Newbie with a Motif ES8 - optimum setup with a minimalistic approach?

hi,
I'm trying to decide on the optimum setup with a
minimalistic approach!

I a newbie with the Motif ES8 and am at cross roads
deciding on the type of computer setup for my VST.

PC + Cubase vs. MAC + Logic Pro or Logic Pro
Express?

This depends on many factors.

PC: IMO has more problems to deal with (Viruses, etc.)
Cubase: Not familiar with it but you would be able
to run the Studio Manager Editors for the ES inside of
Cubase as a plugin, this could be a good thing. I have
my version of SME's working as stand alone and I dont
feel as if I am disadvanted. I still have total recall
just not inside the program. (I have a MO6)

With MAC, how far do I need to go;i.e. MACBook Pro a
must?

I have read that the new Intel Mac Minis are almost
as powerful as my PPC Dual Processor G5. :-0
So doubt it is a must.

how many USB ports (types 400 vs 800), etc?

(USB comes in 1.0 and 2.0 Firewire is 400 and 800)
With USB 2.0 as fast as Firewire 400 this is really
not too much of a factor. You probably will need
at least two USB 2.0 Ports and at least one Firewire
400. Put a POWERED USB HUB on one port and an
external Firewire drive on the other and that drive
should have at least one additional FW400 port on it.

With Logic Pro, is Express going to be sufficient for
a full soup to nuts recording and mastering given
that this is for a home studio setup though with an
idealist running it?

This is an subjective decision. What I did and would suggest
is getting Express and learn the program and if you find
it limiting then upgrade to the Pro version and you have
not lost any money. (In fact you save $0.01 over buying
Pro outright) 🙂

Hope this helps, PK

so, from your suggestions, sounds like I'd be better off with a PPC G5 but >what about G4? again my intention is to get by with the min config. Any ?>concerns re Apple's continued support on these platforms?

I would say the G4 is a cutting it a little too close. You could probably
do some things with it but Logic can be a handful at times. You definitely
do not want to be left hanging when it counts. IMO Apple is going to be supporting the PPC line for at least 3 years probably more like 5. There
are still people using OS9, these are the people that are probably sweating
a little.

I understand I'd need a high rpm HD > 7200 which would use the firewire ?>400 to connect to the computer - right?

Correct

Are you saying that the HD needs to have another firewire port?

I was saying that a good one WILL have an extra one.

why?

This way you when you plug it in to the computer, you have not lost a port.
TransInternational makes some pretty good drives. They all have the extra ports. When I bought mine three years ago all they had was firewire 400.
Now they come with 800. They look pretty sleek too.

And I'd need a powered USB HUB and what exactly is this for?

Logic Pro has a small computer chip called a Dongle, (dont ask) that plugs into a USB port for copy protection. The program will not run without it plugged in. So right off you have just lost a USB port. With so many things using USB ports you need to have a Powered Hub to give you the ability to
plug in your wireless keyboard, printer, iPod, etc and anything else that needs to access the computer. If you have a powered hub these things wont cause any problems for you system. You can get the Belkin 7 port powered
USB hub at Egghead for about 45 dollars. That is the best price I have seen for it. I paid 60 for it. :-o

can you possibly draw a flow chart here to explain the flow of sound digits >from MS to the computer please ? 🙂
e.g. MS -- via MIDI/USB/Analog (?) --> Sound Card - via Firewire --> >Computer
or are MIDI data going to the computer directly over USB and then the >sounds are going through the A/D via sound card?

Keyboard>to Midi in on the midi interface (could be USB or Firewire)
you will want to have a midi cable running out of the interface to the midi
in on the keyboard.

To get audio into and out of your machine....

I suggest you stay away from soundcards. Unless you are going to get a really good one and they are fairly expensive. You can get an all in one
audio/midi interface that will convert your sound sources ( keyboard analog out, vocals, guitars, etc) to digital and back again. This will also be less of a strain on your system than a sound card and this means fewer problems.

This is the one I am getting this week. It got a good review in Sound On Sound Magazine. It has midi in and out. Two good Focusrite Preamps.
and very good stereo imaging.



Here are the specs.
Sample rates: 44.1, 48, 88.2 and 96 kHz from internal clock.
Mic/guitar/line inputs: two, balanced XLR with switchable global +48 Volt phantom power and +13 to +60 dB gain range, balanced/unbalanced TRS quarter-inch jack line instrument with +13 to +60 dB gain and 1M(omega) impedance, or line with -10 to +36 dB gain.
Line inputs: two, balanced/unbalanced line-level TRS jack at -10dBV or +16dBu sensitivity.
Analogue outputs: six balanced/unbalanced TRS quarter-inch jack at +16dBu level, analogue level control for outputs 1/2, plus headphone output with analogue level control.
Digital I/O: S/PDIF in and out up to 24-bit/96kHz on phono coaxial, AC3 and DTS compatibility, MIDI in and out, two Firewire ports.
Dynamic range: 105dBA (analogue inputs and outputs).
RMS jitter: <250 picoseconds.
Frequency response: 20Hz to 20kHz ±0.1dB.
THD + Noise: 0.001 percent measured at 1kHz.


There are dozens of audio interfaces out there and it can be confusing unless you know what you are after. If you want more input do a search
for interface on the forum and I am sure you will get some ideas.
Happy shopping.
<br>
Duel Processor 1.8 G5,Duel 10K RPM Raptor drives, 2GB Ram Mac OS X (10.4.6) LP72,Reason,StylusRMX,Digitech,TCHelicon,BBE Sound Processors, JBL 4311 Monitors

Hi Roya,

If you're running a MacBook Pro, you don't need to get another Mac. The MBP will do fine, whether using Logic X or Pro.

If you do get another Mac, you can always use it as a node with your MBP.

David

thanks for the detailed response PK 🙂

so, the extra USB port on the HD would facilitate a
hub type interface i.e. once you hook up another\
device to the HD via USB, you're really hooked up to
the computer.. right? and so, if I get a powered USB
Hub, this wouldn't really matter.. correct?

For the most part, you have to be careful hooking
too many devices up to a computer WHEN you are trying
to do some sound work. When they say a computer
can do A BC we sometimes think that should include D.
\

As for the sound interface, I already have an
Audiophile that has midi in/out, firewire to
computer, RCA jack for i/o. I know its not the high
end stuff but I hope to do a stepwise upgrade here if
at all possible..

That actually might work, if it supports at least
16 bit 44.1 khz that is the lowest you want to go.
Ideally it should be 24 bit to take advantage of Logics
24bit environment. You might be able to run the ES8
straight into those RCA jacks if they are SPDIF and your
keyboard has the same on the back.
\

There are a bunch of people on Motifator discussion
groups that warn against Apple's lack of support for
Logic. Not sure if the concern is only regarding the
combination of Yamaha (Motif) and Apple (Logic).

I went and read that thread, here are some of my thoughts
on some of this.

Can't comment on MAC, but a dear friend of mine who is an audio engineer said >he had walked away from Logic after Apple bought them out. "Straight downhill" >I think is how he put it.

Many windows users just hate Apple and their products.
I think much of it is ignorance. They will say
Macs are junk but when I ask them why
they never have an answer or say something
that is false. It sounds like this "professional"
did not even wait to see that Logic did get better.
Apple charges 200.00 for support of it's Professional
applications. You really do not need it since there are
so many experienced Logic users here that I never had
a question go unanswered. I've noticed on those forums
the same small group of people do most of the problem
solving. I am not overly impressed with Yamaha's support.
I had my questions about my keyboard answered quicker
by those forums. So I guess both companies need work
in this area. Frankly, for recording, I think the Motif
and Logic are a Killer combination. Both have steep
learning curves but once you get up to speed I think
the results speak for themselves. The main difference
in my opinion is that the Motif is the ultimate
performance tool and Logic is the ultimate studio toolshop.

After having a Motif for over a month, I am convinced
it has a steeper learning curve than Logic take for instance
that thread on getting your keyboard to record it's own
audio output. The list of things to do each time is as long
as my arm. In case you did not read it here it is.

First thing – STORE your MIX setup and SAVE the Song to SmartMedia (or USB mass storage device) before resampling it so you have a backup. You would create a mix to balance the instruments the way you like them.

* Select a target track, then press the [INTEGRATED SAMPLING] button.

Setup the parameters for resampling:

* Press [F1] DEST
* Select a TRACK and [KEYBANK] (note) into which you will record the resampled data. You can target either an empty track or the track on which you are going to play (if you are going to play along). If all tracks are full, don't worry, you can still resample anyway.
* Press [F2] SOURCE. Set the source parameters as follows:
- Type = Sample - with this type the Integrated Sampling Sequencer will not create any NOTE-ON data in your sequencer, it will just simply add a new sample waveform to the waveform list
- Source = Resample
- Mono/Stereo = Stereo
- Next = OFF
- Frequency = 44.1k

* Press [F6] REC This will place the sampling sequencer in Standby mode. Set the TrggrMode paramter to Manual
* Press Start on the sequencer and check your levels. If too low set the REC GAIN higher +6bB or +12dB, if the level is to high (clipping- you will see a lightning bolt) lower the GAIN to -6dB or -12dB. When you have checked the levels, press STOP and return to the top of the SONG.
* Press F6 REC to start the Resample, Press [>] (play) to begin recording the resample. The Motif ES will draw the wave as it samples.
* When the song is over press [F6] STOP. The Motif ES will take a few moments to gather the data.

To create the .wav file:

* Press [FILE]
* Press [F1] CONFIG
* Press [SF1] CURRENT
* If you will be saving the resampled song to a SmartMedia Card set the Current parameter to CARD. To save to a USB device, set this parameter to USB
* Press [F2] SAVE
* Set the data TYPE field to WAV
* Cursor down and Name the wave
* (If desired, navigate to the subdirectory where you want to save the *.wav file.)
* Press [ENTER]
* The ES will ask you which TRACK and NOTE to save as a wave file. Enter the values you selected as the sample destination in the procedure above.
* Press and hold the AUDITION button to make sure your sample is there.
* Press [ENTER] and the Motif ES will export the sample as a .wav to your SmartMedia card or USB device.


Once you have configured Logic which are takes about
3 minutes (and only has to be done once)
and set up the keyboard which takes 30 seconds.
(this has to be done once for each session)
you plug your keyboard into your audio interface then

Hit Record

that is the whole list, two words.
Once it is in Logic, you have many way to edit it
and process if needed. The midi is much
easier to manipulate and there are more
ways than the ES has keys. Plus you can add to the
sounds with the internal instruments which are
as sophisticated and as high quality as the ES.
Then if your happy with it you can create MP3's
and burn Red book compliant CD's for
commercial duplication.
It really is a complete setup.


But at any rate I'm going to do some more research on

another scenario, i.e. what about MAC and Cubase? As
you may know Yamaha just acquired Cubase..

I dont think I would be the best to comment on that.
Maybe ask one of the Gurus on the unofficial
website for Cubase, The Cubinator.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist. 🙂

you've been very helpful - thanks again 🙂
cheers,
Roya

Cheers!


P.S. I agree with Dave, If you have a Macbook
Pro you dont need another computer. If you
wanta desktop whatever reasons I understand

Oh and btw, what's QWERTY?

They are the first 6 keys (top row/left to right)
on your computer keyboard