default QT Player and saved the open file.  The results were files 4 to 5 time larger and “Movie Inspector Window” indicates they were converted to:

     

    AAC, Stereo (L R), 24.000 kHz

    1. H.264, 624 × 416, Millions

     

    QT Player does not seem to have a “Preferences” setting that I can find, only the ability to “Export”.

     

    Could you please briefly describe how to batch process multiple files to the settings you mentioned? What application do you use?

     

    Thanks!

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,155 points)

    As to the conversion process, any advise would be appreciated as I just don't know how to start.  I normally use QT Pro-7, but to convert I simply opened in Mavericks default QT Player and saved the open file.  The results were files 4 to 5 time larger and “Movie Inspector Window” indicates they were converted to:

     

    AAC, Stereo (L R), 24.000 kHz

    1. H.264, 624 × 416, Millions

    Using QT 7 Pro, you can convert using either the "Movie to MPEG-4" or "Movie to QuickTime" options to create H.264/AAC MP4 or MOV files with user targeted data rates which are the key factor in controlling the size of the final output file. (I.e., limiting the output data rate per unit of time reduces the final size of the file.) However, QT 7 Pro does not have built-in "batch" processing feature but you can perform parallel conversions of multiple files simultaneously if you want. (Not something I normally recommend but it is possible to do.) Normally I would recommend using either the free MPEG Streamclip or HandBrake applications for batch processing. (My preference is HandBrake because it has the option to use the X.264 open source MPEG-4 AVC encoder which includes a complete set of "advanced" encoding options to customize the output.

     


    QT Player does not seem to have a “Preferences” setting that I can find, only the ability to “Export”.

     

    If you are referring to the QT X v10.3 player here, no it doesn't. You can, however, use the Finder level converter to create H.264/AAC files using either a high quality (larger file size) or low quality (smaller file size) setting. (I.e., you sinply select the file you wish to convert in a Finder window as use the "Context" menu to open the "Services > Convert" window. (Unfortunatelu, I am currently batch processing season 2 of Haven at this time while booted up in Mountain Lion, so I can't really capture images of this process.)

     

     

    Could you please briefly describe how to batch process multiple files to the settings you mentioned? What application do you use?

    As indicated above, I normally use the free HandBrake application for this particular workflow since it includes both "batch" processi routines and the ability to create and save custom setting preferences. Here is a description of a typical work session:

     

    1) Open the HandBrake application.


    2) Navigate to a source file you wish to convert.

     

      3) Select a conversion preference (a custom preference in my case).

     

      4) Set ecode matrix dimensions if different from base preferences.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.18.11 AM.png

    As depicted above, I am anamorphically encoding a 1920x1080 source file to a 1024x720 encode matrix for display as a 1280x720 file to conserve file storage space on an iTunes managed 12TB RAID unit. You may wish to note that the software also trims the source file automatically if letterboxed and has a manual override capability if the user needs to make additional adjustments. You can even open/live preview the settings made here in a separate window.

     

    5) I then accpt or make modifications to the chapter list if/as may be needed.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.18.51 AM.png

    In this case, the chapter markers were included in the source file and did not require any modifications (e.g., changing its name or removal).

     

    6) Next I make changes to the "advanced" settings window if needed.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.19.06 AM.png

    In this case, the settings are ones that I previously saved as a custom user preference and they do not normally require any changes as I control the final file size later by adjusting the "Quality" in the "constant quality (VBR)" encoding mode.

     

    7) In cases where I desire subtiles to added, I normally use the "burn" option to permanently burn them into the display rather than using separate subtiltle files.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.19.29 AM.png

    In this case, there are no "Forced English" subtitles to be added which are the only ones I normally use anyway if not automatically included in the main video track.

     

    8) Next I adjust the audio settings if needed.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.20.38 AM.png

    In this case, these are the settings included in my custom preference which target DTS conversion to both AAC (Active Prologic II Stereo tracks) and AC3 (6-channel surround sound) for playback on either mobile and home entertainment equipment.

     

    9) The final adjustment before adding the the conversion instructions to the "batch" list is to set the "quality" slider. A larger reference number reduces the targeted quality level and thus, reduces the total average target data rate/file size. The default setting is 20 and is usually the maximum you will ever need to use. Basically, a Main Profile @ L-3 allows data rates up to a maximum of 14 Mbps. Most good quality source files can be encoded as 720p files can be encoded with good-excellent quality in the 1.5 to 3.5 Mbps range and 1080p can normally be restrict to th 5.0 to 8.0 Mbps range. I personally use a single, universal 720p video maximum for all device syncs and streaming/fast start intrnet content because it converts reasonably fast, stores as fairly compact files, and looks reasonably good even on HDTVs in the 47-51 inch range at normal viewing distances. Unfortunately, these are perceptual assessments and users will frequently differ as to their merits. And, that is all well and good since the only thing that really matters is what YOU think or require for any given project undertaking.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.21.16 AM.png

    As you can see above. I am use a quality setting of "23" for these TV episodes since they are reasonably good quality source recordings. These settings produce files for the TV season having a total (audio + video) data rate in the 1.6 to 2.5 Mbps range and 42-43 minute episode files in the 680 to 780 MB range from source files on the order of 20 Mbps and 7-8 GBs per episode. Such results may or may not be typical for you depending on the source encodings and the specific quality setting you decide to use. I normaly make a few "test" conversions before selecting the quality setting to apply to a particular video or set of recodings from a particular source sharing similar characteristics. Even then, I sometimes later decide to reconvert a file for one reason or another.

     

    10) The last step is to add the conversion instructions to the "Batch" list. This list can be as long or as short as you wish but I normally prefer to limit entries to something in the range of 6-8 movies or 13-26 TV episodes to avoid "locking in" the computer to any particular conversion project for long periods.

    Screen Shot 2014-02-20 at 11.21.35 AM.png

    E.g., here is my batch list for season 2 of the Heaven TV show.

     

    Hope this all you need to get you started. Didn't want to provide too much information at this point but merely introduce you to the HandBrake app and the "batch" processing workflow. If you go to the HandBrake support page, you can find more "general" information. For more technical user oriented questions, you can contact me directly if needed.

  • Got2BMac Level 1 Level 1 (10 points)

    Thank you so much for the detailed directions. These were extreemly helpful.    (And after years and years of useing Mac OSX this is the first time I realized there was a Finder level converter!)

  • Jon Walker Level 6 Level 6 (18,155 points)

    Thank you so much for the detailed directions. These were extreemly helpful.

    If the suggested workflow was of use, then I am glad I could help.

     

     

    And after years and years of useing Mac OSX this is the first time I realized there was a Finder level converter!

    This is something new to Mavericks. It appears that the unified QT X embedded structure is being "broken up" into component parts embedded in the operating system. My guess is that this will make it easier for Apple and third-party software producers to access palyback, modernizing, and conversion structures for the playing, previewing, editing, and converting of files independently as may be needed as QT X based app capabilitiess continue to evolve over the next few years.

     

    SJAUG.png

  • barminski Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    This change in Mavericks is a joke.  For me it isn't a matter of converting files. I have files I cannot convert since they are Animation codec with alpha channels. I need the preview active since that is how I determine which clip to use when I am importing a file into After Effects for instance.  This is an essential part of my work flow. There is no work-around for it. And I’m not going to keep 2 versions of a file on my drive. One to look at and one to actually use.

     

    This makes my work harder not easier. It just seems that Apple does not have the interest in supporting the professional user.  The changes to FCP have forced me to Premiere. I was using Shake till they dropped it. Motion never developed into anything like AE.  And then for several years it looked doubtful if Apple would release a new Mac Pro Tower.  Of course they have now, but it’s obvious that they debated the issue.

     

    For now I’ll have to go backwards and reinstall Mt. Lion.  I teach at UCLA in the film department and will now have to recommend that we do not update our OS until this issue is resolved.

     

    I shouldn’t have to go backwards. A new operating system should make my experience better not worse. This is a huge issue in the pro user video community. Everyone I know is concerned and waiting for Apple to fix this.

  • maxblast Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    i couldn't have put it better barminski.

  • gobbo712 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I had movs I could preview with a push of my spacebar, they played smoothly in QTX AND QT7, they where showing nicely as a resizable icon in finder, I could even play/preview them in finder clicking the play button in the center of the icon. not to mention the fact that I could resizethat icon with a much advertised pinch gesture, and I could navigate "back" to where I was in finder with another much advertised three finger swipe gesture. all this in snow leopard, i.e. a long time ago. Apple has had a very strong tradition of seamless improvements during its history, the only gap in this tradition has been when jobs was kicked out of the company.

     

    Now, I must say: I wasn't really expecting something extraordinary with mavericks in my brand new MBP, but I have to admit that you guys at Apple are amazingly fast. It took you only two years to destroy Jobs work; I must acknowledge that incompetence is really a gift:

     

    with mavericks I cannot anymore:

    - pinch to zoom in finder

    - 3swipe to navigate history in finder

    - preview .mov files in finder

    - play .mov files in quicktime

    (please note that .mov is an apple format, don't try to sell me your crap on codecs, if the codec is present in the system there is no real reason for QT to convert anything, that's the whole point of having codecs)

     

    I am really excited to discover new amazing fails in mavericks, I understand that apple officials can do even better (?!) than this and surely won't see any reason to stop the damage.

     

    I suggest wrapping Jobs corpse in copper wire and bury two neodimium magnets at both sides of his grave, this structure can turn up to be an infinte source of free electrical energy.

  • Wallace Karraker Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    For me QuickTime and QuickLook were a valuable tool set that I used constantly. AV Foundation gutted that tool for no better purpose than to make videos on Apple hardware more IOS compatible. Much as Apple would like to think they are the leaders in technology they are still a small player in the computer world, we are at the mercy of codecs designed for other operating systems. I still am required to build AVI files, Animation files and Windows Media files because my clients require them, not I.

     

    AV Foundation is flawed in the same way Final Cut Pro X initially was, stripped of all of the functionality people expected to be improved on in a new release. Hopefully Apple can restore the features in AV Foundation that made QuickTime (and by extension QuickLook) so robust and easy to work with.

  • gobbo712 Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    Got my post removed, Apple is fast in doing these kind of things. Much less in giving answers.

     

    So now I would like to know, after all those "I am mac, I am PC" commercials mocking Vista and the fact that windows users were downgrading, why is it happening for osx with mavericks. the question is: why mavericks is NOT an upgrade after all and many useful features have been removed?

     

    This IS a technical question, and I would love an answer that does not look like censorship.

     

    technical Qs:


    - why pinch to zoom is not available in finder anymore?

    - why 3swipe to navigate history is not available in finder anymore?

    - why, even having the codec installed, QT and QV cannot play a .mov file anymore?

     

    to the censor, I guess you are reading these, take a moment and instead of removing posts try to answer some.

  • Wallace Karraker Level 1 Level 1 (0 points)

    I doubt the moderators of the forum are the same engineers that work on the underpinnings of the QuickTime QuickLook combination, although that would be awesome if they were.

     

    If the Quick Look problems are unbearable I'd suggest downgrading to Mountain Lion if at all possible, then wait for Mavericks to mature through a release or two. If you don't have an archved copy of the installer Mountain Lion can still be located on the online Apple Store within a browser. Search the Apple Store for product code D6377Z, it still shows a link. If you try the same search in the App Store it won't show up.

     

    If Mountain Lion truly is unavailable on the App Store you should contact Apple Customer Relations, there is a rumor that if you make a case they can provide you with a link on the Apple store to purchase a copy of Mountain Lion.