Overheating and Crashing

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Level 1

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Overheating and Crashing

I've read a good majority of the posts involving the overheating problem, but most of them just seemed like people who didn't like to have scorching legs (like most people, I should hope...). My laptop seems to shut down whenever it gets very hot. I used bootcamp to install Windows XP on my MacBook Pro because, well, I wanted Windows more than anything to be able to play games that could only be played on Windows. (All that graphic power and RAM should go to good use!) Well, the games run at incredable speeds, but the only problem I have is that randomly, the computer will shut down.

I'm starting to think that this may be because of overheating, as I know that most systems will shut down when the processor reaches a certain temperature to avoid damage. I recently did the registry edit to fix that USB problem I heard about, as I use a USB mouse constantly, but that didn't seem to fix the problem. Even after leaving the system off for a few hours to cool off, I can only get a good 1-2 hours of gaming out of it before it randomly shuts down. I'm sure the solution could be to simply turn down the power of the game... reduce the resolution and settings, but why do that when I bought this laptop in the first place to be able to handle such power?

The games I have installed on my laptop currently are Final Fantasy XI, World of Warcraft, ESIV: Oblivion and Age of Empires 3. I've installed all of them from disc to the laptop, but I drag-and-dropped my entire WoW folder to my new laptop. (I read somewhere that because some programs weren't installed, but rather drag-and-dropped to the laptop that this could cause extra power to be used because the program wasn't 'configured' for this machine.) Because the only time my machine crashes is when I play WoW, and because it's the only game that I drag-and-dropped, I'm starting to thing that perhaps it is the culprit. I'm rather a newbie with hardware, but my old CPU was an AMD Athlon (NOT DUAL CORE) so perhaps the game configured itself to run on one processor only, because that's what my old CPU used? Perhaps it's draining all the power out of one processor only, thus overheating it to a point where the system shuts down.

I'm really not sure on this, but I'm wondering if anyone knows a solution to this. Again, I dislike making 'duplicate posts', but I haven't heard about the system actually crashing before except for the battery life thing, but I tend to leave my laptop plugged in a good majority of the time to converve battery power. If anyone has experienced this, or perhaps knows the culprit, please post! Any advice is appreciated... If perhaps my system seems 'faulty', I'd like to know that as well so I can look into sending it in to be repaired.

As far as my system goes: I bought it two days ago, on July 10th, at a local Apple Store. The system has all the default settings for the higher-grade 15-inch MacBook Pro, except I upgraded the RAM to 2gigs instead of 1. I used bootcamp to install Windows XP, and I seem to have no other problems (no whine) except for the random shutting down. I made sure to install the latest updates to OSX and firmware before running bootcamp... But then again, this entire thing could have nothing to do with what I suspect. =/

MacBook Pro, Windows XP

Posted on Jul 12, 2006 8:04 PM

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Answer 1

iVmichael

Level 6

13,740 points

Jul 13, 2006 3:32 AM in response to Ryuko

except I upgraded the RAM to 2gigs instead of 1

Not clear if you did this yourself or Apple ...

Remove the extra stick and see if it still shuts down?

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Answer 2

Ryuko Author

Level 1

0 points

Jul 13, 2006 8:36 AM in response to iVmichael

Apple installed the stick of RAM. What's funny is the first computer he installed it in, he said it was making a 'wierd noise' to exchanged that computer for the one I have now... Of course, at the time, I had no idea that it made whining noises, but perhaps that's what he was referring to. I'm sure I could manage removing a stick of RAM (if it's anything like installing/removing a stick of RAM in a pc), but could that really have caused it? I like my 2 gigs of RAM. x.x;

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Answer 3

Ryuko Author

Level 1

0 points

Jul 13, 2006 1:56 PM in response to Ryuko

Edit: Something is definately wrong. I left the thing fully charged and unplugged last night to perhaps give it a 'rest' from the faulty-standby thing I had it in. I turned it on this morning in an air-conditioned house (not excessively hot, I mean) and it lasted exactly one hour and thirty minutes before crashing. I'm definately sure it's got something to do with heat, because it seems it will last longer when it was left alone for a while. (For instance, if I tried to play games right after it had crashed, no doubt it'd crash after only a few minutes.) I'm not sure what to do... Whether I should complain to apple or get it sent in... It's not like I'm pushing its limits; it runs at whatever settings I put it to flawlessly, but gets ridiculously hot.

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Answer 4

Jul 13, 2006 2:19 PM in response to Ryuko

That doesn't seem normal. I have been playing Call of Duty 2 and Diablo 2 on my Macbook Pro and it has never shutdown on me. I have played Call of Duty 2 for more than 2 hours straight with the AC Adaptor plugged in. Eventually, the fans turn on and stay on but it never shuts down. Sometimes after exiting the game, I would see that the temperature (using CoreDuoTemp) was above 90 degrees Celsius. The highest I've seen was 97 but even then, the notebook ran just fine.

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Answer 5

Jul 13, 2006 3:41 PM in response to Ryuko

Launch the Console.app after a shut-down and report any recent error message.

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Answer 6

Ryuko Author

Level 1

0 points

Jul 13, 2006 6:43 PM in response to AIRrunner

May be my fans don't work? I very rarely hear them turn on, if ever. I just got my computer to game for about 3 and a half hours, during that time I only heard the fans start whirling once, and only for about a minute, if that... And... console.app? Is that a program on the Mac? Otherwise I've never heard of it... (I'm really clueless concerning OSX; I bought my MCB to take advantage of the hardware features... which are failing on me. =()

As far as temperature goes: I downloaded a free temperature monitor for my computer, but all it could access was the HD temperature... probably because it's an Apple built machine and it couldn't access anything else or something. My Hard Drive's Temperature was up to 40-45 degrees celcius, which means my hard drive was running at around 115 degrees farenheit! For over 3 hours... The interesting thing, though, is that there was no huge temperature jump when it crashed. I (I was checking the temperature periodically during that time.)

I suppose I should also mention that this time, it did not crash while I was playing WoW, but instead, another game, Final Fantasy XI, which I installed completely from disc to HD. I also think it must be a hardware problem, and not a program one, because I disabled the 'automatic shutdown' feature that windows has for 'critical errors' (so that most people don't get the blue screen of death when running XP.)

MacBook Pro Windows XP

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Answer 7

Dr. O

Level 1

5 points

Oct 18, 2006 1:20 PM in response to Ryuko

My powerbook is doing the same thing with increasing frequency... but I'm not a gamer, I just do ordinary work stuff and it can't handle a full day of operation. I have determined that the battery is a major factor in the HD temperature. I have fewer problems if I operate without the battery installed. When the battery is in, it takes no time at all of "ordinary" usage to reach 50 celcius, then it makes strange noises and freezes. I'm quite disappointed that my battery was not in the recalls because something is wrong in that department.

Also, the first time I had a temperature-related crash, I phoned apple support, and they didn't believe me that it was overheating! I've now had two serious heat related crashes, the first took two days to get it running again, and I'm still working on the second!

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Answer 8

Oct 18, 2006 2:01 PM in response to Dr. O

Dr. O, your conclusion that the battery is involved is wrong. When you run the MBP with the battery removed, only one CPU core is active. Your computer will generally run cooler on battery power (depending on Energy Saver configurations). On AC power it will run cooler with the battery removed, because only one CPU core is active.

Unless you've got hardware problems, I can assure you that a temperature of 50C is not anywhere near causing a heat-related crash. Some gamers report running at or above 90C for protracted times without a shutdown.

Temperatures around 50C are in the normal range for ordinary processor loads. If you track this forum, you will read that many users would be happy to see temperatures that low.

So my guess is that Apple was right. This doesn't sound like a temperature-related problem.

A bad RAM stick could cause random freezes. If you have installed a third-party RAM stick, remove it and see if the freezes are eliminated.

A failing hard drive could also produce similar symptoms.

Insert your Installation Disc 1 and restart while holding down the D key. Choose the extended test option. If an error is reported, write the report down and call Apple.

There are also software problems that can cause freezes, panics or crashes. If you migrated data from an older Mac it's possible that you brought over drivers, plugins or applications that are incompatible with the Intel Mac and cause problems.

We might be able to help diagnose your problem with more information. But be sure to run the Hardware Test diagnostics before posting again. If no problem is reported, try removing your RAM sticks one at a time and operating for a while.

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Answer 9

Dr. O

Level 1

5 points

Oct 20, 2006 3:15 AM in response to Bill DeVille

Restart holding down D? Unfortunatly, that is not working, I just get the spinning gear.

Let me give you more details. First off, it's the 15inch with 1.25GHz processor circa Dec 2003, original factory installed 512MB ram and everything else, no upgrades (though the power adaptor was replaced during the first year under warranty). There is migrated data, so that possibility intrigues me... anyway. I have had four (possibly more) of these "meltdowns" and the symptoms are always the same. The system freezes, the hard drive sounds like it is spinning out of control, and if the display goes to sleep, it doesn't wake up, and it's too hot to touch. I have to force shutdown with the power button. Until the last two meltdowns, it started up fine again after a brief cool down period (power supply and battery out). After I installed temperature monitor, I was able to see that the hard drive was pushing 50 degrees celcius when this occurred (and the processors were closer to 70 degrees celcius). Twice this year the meltdowns have been serious. A few months back, I went through all the steps on the "so you can't boot up" page, and nothing worked immediately, but then after two days rest it appeared fine. I ran the hardware test (extended) at that time and it said it was fine, however the disk utilities reported a problem it could not repair and re-intallation of the system software also failed. But with the exception of a few quirks (some system settings are reset every time I shut down, but not others), I could get some basic use out of it for a couple hours a night (I only use it at home now for personal use -skype, email, msn, and watching dvds). Then three days ago, I brought it to work because I was going to use it to give a presentation, so it was on all day, and I was only using powerpoint. By mid afternoon, I'd had a meltdown, same symptoms as always, so I forced a shutdown, and let it cool until 10pm. But I couldn't start it up, I only get as far as the spinning gear. 36 hours later, I'm still there with a spinning gear.

I can boot from the installation cd, disk utilities reports that it cannot repair the problem. I cannot re-install.
I can boot in single-user mode, I cannot boot in safe mode.
I have tried resetting the PRAM, and PMU (though I found it unclear which method was for my model -1.25GHz), no luck.

I have 95% of stuff backed up, but not conveniently and it would take months to rebuild from scratch partly because I'm in the uk and won't be home to all my backups in canada until christmas, because the day this meltdown happened, I was planning to back up everything to my brand-new 60Gig iPod. Presumably, I can still do that with the right command lines.

Is there any info I'm leaving out?

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Answer 10

Redgnome

Level 1

0 points

Oct 20, 2006 7:07 AM in response to Dr. O

Backing up to an iPod is something I've steared clear of simply because they aren't really intended as backup devices due to their read\write speeds. I bought an external firewire\usb harddisk which can be used as a failsafe bootdrive should something happen to the primary device.

iMac G5 20", Macbook Pro Mac OS X (10.4.8)

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Answer 11

Oct 20, 2006 8:15 AM in response to Dr. O

I had two Mac Book Pros - 15 & 17 inch and both suffered form overheating in Windows, ocassional shut downs.

The fact is, despite the absurd and rude statements from Apple staff at stores to the contrary, the Mac Book Pro suffers from obvious and well-established heat issues. "Normal" does not and should never burn your leg or hands - I use mine on iRain aluminum stands and they still are ridiculously hot.
Apple tell us "it's a portable computer not a laptop silly" and is working on a statement to let us know we shouldn't actually touch it at all, no doubt.

Cooling is better in OS X as Windows power management has always been poor an inconsistent, thus the system runs quite a bit hotter.
After going through several Mac Book Pro's and knowing many, many others who feel the Mac Book Pro has been a terrible experience because of the heat problems and various failures, I think you will find there is nothing 'wrong' with your machine - this is considered normal by Apple and especially in Boot Camp, which they do not support.

You have to decide if the problem is acceptable or not - personally I removed Boot Camp and Windows because the heat was so bad I was afraid it would damage the 'portable computer'.

17" & 15.4" Mac Book Pro Mac OS X (10.4.6) 2.16 GHz

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Answer 12

Oct 22, 2006 3:18 PM in response to AIRrunner

I play World of Warcraft on my MBP, sometimes for up to 6 hours at a time. I have seen temps of up to 180 fahrenheit in the second hour. I just attached a usb coolpad and now stay in the 100-110 range on the disk and around 95 on the cpu, which is a major improvement.

With the temps I have seen and kept functioning without issue, I can't imagine what temp would cause the MB to actually shut down! Methinks it's time to call support...keeping in mind that if there aren't flames or smoke, Apple doesn't think it's a heat issue! lol

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Answer 13

Dr. O

Level 1

5 points

Oct 26, 2006 2:11 PM in response to stormcarver

chronic heavy usage at high temperatures has got to cause physical damage. I'd like to see an ikea style demo of apple beating the crap out of their components to demonstrate the durability, because face it, people want durable not fragile technology.

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Answer 14

Oct 26, 2006 2:50 PM in response to Dr. O

There are chips and related components designed to run for years at higher temperatures and in much more hostile environments than Apple notebooks. The Intel CPU chips are designed to operate safely up to 100C. "Safely" means the chips can meet their design life specifications up to that temperature. Apple's energy management system will prevent the CPU cores from exceeding Intel's safe operating temperature range.

My MBP spends most of the time doing my work with CPU temperatures in the 40s C and the SMART disk temperature stays in the 30s C most of the time -- the highest SMART disk temperature I've seen in more than 6 months of daily use was 42C.

Those temperatures are comparable to the temperatures in my Power Mac G5 2.3 GHz dual core computer. And with Universal Binary applications the little MacBook Pro runs head-to-head with the enormously larger and heavier Power Mac. My conclusion is that the engineering design of the MPB is darned good.

I got over 5 years productive use from my previous PowerBook G4, and expect the MBP to have at least the same life expectancy without problems. I always buy AppleCare, but I've never had to use it.

Operating daily since 30 March, the MBP has never had a panic, crash or freeze. It's been rock solid stable.

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