(latest) Time Capsule Base Station and the Orange Livebox in France? I just cannot seem to get it to work.

Do a factory reset on the TC to start with clear clean setup.

The Factory Reset universal

Unplug your TC/AE. Hold in reset. and power the TC/AE back on.. all without releasing reset and keep holding in for about 10sec. The time is not important.. it is the front LED rapid flashing that indicates you are in factory mode.

Release reset.

If it doesn’t flash rapidly you have released reset at some point and try again.

Be Gentle! Feel the switch click on. It has a positive feel.. add no more pressure after that.

TC/AE will reboot after a couple of minutes with default factory settings and will wipe out previous configurations.

No files are deleted on the hard disk.. No reset of the TC deletes files.. to do that you use erase from the airport utility.

Open your Airport utility and redo the setup of the TC.

It will probably try to take over any adsl system.. that is stupid and useless so do the setup manually.

I would recommend the following steps.

1. Do everything with ethernet if that is possible. The TC wan port plugged into the LAN port of the Sagem modem router. Try and use a different computer if your existing one has no ethernet.. or buy the thunderbolt to ethernet adapter which is useful and not over expensive.

2. Make sure ipv6 is set to link-local on both the ethernet and wireless on your computer. For example in wifi network prreferences open the advanced and go to TCP/IP tab.

3. Make sure you are getting an IP in the computer from the TC.. the router setting must show 10.0.1.1 after a reset.

Check the network preferences and the same screenshot as above will give you the details.

4. Open the airport utility and go to the top menu area. Open File / Configure Other.

5. Type in your IP address.. after a factory reset there is no password required. But if it complains it is public

Click ok.

6. You will then get the full edit screens where you can manually setup the TC to whatever you want.

7. I strongly recommend changing to all SMB compatible names, ie short 2-20 characters.

No spaces and Pure alphanumeric.

eg

8. Use same rules for wireless. Set security to WPA2 Personal..

use a password of 10-20 characters mixed case and numbers... but still pure alphanumeric.

You can use a different name for 5ghz if you want.

You can also set channels at least for 2.4ghz I am not sure if 5ghz is relevant for AC models.

9. Set up correct mode. Open the network tab. Set it to Off (bridge mode) in this case where the Sagem is the main router.

That makes the TC into a non-routing device.. WAN is allocated to LAN and

the TC is a dumb Wireless Access Point, Switch and network hard disk.

10 Make sure the Internet is set correctly.. for most people it will be dhcp.

You have now taken over the control of the TC and it should work just fine.

Hello! I have a new Time Capsule and the latest Orange LiveBox Play (ADSL modem, router, WiFi and VOIP). I do not want to use the TC in bridging mode as I need to be able to use the Guest Wi-Fi and hidden primary WiFi. So I need to configure the Orange Live Box so that the TC can connect to it and allow the LiveBox to handle all Internet traffic from and to the TC. However, all DHCP and NAT should be done (as now) on the TC.

I have struggled for two days in an attempt to find a configuration that will work; so far no luck!

Currently I am suing a satellite modem that simply offers a WAN port; this links to the TC using DHCP and it couldn't be easier! However, I need to move from satellite to ADSL as this will provide a more cost effective internet service. "All" I need is for the LiveBox to operate as a modem - period!

Can you please advise how and if I can achieve this ?

Many thanks indeed

John

Clairac SW France

Orange LiveBox Play (ADSL modem, router, WiFi and VOIP)

It may not even be possible to bridge the orange modem.. which is clearly also a router.

You will lose VOIP along with router and wifi.

If that is ok.. you also need to know how your ISP authenticates.

The ONLY way where you can use a bridged modem and TC as full router is PPPOE or IPOE.

(Unless you double NAT.. more below).

So do you have your login details for Orange .. some ISP will not even give you the authentication password.

I also recommend you buy a simple modem.. in this part of the world we use TP-Link .. 8960N for example is a good cheap modem that bridges easily and works well.

And let me add a warning.. PPPOE is poor on the TC. In my setup PPPOE was unusable .. it simply could not sustain a connection.. i tested with multiple apple routers of various generations and multiple modems. None would work. Apple has no controls over PPPOE configuration so if your ISP happens to need PAP instead of CHAP for instance with a limited number of retries then the TC may simply never work. If your ISP supports pppoe and you have been trying to get the TC to work for 2 days with PPPOE it may never work. Sadly the situation is that Apple need to provide controls they are not prepared to offer. Some ISP use non-standard PPPOE methods. Some even need special firmware so that is why only their own modems work.

Some modems offer true NAT mode.. Or what is called DMZ .. where a router is placed in a special zone by the modem where it receives all packets. This is going to give you a double NAT warning but is acceptable in some situations.. I am testing a special double NAT setup myself at the moment and I am hitting major issues.. so it is not going great. However it can work ok if you are stuck.

Plain double NAT blocks opening of ports.. which makes life hard now when interactive web usage is needed.. eg voip. gaming, it blocks anything but standard ports.

I need to be able to use the Guest Wi-Fi and hidden primary WiFi.

You do realise hidden primary wifi is useless security measure.

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/28653/debunking-myths-is-hiding-your-wireless-ssi d-really-more-secure/

What is important in that article is that IEEE 802.11 wifi code never included hidden ssid as a security measure or anything else.. this is a figment of imagination that was done in the early days of WEP to help security.. it breaks the code and causes issues.. No more needs to be said.. but hidden ssid is pointless.

The orange router wifi could provide your guest network and you can run the TC in static IP mode .. see

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5981989?answerId=25135547022#25135547022&ac_cid=tw123456#

If you want the TC to take a more active part in the network without breaking the double NAT rules.

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. I have replied to your points in order below but the crux of the issue appears to be; does Orange allow access to its Internet services via PPPoE as this is the only means to allow the Apple TC to mange my network in the way I wish.

LaPastenague :It may not even be possible to bridge the orange modem.. which is clearly also a router. You will lose VOIP along with router and wifi.

If that is ok..

JIS : I don’t mind losing VOIP or WiFi and router; that’s why I have a late 2015 Apple Time Capsule.

LaPastenague :You also need to know how your ISP authenticates. The ONLY way where you can use a bridged modem and TC as full router is PPPOE or IPOE. (Unless you double NAT.. more below).

JIS : I do not know how Orange authenticates but clearly I need to find out. N.B. I have no care about Double NAT provided it doesn’t have a noticeable downside on Internet speeds; here in SW France we are struggling to reach 8-10 Mbps so any reductions is bad news.

LaPastenague :So do you have your login details for Orange. Some ISP will not even give you the authentication password.

JIS : I believe I do; in the letter from Orange they advised a username and password which was (apparently) passed in an SWM URL which, when activated on my mobile phone, enables the LiveBox. However, yes I have these two provided this si the same thing.

LaPastenague :I also recommend you buy a simple modem.. in this part of the world we use TP-Link .. 8960N for example is a good cheap modem that bridges easily and works well.

JIS: Just looked up this modem; it seems to be a fully functional modem+router+wifi. In what way is this better that the Sagem LiveBox? No issue with buying one though; if that will cure the problem!

LaPastenague :And let me add a warning.. PPPOE is poor on the TC<snip>

JIS: I was using PPPoE for the last 4 years in UK without a hitch; so provided Orange can support PPPoE we may be in business.

LaPastenague :Some modems offer true NAT mode.. Or what is called DMZ .<snip>

Plain double NAT blocks opening of ports.. which makes life hard now when interactive web usage is needed.. eg voip. gaming, it blocks anything but standard ports.

JIS: No issue with gaming or VOIP. However, If we can use PPPoE then Double NAT is no issue as my TC does all the “heavy lifting” and my LiveBox does nothing more than pass Internetnet traffic to/from the TC; right?

JIS : I need to be able to use the Guest Wi-Fi and hidden primary WiFi.

LaPastenague :You do realise hidden primary wifi is useless security measure.

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/28653/debunking-myths-is-hiding-your-wireless-ssi d-really-more-secure/

JIS : LOL; Yes; it’s not for security per se, it’s just that it’s my private WiFi and if I can hide it I will. The secure part is the password which, at around 35 random characters is not the easisest to crack! Anyway, that’s off the subject. I am OK with security.

LaPastenague :The orange router wifi could provide your guest network and you can run the TC in static IP mode .. see

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5981989?answerId=25135547022#25135547022&ac_cid=tw123456#

JIS : Nice thinking; however I have a small holiday cottages complex with no less that 6 Apple Airport Expresses which deliver WiFi throughout the private and public areas. For this to work I need my TC up and running as the AEs all link via Powerline adapters to the TC and hence DHCP etc etc.

LaPastenague :If you want the TC to take a more active part in the network without breaking the double NAT rule

JIS : Your post stopped here ?

LaPastenague :If you want the TC to take a more active part in the network without breaking the double NAT rule

JIS : Your post stopped here ?

It refers back to the static IP method of using the TC. There is no more.. it is a method of using the TC and not having it bridged.

However .. guest network still won't work. Just double checked.. the TC can only provide guest wireless when it is NAT router.. which is stupidly bad poor design.

JIS: Just looked up this modem; it seems to be a fully functional modem+router+wifi. In what way is this better that the Sagem LiveBox? No issue with buying one though; if that will cure the problem!

This is purely for if the Orange modem cannot be bridged.. many ISP now stop end users changing the router configuration.. test and see.

Mostly you know what to do.. You need to setup the modem in bridge and run PPPOE on the TC..

Your job now is to test it and see if it works. If not then you MUST double NAT.. it is far from perfect but if the orange router has DMZ that can help.

Thank you very much for the reply.

I have now delved deeper into the Advanced Configuration of the LiveBox and I hope it’s positive (I confess that this goes beyond my knowledge). From what you have said, I think, and hope that the LiveBox offers the flexibility to be configured to work as I need it; apart from uncertainty over connection via PPPoE. I realise that I am asking a great deal but if you could possibly look at these options and indicate whether they offer what I need and, if so, what you would recommend, to enable me to link my TC, I would be SO grateful!

The Advanced Configuration options include :-

DHCP : Activate or de-Activate options

Livebox IP address 192.168.1.1

LAN subnet mask 255.255.255.0

start IP address 192.168.1.10

end IP address 192.168.1.150

Static DHCP leases showing device name; designated IP address and its MAC address

Valid DHCP leases showing what devices are currently logged on

NAT/PAT :

these rules are needed to authorise a remote communication from Internet to reach a specific device of your LAN. you can also define the ports(s) that this communication will use.

NB: following rules are only applied with IPv4.

A table then offers “Customize rules” with the following fields / options

application / service options include FTP server; FTP Data; Telnet; Secure Shell Server (SSH); HTTPS; Webserver (HTTP)

internal port #

externalport #

protocol : options are TCP, UDP or both

device

activate

DNS settings

Primary and secondary DNS settings plus a table showing the local connected devices

UPnP

UPnP IGD allows applications to open automatically and forward ports of the access point (useful for instant messaging, online gaming ...).

There is a switch to enable this feature (on by default) below which there is a table currently showing Skype UDP and TCP with associated ports

DynDNS

This page enables you to configure the DynDNS service. Use a DynDNS to map a static or dynamic IP address or long URL to an easy to remember subdomain such as mydomain.dyndns.org. Thus you will be able to access to your server on your LAN.

DMZ settings

This page enables you to configure a DMZ on a computer. This computer can be reachable from the Internet.

To use this I need to allocate a static IP address to a device in the DHCP settings.

A table below shows what if any devices are under the DMZ

Name (static IP address)

IP address

MAC Address

NPT Settings

Configure time zones

DHCP : Activate or de-Activate options

Livebox IP address 192.168.1.1

LAN subnet mask 255.255.255.0

start IP address 192.168.1.10

end IP address 192.168.1.150

This is all standard.

UPNP should be on..

None of the rest matters except DMZ.

Plug in the TC and put it in bridge mode.. (that is the simplest way).

DMZ settings

This page enables you to configure a DMZ on a computer. This computer can be reachable from the Internet.

To use this I need to allocate a static IP address to a device in the DHCP settings.

A table below shows what if any devices are under the DMZ

Name (static IP address)

IP address

MAC Address

Do this.. fill in the values so the TC is made DMZ.

Then just see how it goes..

Hello again and thank you very much for staying with me on this. So this is where we stand now.

Action taken

• TC was BRIDGEd with the LiveBox using a static IP as defined on LiveBox
• TC’s (DHCP allocated) IP has been set as a static IP on LiveBox
• TC’s static IP has been added to the DMZ on the LiveBox

Results

• TC connects to the LiveBoX with an IP allocated by the LiveBox
• The TC’s primary WiFi fails (presumably because it has no DHCP and is set to ‘create a wireless network’)
• The TC’s secondary (Guest) WiFi fails (again, it cannot use its own DHCP to allocate IP addresses within the range selected.

In this configuration, the TC is actually doing nothing except as a network storage device (which is its least important role).

Unless I am missing something, I am concluding the ONLY solution will be if Orange can offer a PPPoE connection option (you called it ‘authentication’). If they can, then the question is, can the LiveBox be configured to allow this. If not, and I suspect this (as I have taken yet another in depth look at all the LiveBox configuration options), then the question is, what device can offer me PPPoE. Answer, the TP-Link model that you identified.

The irony in all of this is that I am trying to replace my reliable satellite Internet service with regular ADSL and, were it not for onerous data constraints with the satellite provider, I would stick with satellite. The ADSL Livebox was sold to me as offering 12 Mbps but, I can barely achieve 3.5-4 Mbps; so we have our challenges whichever way this goes.

Is there anything else that I can try?

Sorry our time differences are making this a very long process.

The TC’s primary WiFi fails (presumably because it has no DHCP and is set to ‘create a wireless network’)

This should have worked.. and this is the place where you need to put your efforts.

DHCP is provided by the Orange router.. a bridged TC works to provide AP service only.. it does not need to provide DHCP.

Try again.. this time spend the time on the wireless setup of the TC.

Create a wireless network is correct. It should have a different SSID (wireless name in apple speak) to the Orange router.

Try using very short name with no spaces and no non-alphanumerics.

In fact please follow all the instructions in this. My standard how to get TC to work.

Start from a factory reset. No files are lost on the hard disk doing this.

Factory reset universal

Power off the TC.. ie pull the power cord or power off at the wall.. wait 10sec.. hold in the reset button.. be gentle.. power on again still holding in reset.. and keep holding it in for another 10sec. You may need some help as it is hard to both hold in reset and apply power. It will show success by rapidly blinking the front led. Release the reset.. and wait a couple of min for the TC to reset and come back with factory settings. If the front LED doesn’t blink rapidly you missed it and simply try again. The reset is fairly fragile in these.. press it so you feel it just click and no more.. I have seen people bend the lever or even break it. I use a toothpick as tool.

N.B. None of your files on the hard disk of the TC are deleted.. this simply clears out the router settings of the TC.

Setup the TC again.

Then redo the setup from the computer with Mavericks--Yosemite--ElCapo. (MYELCAP)

1. Use very short names.. NOT APPLE RECOMMENDED names. No spaces and pure alphanumerics.

eg TCgen5 for basestation and TCwifi wireless name.

If the issue is wireless use TC24ghz and TC5ghz with fixed channels as this also seems to help stop the nonsense. But this can be tried in the second round. ie plan on a first and second round of changes to fix this.. hopefully.. I will point out other steps that can be round2.

2. Use all passwords that also comply with 1. but can be a bit longer. ie 8-20 characters mixed case and numbers.. no non-alphanumerics.

3. Ensure the TC always takes the same IP address.. (ok, you did this and it works if you can access the TC disk)

you will need to do this on the main router using dhcp reservation.. or a bit more complex setup using static IP in the TC. But this is important.. having IP drift all over the place when MYELCAP cannot remember its own name for 5 min after a reboot makes for poor networking.

4. Check your share name on the computer is not changing.. make sure it also complies with the above.. short no spaces and pure alphanumeric.. but this change will mess up your TM backup.. so be prepared to do a new full backup. Sorry.. keep this one for second round if you want to avoid a new backup.

5. Mount the TC disk in the computer manually. (Don't worry in your case if your problem is wireless).

In Finder, Go, Connect to server from the top menu,

Type in SMB://192.168.0.254 (or whatever the TC ip is which you have now made static. As a router by default it is 10.0.1.1 and I encourage people to stick with that unless you know what you are doing).

You can use name.. SMB://TCgen5.local where you replace TCgen5 with your TC name.. local is the default domain of the TC and doesn't change.

However names are not so easy as IP address.. nor as reliable. At least not in Yosemite they aren't. The domain can also be an issue if you are not plugged or wireless directly to the TC.

6. Make sure IPv6 is set to link-local only in the computer. For example wireless open the network preferences, wireless and advanced / TCP/IP.. and fix the IPv6. to link-local only. Do the same for ethernet if you use it. This one is very important.

There is a lot more jiggery pokery you can try but the above is a good start.. if you find it still unreliable.. don't be surprised.

You might need to do some more work on the computer itself. eg Reset the NVRAM/PRAM/SMC.. has helped some people. Clean install of the OS is also helpful if you upgrade installed.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7306452?answerId=29202159022#29202159022&ac_cid=ha123456#29202159

Tell us how you go.

The other part of this is to give me screenshots of the setup of your TC so I can see what you have done.

You can also try the static IP method. I have good results with it.

In your case you can set the TC to IP 192.168.1.151 and use 192.168.1.1 for gateway and DNS but also use your ISP as secondary DNS.

Set DHCP to 192.168.1.152-200 and I always prefer to shorten the lease time to 1hr as it helps keep things updated faster.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5981989?answerId=25135547022#25135547022&ac_cid=tw123456#

Hello again and many thanks. Before I embark upon another complete reconfig, may I just confirm some fundamentals? Even if I get my TC's main WiFi to work (using DHCP from the LiveBox), I will still not have a Guest network, will I? This is really important to me as we have a holiday homes business where I offer our guests WiFi access and I do not want them on the same WiFi as my own (private) network. I already own multiple Airport Expresses which (in this scenario) would allow our Guests access to the full network (printers, my Air Play speakers etc) which we wish to keep private!

I have posed this same question to the Orange LiveBox forum here in France. The single reply I had was this :-

You either need to use bridge Mode (which I will not do) or you need to buy a simple ADSL modem (which you also suggested) and that I then use the login credentials provided by Orange to access the internet using PPPoE.

Quite why the Sagem modem cannot operate in PPPoE mode escapes me !!!?????

Have I summarised this correctly?

Thanks again my friend, I owe you one !! (or more)

Regards, John

Even if I get my TC's main WiFi to work (using DHCP from the LiveBox), I will still not have a Guest network, will I?

That is correct.. no Guest network in anything but full router mode.

Quite why the Sagem modem cannot operate in PPPoE mode escapes me !!!?????

It can but Orange has removed that functionality.

One of our big ISP in Australia has started using Sagemcom modems.. and we are finding them difficult.. for a while we had sufficient access to bridge them but it was removed by the company when they heard of it. But the solution is not difficult.. a cheap generic modem will work just as well.

Have I summarised this correctly?

Yes..

The solution you are going to use.. guest network on the Airports is not a particularly good one for a number of reasons.. extremely slow guest wireless speeds is one. Although I sure agree that guests should not be able to download your full capacity which is poor.. what the apple routers over the guest network will offer is really poor so test it yourself.

It is not that difficult to buy a second router and set it up as wireless AP for guests.

I tend to recommend routers that offer better controls.. with the TC bridged and still using the sagemcom as router you can still use its wireless for your guest.. if you have some QoS in it. Or plug the second router.. just a cheap one with good wireless into the sagemcom.. eg a TP-Link C5 and set its throttling ability.

Hello again LaPastenague

So, again, I am trying to distill this and another (small) spanner is lobbed in (😁) namely the relative inefficiency of the Apple AEs! I wasn’t aware of this and have used them successfully without any noticeable impact upon network speed. In any event, even when I can get this working through Orange ADSL I am still only seeing 7Mbps which is a far cry from the 20Mbps suggested and the 12Mbps that my postcode suggests I will achieve😠

No matter, I have drawn a small sketch of the network that you are now suggesting. Follow on questions will be whether to locate the terminal powerline adapter at the main Apple TC ( I have 2) as now; or site it at the Orange LiveBox, which will provide the DHCP and routing?

Here is my setup using the current Satellite modem to which I connect my TC using simple DHCP; and it works perfectly! https://www.dropbox.com/s/mmgwzh62lq4se4d/Network%20for%20Les%20S%C3%A9choirs%20 setup%20at%20Glebelands%20August%2012th%202015.jpg?dl=0

Here is the diagram where you will see a combination of AEs and Netgear Powerline WiFi Access points ( I am a great fan of powerline adapters!)

Meanwhile I will try to source a basic modem that will offer me the PPPoE which will resolve the whole issue.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mcyr2f7ecgoczb5/Network%20sketch%20070316.pdf?dl=0

Thank you again and, had you been in Europe I would offer you a complimentary week’s vacation here in sunny SW France on the banks of the beautiful river Lot (carp fshing!). However, I suspect you (we) would redesign my network 😉 The offer is there if it were a possibility!

Regards

John

www.les-sechoirs.com

have used them successfully without any noticeable impact upon network speed

Normally extending wireless in your setup so the guest network does tend to give slow guest wireless on the repeaters.. the main wireless and the wired one are probably ok.. Always fun and games with these things.

I am still only seeing 7Mbps which is a far cry from the 20Mbps suggested and the 12Mbps that my postcode suggests I will achieve

ADSL is always a mixed bag.. my line should give me 12Mbps but the reality is 7Mbps.. so join the club.

Post me the details of your line.. Attenuation and SNR.. do you have filters on all the phone outlets.. do you have a PSTN phone still? What about fax or alarm connected to the phone network.. all can cause issues.

Anyway post to my email if you need help with that or to the orange forum area.

Here is my setup using the current Satellite modem to which I connect my TC using simple DHCP; and it works perfectly!

Your best plan then is to immediately buy the modem and do a simple modem transplant.. so you go from Satellite to ADSL.

Here is the diagram where you will see a combination of AEs and Netgear Powerline WiFi Access points ( I am a great fan of powerline adapters!)

That looks ok.. If you have used EOP adapters and they work stick with them.

It makes no difference if they feed back to the TC or the Orange router.. whichever is more convenient.

Thanks for your offers to this poor stingray.. but my travelling days are over.. !!

🙂🙂

You can guess what that means!! I ordered a simple ADSL Modem TP-Link TD-8817 which cost me around US$15. It was delivered this morning by Amazon. Within no more than 20 minutes I was up and running with my TC in PPPoE mode using the username and pw that Orange had provided me with (in case of need). So that's it; we are back to where I was except that the satellite modem is OFF and the TC is now being connected to the Internet by this cheap and cheerful modem.

I am VERY VERY grateful to you for you have helped me more than you can appreciate.

Thank you; I wish I were able to repay you in some way.

Thanks again

John Stephen

Les Séchoirs

Clairac 47320

France