Cable Select? Master? Mystery Jumper

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Level 1

8 points

Cable Select? Master? Mystery Jumper

Hello, I'm in the process of installing an additional HDD on the Internal ATA 2 cable, on the top portion of the U-shaped carrier beneath the Power Supply. Original HDD to remain in place. Was confused as to whether I should set up as Cable Select, or Master/Slave. Have spent hours reading posts and Mac.com articles, and have learned that:

1. G4's will not recognize Cable Select.
2. G4 Quicksilvers should always be Cable Select.
3. G4 Quicksilvers should always be Master/Slave.
4. G4 MDDs and later are the Only G4's that support Cable Select.

My original (Maxtor 5T060H6) HD has worked fine all these years, I figured I'd let its jumper setting (Master or Cable Select) determine how to set the new Maxtor 100GB drive.

Except I can't find a reference to its unique jumper setting - Maxtor's site shows many different configurations for this Model, and I've looked at the various settings for all their drives that share the same pin configuration, but nothing matches what I have (which has worked flawlessly since I started using it in September of 2001). So I'm stumped. I'll attempt to diagram it:

1 2-3 x 5
|
6 7 8 9 10

Sorry I don't know the proper names for these pins, but I hope this makes sense (i.e. 1 is top left pin, 10 is bottom right pin, x is the missing pin; 1 is jumpered to 6, and 2 is jumpered to 3).

Maxtor's support line is closed, and their e-mail takes two business days. Any thoughts from you fine folks would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers, Patterson

Power Mac G4 Quicksilver 867 Mac OS 9.2.x 17" Studio Display, 512MB RAM

Posted on Aug 2, 2006 10:50 PM

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Answer 1

Best reply

Majordadusma

Level 6

9,425 points

Aug 3, 2006 1:23 AM in response to Patterson

Hi, Patterson, and welcome to the Discussions!

Set up the QuickSilver in a master-slave configuration.

A Maxtor master setting calls for the jumper to be positioned vertically across the leftmost two pins in the jumper block (viewed with the drive label up while you face the pin end of the drive). The schematic you posted indicates a master setting for a Maxtor (or a Seagate, which uses identical settings).

If your other drive is a Maxtor or Seagate, setting it to slave requires removing the jumper completely. (Store it where you can find it, should you need it later for a different setting or another computer.)

Using two drives on a single ribbon cable, either drive can be hooked to either cable connector, having no consequence on which is master or slave, etc.

If your other (new) drive is a Western Digital or Hitachi/IBM, post back and advise if it will be set as master or as slave and we'll provide the correct setting. Alternately, check here for a diagram. Scroll down a bit on the page there and you'll find the pdf links.

After you install the drives, do a PRAM reset at startup, boot normally to your startup volume, launch Drive Setup, and initialize (format) the drive using Mac OS Extended (HFS+). You might consider zeroing the new drive there before putting it into service for the first time. This will take hours, but it will map out any bad sectors on the new drive, precluding their use and insuring against the possibility of data corruption, if there are any bad sectors present.

Gary

1GHz DP G4 Quicksilver 2002, 400MHz B&W rev.2 G3, Mac SE30 Mac OS X (10.4.5) 5G iPod, Epson 2200 & R300 & LW Select 360 Printers, Epson 3200 Scanner

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Answer 2

Patterson Author

Level 1

8 points

Aug 3, 2006 2:37 AM in response to Majordadusma

Thanks, Gary.

Should I remove the horizontal jumper connecting pins 2 & 3 (per my diagram) on the old HDD?

I understand I should leave the vertical jumper connecting 1 & 6 (i.e. "Master") and set up the new Maxtor 100GB as "Slave".

Also, 2 questions to clarify the Master/Slave vs. Cable Select issue, with regards to G4 Towers with stock Ultra ATA interfaces:

1. Are there any performance increases with Cable Select, or is that just another way for the system to ID the drives without us having to mess about with jumpers?

2. Would it be safe to say that a Cable Select set-up will only work in a system optimized for Cable Select, but a Master/Slave set-up will work in either?

Thanks again -
Cheers,
Patterson

Power Mac G4 Quicksilver 867 Mac OS 9.2.x 17" Studio Display, 512MB RAM

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Answer 3

Aug 3, 2006 4:54 AM in response to Patterson

Should I remove the horizontal jumper connecting pins
2 & 3 (per my diagram) on the old HDD?

Here are the Maxtor jumper settings
<http://www.maxtor.com/ files/maxtor/en_us/documentation/quick_specs/diamondmax_plus_60_ultra_ata_100_qu ickspecs.pdf>
The horizontal jumper shouldn't be where it is. You can put it over the right pin and the empty space for storage, so it doesn't get lost.

I understand I should leave the vertical jumper
connecting 1 & 6 (i.e. "Master") and set up the new
Maxtor 100GB as "Slave".

Also, 2 questions to clarify the Master/Slave vs.
Cable Select issue, with regards to G4 Towers with
stock Ultra ATA interfaces:

1. Are there any performance increases with Cable
Select, or is that just another way for the system to
ID the drives without us having to mess about with
jumpers?

Performance is the same. Cable Select helps manufacturers assembling systems. They order all their drives set to cable select and never have to handle jumpers.

2. Would it be safe to say that a Cable Select set-up
will only work in a system optimized for Cable
Select, but a Master/Slave set-up will work in
either?

Yes. I always use Master/Slave just to be sure. One extra note: Western Digital drives also have a "Single" jumper setting for a master drive when no slave is present on the cable.

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Answer 4

Patterson Author

Level 1

8 points

Aug 3, 2006 2:09 PM in response to Malcolm Rayfield

Many thanks to both Gary and Malcolm.

FYI, my initial confusion was caused by following Mac.com support links from Computer Server/DesktopsDisplays/Power Macs/G4+G4Cube/How to/Install an Internal Storage Device:

Which quotes from the "Setting Up Your Power Mac G4 manual":

"Your Macintosh doesn't work with Ultra ATA devices set for cable select mode.">

However, downloading the "Setting Up Your Power Mac G4 manual" for the Quicksilver provides this information:

"Important Your computer works with internal storage devices that are set for cable select
mode. Because cable select mode forces the drive to set its ID based upon its position on the
cable, hard disk drives and optical drives are easily configured. Before you install an
additional device, check the documentation that came with the device or with the
manufacturer to make sure the device is set for cable select mode."

Thanks again for the CS vs M/S clarification!

Cheers,
Patterson

Also, 2 questions to clarify the Master/Slave vs.
Cable Select issue, with regards to G4 Towers with
stock Ultra ATA interfaces:

1. Are there any performance increases with Cable
Select, or is that just another way for the system
to
ID the drives without us having to mess about with
jumpers?

Malcolm wrote:

Performance is the same. Cable Select helps
manufacturers assembling systems. They order all
their drives set to cable select and never have to
handle jumpers.

2. Would it be safe to say that a Cable Select
set-up
will only work in a system optimized for Cable
Select, but a Master/Slave set-up will work in
either?

Malcolm wrote:

Yes. I always use Master/Slave just to be sure. One
extra note: Western Digital drives also have a
"Single" jumper setting for a master drive when no
slave is present on the cable.

Power Mac G4 Quicksilver 867 Mac OS 9.2.x 17" Studio Display, 512MB RAM

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Answer 5

Aug 3, 2006 5:18 PM in response to Patterson

You're welcome, Patterson!

Glad it's sorted out now. I was tempted to take and answer the four-question "quiz" from your initial post, but refrained from doing so, thinking that it might confuse things for you even more.

You're right about the confusing setup manual conflicts. I generally follow this approach: if it's a Mac earlier than the MDD models, set the drive jumpers to Master-Slave. For MDD and later models, use Cable Select jumper settings. That's the scheme actually used by Apple when the models originally shipped.

Sorry I wasn't around to answer your followup question. (I had to get some sleep.) Thanks to Malcolm for covering me!

Gary

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