User profile for user: shaunumb
shaunumb Author
User level: Level 1
0 points

iMac (Late 2013) 27" i7 Haswell constant crashing with 32GB RAM

I have Crucial 4x 8GB DDR3L (dual voltage 1.35/1.5 v) RAM sticks and it is very unstable! If I reduce to two sticks i.e. 16GB the system is stable. I have tried them in different orders, but every time I have 32GB in, it crashes at least every couple of hours. Any order of RAM at 16GB is fine.


Have performed Apple Diagnostics + RAM memtest and nothing appears the matter.


Anyone else with ideas or experincing similar issues? I have installed Windows 7 via Bootcamp and running with VirtualBox, but the crashes were happening on the iMac just out of the box with nothing installed with the 32GB in.


Setup:

27-inch, Late 2013

Processor 3.5 GHz Intel Core i7

Graphics NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M 4096 MB

Software OS X 10.8.5 (12F45)

HDD 1TB Fusion Drive


Here's an example error log: 



Interval Since Last Panic Report:  65334 sec
Panics Since Last Report:          1
Anonymous UUID:                    9CF2ECB9-F21B-1AD0-6570-6EC17A22DE55

Sun Nov  3 10:16:52 2013
panic(cpu 0 caller 0xffffff8002ab8945): Kernel trap at 0xffffff8002ad3434, type 14=page fault, registers:
CR0: 0x000000008001003b, CR2: 0x00000000000007aa, CR3: 0x00000000056f3000, CR4: 0x00000000001606e0
RAX: 0x0000000039b59589, RBX: 0x0000000000000580, RCX: 0xffffff80030edf18, RDX: 0x0000000039b59589
RSP: 0xffffff8391f9bce0, RBP: 0xffffff8391f9bd00, RSI: 0x000004070f0f8ced, RDI: 0xffffff8003001f20
R8:  0x0000000000000001, R9:  0x00000000000003ff, R10: 0xffffffffffffffff, R11: 0x00000000ffffffff
R12: 0x0000000000000000, R13: 0xffffff837fde0600, R14: 0xffffff80030d1b00, R15: 0x0000000000000002
RFL: 0x0000000000010002, RIP: 0xffffff8002ad3434, CS:  0x0000000000000008, SS:  0x0000000000000010
Fault CR2: 0x00000000000007aa, Error code: 0x0000000000000002, Fault CPU: 0x0

Backtrace (CPU 0), Frame : Return Address
0xffffff8391f9b980 : 0xffffff8002a1d636 
0xffffff8391f9b9f0 : 0xffffff8002ab8945 
0xffffff8391f9bbc0 : 0xffffff8002acebfd 
0xffffff8391f9bbe0 : 0xffffff8002ad3434 
0xffffff8391f9bd00 : 0xffffff8002acf884 
0xffffff8391f9bd30 : 0xffffff8002abff46 
0xffffff8391f9bd50 : 0xffffff8002a2c269 
0xffffff8391f9bd70 : 0xffffff8002a42123 
0xffffff8391f9bdc0 : 0xffffff8002b3fd7c 
0xffffff8391f9be30 : 0xffffff7f838422d4 
0xffffff8391f9be50 : 0xffffff7f838423a3 
0xffffff8391f9be70 : 0xffffff7f83c134fa 
0xffffff8391f9bea0 : 0xffffff7f83c05b12 
0xffffff8391f9bef0 : 0xffffff8002e50e58 
0xffffff8391f9bf30 : 0xffffff8002e4f95a 
0xffffff8391f9bf80 : 0xffffff8002e4fa89 
0xffffff8391f9bfb0 : 0xffffff8002ab3257 
      Kernel Extensions in backtrace:
         com.apple.iokit.IONetworkingFamily(3.0)[F02560D1-ADE6-3AD9-8D05-43CB2B7C8B87]@0xffffff7f83838000->0xffffff7f83862fff
         com.apple.iokit.AppleBCM5701Ethernet(3.6.2b4)[6E5242BB-5BD2-3BC6-ADBB-F05D02568DC0]@0xffffff7f83c04000->0xffffff7f83c3bfff
            dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOACPIFamily(1.4)[A35915E8-C1B0-3C0F-81DF-5515BC9002FC]@0xffffff7f83b98000
            dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily(2.8)[6C1D646D-7E5E-3D7F-A557-2CBA398FF878]@0xffffff7f8308e000
            dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOEthernetAVBController(1.0.2b1)[4CE25B46-E77B-3CCC-939A-DD10DA6EBE97]@0xffffff7f83bfd000
            dependency: com.apple.iokit.IONetworkingFamily(3.0)[F02560D1-ADE6-3AD9-8D05-43CB2B7C8B87]@0xffffff7f83838000

BSD process name corresponding to current thread: kernel_task

Mac OS version:
12F45

Kernel version:
Darwin Kernel Version 12.5.0: Sun Sep 29 13:33:47 PDT 2013; root:xnu-2050.48.12~1/RELEASE_X86_64
Kernel UUID: EA38B02E-2B88-309F-BA68-1DE29F605DD8
Kernel slide:     0x0000000002800000
Kernel text base: 0xffffff8002a00000
System model name: iMac14,2 (Mac-27ADBB7B4CEE8E61)

System uptime in nanoseconds: 4427395803894
last loaded kext at 427144044534: com.apple.filesystems.smbfs    1.8.4 (addr 0xffffff7f85097000, size 229376)
last unloaded kext at 278163156098: com.apple.iokit.IOUSBMassStorageClass    3.5.2 (addr 0xffffff7f838e1000, size 69632)
loaded kexts:
org.virtualbox.kext.VBoxNetAdp    4.3.2
org.virtualbox.kext.VBoxNetFlt    4.3.2
org.virtualbox.kext.VBoxUSB    4.3.2
org.virtualbox.kext.VBoxDrv    4.3.2
com.apple.filesystems.smbfs    1.8.4
com.apple.driver.AppleHWSensor    1.9.5d0
com.apple.filesystems.autofs    3.0
com.apple.driver.AppleBluetoothMultitouch    75.19
com.apple.driver.AudioAUUC    1.60
com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothSerialManager    4.1.7f4
com.apple.driver.AGPM    100.13.12
com.apple.driver.ApplePlatformEnabler    2.0.7d2
com.apple.driver.X86PlatformShim    1.0.0
com.apple.driver.AppleMikeyHIDDriver    124
com.apple.driver.AppleHDA    2.4.7fc4
com.apple.driver.AppleUpstreamUserClient    3.5.12
com.apple.GeForce    8.1.6
com.apple.iokit.IOUserEthernet    1.0.0d1
com.apple.driver.AppleMikeyDriver    2.4.7fc4
com.apple.driver.AppleIntelHD5000Graphics    8.1.6
com.apple.driver.AppleBacklight    170.3.5
com.apple.iokit.BroadcomBluetoothHostControllerUSBTransport    4.1.7f4
com.apple.Dont_Steal_Mac_OS_X    7.0.0
com.apple.driver.AppleSMBusPCI    1.0.11d1
com.apple.driver.AppleSMCLMU    2.0.3d0
com.apple.driver.AppleLPC    1.6.3
com.apple.driver.AppleMCCSControl    1.1.11
com.apple.driver.ApplePolicyControl    3.4.5
com.apple.driver.AppleIntelFramebufferAzul    8.1.6
com.apple.AppleFSCompression.AppleFSCompressionTypeDataless    1.0.0d1
com.apple.AppleFSCompression.AppleFSCompressionTypeZlib    1.0.0d1
com.apple.BootCache    34
com.apple.driver.AppleUSBHub    635.4.0
com.apple.driver.XsanFilter    404
com.apple.iokit.IOAHCIBlockStorage    2.3.5
com.apple.driver.AppleSDXC    1.4.3
com.apple.iokit.AppleBCM5701Ethernet    3.6.2b4
com.apple.driver.AirPort.Brcm4360    641.15.1
com.apple.driver.AppleAHCIPort    2.6.6
com.apple.driver.AppleUSBXHCI    635.4.0
com.apple.driver.AppleACPIButtons    1.8
com.apple.driver.AppleRTC    1.5
com.apple.driver.AppleHPET    1.8
com.apple.driver.AppleSMBIOS    1.9
com.apple.driver.AppleACPIEC    1.8
com.apple.driver.AppleAPIC    1.7
com.apple.nke.applicationfirewall    4.0.39
com.apple.security.quarantine    2.1
com.apple.driver.AppleBluetoothHIDKeyboard    170.2.4
com.apple.driver.AppleHIDKeyboard    170.2.4
com.apple.kext.triggers    1.0
com.apple.driver.IOBluetoothHIDDriver    4.1.7f4
com.apple.driver.AppleMultitouchDriver    237.4
com.apple.iokit.IOSerialFamily    10.0.6
com.apple.driver.DspFuncLib    2.4.7fc4
com.apple.iokit.IOAudioFamily    1.9.2fc7
com.apple.kext.OSvKernDSPLib    1.12
com.apple.nvidia.gk100hal    8.1.6
com.apple.NVDAResman    8.1.6
com.apple.iokit.IOSurface    86.0.4
com.apple.iokit.IOAcceleratorFamily2    74.15
com.apple.driver.AppleBacklightExpert    1.0.4
com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothHostControllerUSBTransport    4.1.7f4
com.apple.iokit.IOBluetoothFamily    4.1.7f4
com.apple.driver.AppleHDAController    2.4.7fc4
com.apple.iokit.IOHDAFamily    2.4.7fc4
com.apple.driver.X86PlatformPlugin    1.0.0
com.apple.driver.AppleSMC    3.1.5d4
com.apple.driver.IOPlatformPluginFamily    5.4.1d13
com.apple.driver.AppleSMBusController    1.0.11d1
com.apple.driver.AppleGraphicsControl    3.4.5
com.apple.iokit.IONDRVSupport    2.3.7
com.apple.iokit.IOGraphicsFamily    2.3.7
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltEDMSink    1.2.0
com.apple.driver.AppleUSBMergeNub    621.4.6
com.apple.iokit.IOSCSIArchitectureModelFamily    3.5.6
com.apple.driver.AppleUSBComposite    621.4.0
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltDPOutAdapter    2.5.0
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltDPInAdapter    2.5.0
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltDPAdapterFamily    2.5.0
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltPCIDownAdapter    1.3.2
com.apple.driver.CoreStorage    296.18.2
com.apple.iokit.IOUSBUserClient    630.4.4
com.apple.driver.AppleThunderboltNHI    1.9.2
com.apple.iokit.IOThunderboltFamily    2.7.7
com.apple.iokit.IOEthernetAVBController    1.0.2b1
com.apple.iokit.IO80211Family    530.5
com.apple.iokit.IONetworkingFamily    3.0
com.apple.iokit.IOAHCIFamily    2.5.1
com.apple.iokit.IOUSBFamily    635.4.0
com.apple.driver.AppleEFINVRAM    2.0
com.apple.iokit.IOHIDFamily    1.8.1
com.apple.driver.AppleEFIRuntime    2.0
com.apple.iokit.IOSMBusFamily    1.1
com.apple.security.sandbox    220.3
com.apple.kext.AppleMatch    1.0.0d1
com.apple.security.TMSafetyNet    7
com.apple.driver.DiskImages    345
com.apple.iokit.IOStorageFamily    1.8
com.apple.driver.AppleKeyStore    28.21
com.apple.driver.AppleACPIPlatform    1.8
com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily    2.8
com.apple.iokit.IOACPIFamily    1.4
com.apple.kec.corecrypto    1.0
System Profile:
Model: iMac14,2, BootROM IM142.0118.B00, 4 processors, Intel Core i7, 3.5 GHz, 16 GB, SMC 2.15f2
Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M, PCIe, 4096 MB
Memory Module: BANK 0/DIMM1, 8 GB, DDR3, 1600 MHz, 0x859B, 0x435438473353313630424D2E4D3136464444
Memory Module: BANK 1/DIMM1, 8 GB, DDR3, 1600 MHz, 0x859B, 0x435438473353313630424D2E4D3136464444
AirPort: spairport_wireless_card_type_airport_extreme (0x14E4, 0x111), Broadcom BCM43xx 1.0 (6.30.225.29.1)
Bluetooth: Version 4.1.7f4 12974, 3 service, 21 devices, 3 incoming serial ports
Network Service: Ethernet, Ethernet, en0
Network Service: Wi-Fi, AirPort, en1
Serial ATA Device: APPLE HDD WD10EZES-40UFAA0, 1 TB
Serial ATA Device: APPLE SSD SD0128F, 121.33 GB
USB Device: HD-GDU3, 0x0411  (Melco, Inc.), 0x0235, 0x15600000 / 10
USB Device: FaceTime HD Camera (Built-in), apple_vendor_id, 0x8511, 0x14700000 / 5
USB Device: BRCM20702 Hub, 0x0a5c  (Broadcom Corp.), 0x4500, 0x14800000 / 1
USB Device: Bluetooth USB Host Controller, apple_vendor_id, 0x828d, 0x14830000 / 2


Many thanks

iMac (27-inch, Late 2013), OS X Mountain Lion (10.8.5)

Posted on Nov 3, 2013 4:03 AM

Reply
207 replies
User profile for user: cdanr
cdanr
User level: Level 1
39 points

Feb 17, 2014 12:33 AM in response to ronny332

The Crucial RAM should be fine. Most people who've RMA'ed bad batches have had success with their replacements. It's actually quite close to the Elpida RAM Apple is using, since Micron makes that as well.


I've no doubt Samsung is also great quality RAM, but at least here in Japan it's also a lot more expensive. I don't even think Apple is shipping any new Macs with Samsung recently, although I could very well be wrong about that. Nowadays I am mostly seeing reports of Hynix (another Korean competitor to Samsung) and Elpida (now Micron, the same as Crucial).


The real question here is why there is such a RAM sensitivity on these Haswell iMacs to begin with. The other million dollar question is whether the problems go beyond the RAM.


Oh, and the Apple System Profiler has been able to read a serial number on every DIMM I've tried so far, from 3 different makers including the latest Crucial.

Reply
User profile for user: iRideApple
iRideApple
User level: Level 1
19 points

Feb 17, 2014 1:00 AM in response to cdanr

precisely!


cdanr

The real question here is why there is such a RAM sensitivity on these Haswell iMacs to begin with. The other million dollar question is whether the problems go beyond the RAM.


I do not know all so what to do, my Apple Kingston RAM 32GB is so so now, some kernels, but less now,but how I can say, that these problems do not make problems under the hood?


As Kernels comes its bad, but what about performace-wise what you do not see...

But what I know about computers, I just make editing...

Reply
User profile for user: AleBot
AleBot
User level: Level 1
14 points

Feb 17, 2014 1:59 AM in response to cdanr

cdanr

The real question here is why there is such a RAM sensitivity on these Haswell iMacs to begin with. The other million dollar question is whether the problems go beyond the RAM.


My ASP told me that the RAM sensitivity of Haswell iMacs seems to be due to a wrong power supply calibration of RAM modules that are declared as working at 1.35V, athough this is not their effective working voltage (this is the case of Kingstons').

I think that a firmware update addressed to a recalibration of the mac's SMC could solve the problem...

I wonder if Apple is fully aware of this problem...

Reply
User profile for user: cdanr
cdanr
User level: Level 1
39 points

Feb 18, 2014 5:06 AM in response to AleBot

AleBot wrote:

My ASP told me that the RAM sensitivity of Haswell iMacs seems to be due to a wrong power supply calibration of RAM modules that are declared as working at 1.35V, athough this is not their effective working voltage (this is the case of Kingstons').

I think that a firmware update addressed to a recalibration of the mac's SMC could solve the problem...

I wonder if Apple is fully aware of this problem...

Thanks, AleBot. This really seems to make sense. It is far too much of a coincidence that so many seemingly properly spec'd modules from so many different and respected names in the DRAM business would end up causing these sort of problems. Apple needs to address it, and as I mentioned if this latest replacement ends up with the same problems I'm going to them next. It's enough. 😠

Reply
User profile for user: cdanr
cdanr
User level: Level 1
39 points

Feb 18, 2014 5:12 AM in response to iRideApple

iRideApple wrote:


As Kernels comes its bad, but what about performace-wise what you do not see...

But what I know about computers, I just make editing...

Well, we know that we paid a lot of money and should not have to settle for anything less than entirely crash-free performance. When you are using your computer in your business, as we are, it's even more important that we have no problems.


But we definitely don't have to settle for anything. How frustrating this is!

Reply
User profile for user: lesdoit
lesdoit
User level: Level 1
60 points

Feb 19, 2014 4:28 PM in response to lesdoit

Updated 2.19.14. After yanking the 32gig of Axiom ram that MacMall installed, I bought the Kingston KTA-MB1600L/8G. No dice. The panics are less, also less dramatic. They are a kinder gentler soft fade to black kernel panic, rather than the instantaneous 'off' kernel panic of the Axiom. I even see the kernel panic screen with the different languages on half of the new Kingston RaM kernel panics. Anyhoos... I'm still in search of the cure. I'm not sure which modules to try next. JanneN123 can you tell us the brand of RAM that has solved your problem?

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User profile for user: curtfleenor
curtfleenor
User level: Level 1
4 points

Feb 19, 2014 5:12 PM in response to curtfleenor

Well I've officically entered the RMA circle of death.


After 2 more KPs and an application crash today, I called Kingston. Initially, the support guy told me there was an Apple Thunderbolt/USB update that fixed this problem. Turned out he meant 10.8.5. Once I broke the news to him that I already had this update installed they issued a warranty RMA.


I do hope that the replacements help but I have to say that I'm not very optimistic. What worries me is getting stuck in an RMA cycle and having to fight for a refund. That may not happen but I've been there before and would rather not go back.


In the meantime the original Apple 8GB is back in the system and it's stable.

Reply
User profile for user: Dmonkified
Dmonkified
User level: Level 1
0 points

Feb 19, 2014 6:01 PM in response to joeshirt

I have also purchased the 16gb (2x8Gb OWC1600DDR3S16P) from OWC and added it to the original 8gb (2x4Gb) Apple Ram and have had nothing but problems.


The specs from Mac Sales indicate these are 1.35V ram sticks but so far they crash consistently when I am doing any motion graphics editing with Adobe After Effects, Video Encoding with FCP7 in addition to many other processor intense tasks.


My iMac Specs are:

i7 3.5GHz

3TB fusion drive

24GB ram (8 apple 16 OWC)

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680MX 2048 MB


I am going to try and swap which slots the ram are in and hopefully that will solve it. If not I think I will need to exchange them with OWC.

Reply
User profile for user: cdanr
cdanr
User level: Level 1
39 points

Feb 19, 2014 9:11 PM in response to shaunumb

I just took delivery of my replacement Crucial RAM from Amazon and a few things give me reason for cautious optimism.


1) I immediately installed the two Crucial DIMMs on their own and ran Memtest86 in multi-CPU Parallel Mode and went through two passes with no errors. The ones I returned couldn't get through one pass without throwing errors.


2) Checking the SPD data with TechTool Pro I have confirmed that the specs of these new modules are identical down to every last value. This, too, was not the case with the Crucial I returned. It was almost identical, but some of the timings differed. In particular, tRFC (whatever that is) was 300 on the previous Crucial and is now 260, the same as the Apple Elpida. There was one other different value, but I can't recall it offhand.


3) There was no 20-30 second delay on initial boot up with the new RAM installed. This may mean nothing, but I had it every other time I installed new modules, so I mention it.


So now comes the true test. I will report back in a week or so, or sooner if I have problems,

Reply
User profile for user: cdanr
cdanr
User level: Level 1
39 points

Feb 20, 2014 2:09 AM in response to ginooken

ginooken wrote:


I posted my replacement on the forum a couple weeks ago.

Since then, not one single panic !

I am very glad to hear that, Gino, especially since I went back and checked your stats and aside from the fact that yours seems to be from Crucial Europe and mine is from Crucial USA, my new replacement is otherwise identical, right down to the model number and DRAM supplier code.


We shall see...

Reply
User profile for user: Dmonkified
Dmonkified
User level: Level 1
0 points

Feb 20, 2014 2:49 PM in response to Dmonkified

Update regarding 24GB configuration with OWC ram.


I just swapped the slots the ram were in and after running a few stress tests I haven't experienced any crashes yet. Usually they would occur after five minutes of heavy processing but so far after a few hours it seems to be fine.


Original Ram Slots when the iMac crashed (slots labelled 1 = closes to the top of the computer and 4 = lowest)

Slot 1: OWC 8GB

Slot 2: Apple 4GB

Slot 3: OWC 8GB

Slot 4: Apple 4GB


New Configuration which hasn't crashed yet

Slot 1: Apple 4GB

Slot 2: OWC 8GB

Slot 3: Apple 4GB

Slot 4: OWC 8GB


Hopefully this continues to work smoothly. I am a very happy camper now.

Reply
User profile for user: iRideApple
iRideApple
User level: Level 1
19 points

Feb 21, 2014 12:40 AM in response to Dmonkified

No offense, but this debate concerns MAX 32GB of RAM, which means a full cargo what 2013 iMac can carry.

I also had 24GB of RAM, it was my old Kingstom RAM (1,5v), and the iMac was stable.


I also get less panics with my new Kingston (1,35v) (Apple) RAM combs, when I switching off the energy saving.


iMac has trouble waking up with energy-saving mode, when I have connected one extra 2K screen at Thunderbolt connection, screens start blinking and waiking up is difficult.


Now in editing with two screens, I only keep screen saver on only.

All so I got less Panics with Mountain Lion then Mavericks, I tested that all so.

(maybe something to do saving energy tweaks at Mavericks?)

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iMac (Late 2013) 27" i7 Haswell constant crashing with 32GB RAM

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