daikambu65

Q: How are plug-in changes recorded?

I use NIK as a plugin. If I make adjustments through NIK, what is the format of the modified file? I expected to see TIFF files in my List View roster. All I see are NEFs (that's Nikon Raw).

Aperture 3, OS X Mavericks (10.9.1), running an iMac

Posted on May 16, 2014 3:12 PM

Close

Q: How are plug-in changes recorded?

  • All replies
  • Helpful answers

Page 1 Next
  • by Frank Caggiano,

    Frank Caggiano Frank Caggiano May 16, 2014 6:12 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 7 (25,782 points)
    May 16, 2014 6:12 PM in response to daikambu65

    You can set the format of the files used with an external editor in the Preferences->Export External Editor File Format.

     

    Screen Shot 2014-05-16 at 21.10.40 .png

  • by daikambu65,

    daikambu65 daikambu65 May 16, 2014 6:16 PM in response to Frank Caggiano
    Level 1 (10 points)
    May 16, 2014 6:16 PM in response to Frank Caggiano

    Nothing was exported. I just configured the NIK screen, hit SAVE and that was the end.

  • by Frank Caggiano,

    Frank Caggiano Frank Caggiano May 16, 2014 6:25 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 7 (25,782 points)
    May 16, 2014 6:25 PM in response to daikambu65

    The export window is how you configure Aperture to deal with plugins.

     

    In effect Aperture takes the file format you specify here and sends it to the plugin. The pluging returns the modified file to Aperture.

  • by Kirby Krieger,Solvedanswer

    Kirby Krieger Kirby Krieger May 16, 2014 7:07 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 6 (12,521 points)
    May 16, 2014 7:07 PM in response to daikambu65

    "Plug-in" is simply a streamlined export➞modify➞import operation.

     

    Here, in short form, is how Aperture handles files when using a plug-in.  But we must start at the beginning: importing a file into Aperture.

     

    A digital image file

    Import

    A record in your Aperture database.  The visual representation of this record is the Image.

    The digital image file becomes the Original and is never altered

    Changes you make via adjustments or to metadata are saved as text instructions in the Version file, which is always kept in the Library

    Execute "Edit with plug-in"

    Aperture creates a new image-format file from the selected Image (Image = Version instructions applied to unaltered Original)

    File format is set in Aperture prefs

    Aperture creates a new entry in its database.

    The new file is the Original.  Because these Originals are _not_ inviolable, here in this forum we call them "Quasi-Originals".  (I think Ernie Stamper coined the term and first described the behavior.)

    Aperture sends this file to the plug-in

    Use plug-in

    Save your changes

    Aperture _overwrites_ the Quasi-Original

    Make adjustments or change the metadata

    Aperture saves these changes to the Version file.  The Quasi-Original is not altered.

    Send Image back to the same plug-in

    Aperture sends the current Quasi-Original.  This file will not show any adjustments you have made.

    Use Plug-in

    Save your changes

    Aperture _overwrites_ the Quasi-Original.

    The Image is rendered by applying whatever adjustments you had made to the newly-changed Quasi-Original.

     

    Extra-confusing part:

    Duplicate your Image (via the {to me} poorly named command "Duplicate Version")

    Aperture creates a new Image

    Send this new Image to a plug-in

    Aperture creates a _new new_ file based on the Image, makes this another new Quasi-Original, and sends it to the plug-in

     

    At least, that's my understanding.  I hope others will correct, modify, extend as needed.

  • by Kirby Krieger,

    Kirby Krieger Kirby Krieger May 16, 2014 7:18 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 6 (12,521 points)
    May 16, 2014 7:18 PM in response to daikambu65

    daikambu65 wrote:

     

    I use NIK as a plugin. [ ... ]  I expected to see TIFF files in my List View roster. All I see are NEFs (that's Nikon Raw).

     

    That shouldn't be the case.  Can you confirm that by checking what is shown in the Camera Info pane of the Info Inspector when you select an Image that has been editing using one of the Google NIK Collection plug-ins?

  • by daikambu65,

    daikambu65 daikambu65 May 16, 2014 7:42 PM in response to Kirby Krieger
    Level 1 (10 points)
    May 16, 2014 7:42 PM in response to Kirby Krieger

    That sure is a lot of fireworks for a supplemental application costing $50. I guess my wrong turn was looking for a TIFF in the LIst View metadata.

     

    I don't want to bend this thread, but this got me thinking about the Aperture 4 Wish list floating around. I support most of those suggestions. But would it be possible or desireable to make invoking Plug-ins more seamless?

     

    My hunch is that each corporation wants to make their software propietry stuff, to put up protective barriers, if that metaphor can be applied to software.

     

    I didn't answer your question. A badge tells me the file has been adjusted by another editor.

  • by léonie,

    léonie léonie May 16, 2014 11:00 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 10 (105,761 points)
    iLife
    May 16, 2014 11:00 PM in response to daikambu65

    I didn't answer your question. A badge tells me the file has been adjusted by another editor.

    Is that the badge with lines and a dot? Or the circle with the dot?

    I don't know about the nik collection, but some plug-ins don't actually create quasi masters but just add effects using Aperture's built-in adjustments. Then you will see the "line and dot" instead of "circle and dot" badge and see the added adjustment in the Adjustment panel.

  • by daikambu65,

    daikambu65 daikambu65 May 16, 2014 11:33 PM in response to léonie
    Level 1 (10 points)
    May 16, 2014 11:33 PM in response to léonie

    I referred to the badge that looks like a dot with a circle around it. The odd thing is, after making an adjustment with NIK, then saving it — but no export — the List View doesn't show the file as a TIFF. TIFF is what I have set in my Preferences.

     

    Moreover, the LAST DATE MODIFIED column isn't updated.

     

    I am now approaching one year of using Aperture. And so I am trying to use at its features/controls. Some of these don't seem to represent mature computer programming. But I am not a professional. My objective is speedy processing. If something doesn't work well, I don't write letters to Apple.

  • by léonie,

    léonie léonie May 17, 2014 12:09 AM in response to daikambu65
    Level 10 (105,761 points)
    iLife
    May 17, 2014 12:09 AM in response to daikambu65

    A silly question - but could it be, that you are using version stacks? Then the list view may only be showing the original, but not the stacked edited tiff.

     

    Is there a disclosure triangle beside the image in the list view?  The ⦿ badge means, that you are having a new quasi master, and it should have a different last modified date and be a TIFF file.

     

    How about creating a smart album and searching for "File Type is TIFF"?

     

    Screen Shot 2014-05-17 at 09.08.03GMT+2.PNG

  • by Kirby Krieger,

    Kirby Krieger Kirby Krieger May 17, 2014 4:55 AM in response to daikambu65
    Level 6 (12,521 points)
    May 17, 2014 4:55 AM in response to daikambu65

    My question asked for what was shown in the Camera Info pane of the Info Inspector when the edited-with-plug-in Image is selected.

     

    Here is a screen-shot of the Camera Info pane of the Info Inspector taken with an Image that I edited with one of the Google NIK Collection plug-ins selected.  As you can see, the Original of this Image is a TIFF file.  I never record TIFF files with a camera.  The file I imported was in one of Sony's RAW formats.  The TIFF was created when I selected an Image and sent it to the NIK plug-in for editing.

    Screenshot:

    2014-05-17 at 7.43.png

     

    The parts of the Info Inspector are described in the User Manual here (though it's outdated -- the Inspector pictured and referred to is still called the "Metadata Inspector").

     

    (Added) Here is a screenshot showing the badge affixed to the edited-with-plug-in Image:

    2014-05-17 at 7.50.png

     

    So, as I see it (heh), two questions remain:

    - what is the file format of the Original of your edited-with-NIK-plug-in Image?, and

    - why is this information not being reported, showing correctly, or interpreted correctly in List View?

     

    Message was emended twice by: Kirby Krieger

  • by daikambu65,

    daikambu65 daikambu65 May 17, 2014 10:20 AM in response to Kirby Krieger
    Level 1 (10 points)
    May 17, 2014 10:20 AM in response to Kirby Krieger

    This will take me 24 hours to resolve on my end. I think the root of the problem is that I don't understand the NIK workflow and as a result, none of my Viveza (one of the NIK tools) changes have been saved. Everything in the list view and in the Info inspector shows that the files start out as NEF files and haven't changed since capture.

     

    I've got the only reference book on NIK and will so some reading. It is dense reading and I have to absorb the ingenious U-Point technology that is the heart of this software. I'll post a report in a day or two. i appreciate your counsel.

  • by Kirby Krieger,

    Kirby Krieger Kirby Krieger May 17, 2014 12:08 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 6 (12,521 points)
    May 17, 2014 12:08 PM in response to daikambu65

    No no no no  ... you're making a dirt-pile from a rodent-tunnel.

     

    You don't need to know _anything_ about how a plug-in works in order to use Aperture's plug-in process.

     

    It does work.  It isn't hard to use.  (It _is_ hard to understand what's going on under the hood, so to speak, but that doesn't stop people from driving to work.)

     

    You select an Image.  You right-click and select "Edit with my Plug-in".  The plug-in opens and shows you (a copy of) your Image.  You edit it.  You save your changes.  The plug-in disappears, and you are back in Aperture.  In your Project you now have two Images -- the one you had selected, and the once created from editing with the plug-in.  The latter shows the edits you make with your plug-in.

     

    Is this not working with Viveza?

     

    Let's check.  Select an Image in a Project, open it in Viveza.  You don't even need to use a Control Point.  Slide the global Brighness slider all the way to the left, and slide the global Contrast slider all the way to the right.  Click "Save" on the right side of the bottom border of the program window.  What happens?  You should be returned to Aperture, with a second, new Image showing your obvious changes, badged with the "Edited Externally" encircled dot.

     

    If Viveza has not been saving your changes ... what has been happening that has allowed you to think it has been working?

  • by Kirby Krieger,

    Kirby Krieger Kirby Krieger May 17, 2014 12:20 PM in response to daikambu65
    Level 6 (12,521 points)
    May 17, 2014 12:20 PM in response to daikambu65

    daikambu65 wrote:

     

    I've got the only reference book on NIK and will so some reading. It is dense reading and I have to absorb the ingenious U-Point technology that is the heart of this software. I'll post a report in a day or two. i appreciate your counsel.

     

    Is the book "Nik Software Captured" by Tony Corbell and Jushua Haftel?

     

    This is one of the worst instruction books I've seen in the last decade.  I suggest marking a spot about seven inches from the spine, halfway between the top and bottom edges, and drilling from the front cover through to the back cover -- with a drill, the kind that leaves a hole -- and then putting a bolt through the hole, lubricating the bolt threads with Super-glue, and threading a sizable nut on, hard.  Equivalent utility may be had by returning the book, if it is unused.  That Haftel was manager of "the Nik Software product line of photographic tools" is a mystery of Eleusinian magnitude.

     

    Of course, YMMV.

  • by daikambu65,

    daikambu65 daikambu65 May 17, 2014 1:52 PM in response to Kirby Krieger
    Level 1 (10 points)
    May 17, 2014 1:52 PM in response to Kirby Krieger

    Let me respond to your questions in order.

     

    I used both the pull-down menu PHOTOS>EDIT WITH PLUG IN>NIK, and right clicking the mouse with the same selection.

     

    Invoking Viveza and ColorEfex 4, then adding an effect preset (which they call a FILTER) or manually setting sliders, and finally hitting SAVE. Then the screen reverts to the Aperture VIEWER mode of the resulting image. The changes appear to be cooked into the version.

     

    The result of this, after repeated tries, yields these results: a)no dot&circle badge, b)the stacked hammer badge only  shows, c) List View Metadata table for that image neither shows an updated LAST MODIFIED DATE, the file remains an NEF, d) no record of the NIK editing.  This is particularly frustrating since I rely heavily on two of these idicators — LAST MODIFIED and FILE TYPE for a fast workflow. I haven't developed the habit of using flags or color coding. Not yet, anyway.

     

    The book.  Yes, it is the book by Corbell and Haftell. It seems to me, a newbie to DLSR, that the author was enamoured with his own craft. And that his arguments go right over the heads of most readers. Author-centric weltgeiste, if you ask me. I'm a writer. I'm not interested in programming. And I think the genisis of the U-Point technology should be credited to Nikon. They commissioned the first software to use it. Google just bought it cheap, and the Nikon folks are not exactly what I would call 'fleet-footed', nor nimble.

     

    The Apple Pro Professional Series book on Aperture says little about NIK or plugins in general. However, the book by Corey Hilz does give some step-by-step instructions for using plugins. And there, tucked away in one of the paragraphs he says that the file format of an externally edited photo is set in the Aperture Preferences under EXPORT parameters. He also writes that the new edited version will be a stack on top of the RAW.

     

    If that always holds true, then there should be an item e) to my fault list above. My edited image is not stacked

     

    Thinking ahead to a solution, I just restarted Aperture with the Option & Command keys held down. I rebult the database and fixed the permissions. Nothing seems to have changed. So, what's next.

Page 1 Next